The chest of it [Archive] - Kendo World Forums

Sekhmet

9th January 2007, 06:41 AM

Yes, it had to come, but since I'm a girl I guess I'm allowed to bring this up and won't be put in a box with that guy someone called "16 year-old who wants to talk about boobs" or what is was. So, a serious boobs question. :)

Ok, the thing is, I'm now several months old in the kendo world, and I have caught a vibe from my sensei that bogu time is not too far off. Since I'm the only woman in our dojo apart from some young girls (in bogu), I hope some of you here can help me:

As I've observed the do of my fellow male kendoka, the thing obviously wasn't constructed along the lines of the female physique! The bulges going the wrong way and all that. I'm quite tall and a typical hourglass figure with a good bit on top and a long, small waist, and I don't see myself fitting comfortably into that half a tied-on barrel.

Since I've never tried on the piece, what I keep thinking is, how does it sit on the body? From the guys, the flap bit above the plastic shell thingy (ooh, this is bad - must consult glossary before posting next time) seems to sit tight-ish against the top of the chest, which is fine for them. But not for us, right, or how do you not get all squashed?

The pictures I've seen of female kendoka are mostly tiny little Asians who don't really have a problem, or else they have been slightly big Westerners and worn a gigantic do which looked completely ridiculous. I hope a huge do is not the solution to fitting one's chest inside armour, because then it can't fit the waist - or?

I'd really appreciate anyone's words of wisdom, or at least of experience, so I can make preparations for when the time comes.

Many thanks,
S :)

Nochi-no-tsuki

9th January 2007, 07:20 AM

first off welcome to the forum!
to try and answer your question:
the doh won't squash your chest as much as you think, because you tie it as tight as you need it. also, it doesn't tie flat against your chest, it ties down. ask one of your sempai if you could try their doh on after practice sometime and see how it fits, you will understand the tying method i am trying to describe better.
the doh does not 'fit' the waist, that is, it's not tight on your waist so no worries there. you're pretty much going to look a little odd no matter how you are shaped, doh is not flattering on anyone.

so don't worry, no one looks hot in a doh...except maybe Kenzan but that's neither here nor there. ;)

Neil Gendzwill

9th January 2007, 07:30 AM

I hope a huge do is not the solution to fitting one's chest inside armour, because then it can't fit the waist - or?Actually the bigger doh for women is usually to fit their wider hips. Unfortunately then it can interfere with the arm movement a little. There was a thread on this a while back but I can't find it, search function seems to be a little wacky today.

namabiru

9th January 2007, 07:57 AM

I'm also a little big in the chest (then again, big everywhere...) but all you have to do is adjust how you tie your do. So if you're more hour-glassed then just tie your bottom himo a bit tighter.

Also, the do tends to squish your boobs a bit. Not in a bad way though.

Ignatz

9th January 2007, 12:43 PM

If you have money you might consider getting a do with the taller mune, the side portion is a bit larger and might protect against wayward do strikes that would only sting a guy but can hurt gals a lot.

Unfortunately we are talking $$$

Sekhmet

10th January 2007, 02:44 AM

namabiru

10th January 2007, 08:14 AM

*Doh!* (in Homer Simpson talk...) :)

Sekhmet

11th January 2007, 12:57 AM

Yes, quite!

PhilMcLaughlin

11th January 2007, 02:33 AM

Not such a daft question (tho you can supply full details if you like ;-> )

If you have enough up top to spill over the edges of the do then Id say at least wear a sport bra to keep them under control (out of control boobies are much fun but not in a keiko context) and you may want to consider a karate style chest protector , especially as you are new to armour and dont really know how to defend yourself yet

best of luck

phil..

Old Warrior

11th January 2007, 03:11 AM

Thanks guys, that's really helpful already. Tying options sound like a solution. I was dreading women had to get a pricey, custom one, but it seems most women just wear a normal men's one?
I'll see if I can try a regular one and hope it'll do. (no pun intended!)

Thanks again. :)

This is another solution used in European fencing:

http://www.amazon.com/Budget-womens-fencing-chest-protector/dp/B0002Y9H7Q

namabiru

11th January 2007, 07:36 AM

If you have enough up top to spill over the edges of the do then Id say at least wear a sport bra to keep them under control (out of control boobies are much fun but not in a keiko context)

wow. Enough to go spilling over? Are you kidding me? Does that actually happen to people?

Bailee

11th January 2007, 01:10 PM

Spilling over....that'd be nice...except in kendo (ouch!).

I agree, I good fitting sports bra works wonders. It won't solve all the problems, but helps keeping things out of shinai range just a bit.

Sekhmet

11th January 2007, 09:05 PM

Tut-tut, I knew it was going to get someone's imagination racing. :) Well, we're definitely not at 'spilling over' levels, so I'll just stick with a sports bra and hope for the best.

As for not knowing how do defend myself yet - I'm still at the point of spontaneously apologising when I manage to get a good cut through! Ah, such a long way to go …

I'm mainly looking for women's experience of the whole chest/do clash thing, but thanks for the interest shown by the gents too in coming up with interesting scenarios, I guess.

hnicholsh

11th January 2007, 11:27 PM

I was also worried when I got my do. I am a fairly average girl with average breasts, about 5'4''. Mostly there's been nothing to worry about. The do fits fine on me and all of the girls in my kendo club (there are close to 8 of us). The worst of it is when the do cut is too high, but really sharp and you can feel it through the protector, but it's not more than a few seconds of pain.

PhilMcLaughlin

12th January 2007, 03:03 AM

Tut-tut, I knew it was going to get someone's imagination racing. :) Well, we're definitely not at 'spilling over' levels, so I'll just stick with a sports bra and hope for the best.

snip....

Well,, we only have your word that youre "quite big up top with a long thin waist" so we are just guessing based on prior expereience. You might be fibbing and in fact have a marmite jar figure ;-)

Forensically I think you should post a picture revealing salient sizing points (with an object or scale of known size in the picture) so that the commnuity can use their collective experience to estimate the degree of stickyoutedness likely to be encountered and thus offer you you more scientifically based advice.

Failing that a sports bra and fencing protector are likely to do the job - Good luck when you get your armour. Someone else made a very valid point to ask others in your dojo if you can try their kit on - its good advice - as in all kendo matters - do it, dont think so much about it

regards

Sekhmet

12th January 2007, 03:45 AM

- Aww, I love Marmite!

Anyhow, I think I'll pass on the public evaluation project. The only measurement I'm willing to share is height: 1,5 shinai! (it's a 39) :)

(Yes, I was bored of reading so procrastinated by measuring myself in shinai. Tut-tut again, for me.)

But seriously, yes, the trying seems like the best idea and will be next step. Thanks also to hnicholsh for your comment, it's really helpful.

lucy

12th January 2007, 06:25 AM

Hi Sekhmet,

I just had my second practice in bogu yesterday and I don't have any problems with the do. I didn't yet receive any hits above the do, though, only under it, on my hip bone, which isn't very comfy either. ;)

Just try it! :)

kaminari

29th January 2007, 11:35 AM

bianchi

29th January 2007, 12:24 PM

The do is made for women! It just happens that men use it upside down! :wink:

I know... Bad joke... But I'll post it anyway... :silly:

You may also take a look at this do:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiSLupMpawI

:rolleyes:

Sekhmet

30th January 2007, 12:12 AM

- well, that's actually what I thought once I started worrying about having to wear one.

I got the famous nod from sensei two weeks ago, btw, so now have to decide on what to get - but that's a whole other chapter. So are keikogis for women! Couldn't someone please set up an import business so we Europeans can get to try the bu jin ones and not drown in poofs of thick fabric flapping about our bodies and bunching about the waist. Oh well, I'll stop ranting about clothes, I guess kendo is enough of a man's sport to be ok not really making a lot of equipment for women.

Thanks for everyone's input!

PhilMcLaughlin

30th January 2007, 12:37 AM

Hello. I am a woman. I have boobage. 34D, specifically.

How do I fit a do? Chest or waist?

My dojo has a rather large selection of bogu and I really have no clue how to fit one of those - the kote are fine, the tare is fine, the men needs some work, but the do - I don't know how to fit a do to my form.

I promise not to make any smutty remarks about the guys offering a helping hand..... oh damn ! ;-)

Anyway

sit in seiza & put the tare on - someone will show you how

then as you have the advantage of a dojo with several sizes, try a few on

ideally (IMO) the sides should be about an inch away from your body & the mune (top of the front bit) at a height so that with men on, the nodo sits on he mune as a bridge to absorb some of the impact of tsuki.

most westerners bogu doesnt fit this well though, so dont worry about it too much as you wont be receiving much tsuki as a beginner

The sides under your arms shouldnt impede the cutting movement

if your not wearing sports kit (even if yu are ) you may have issues finding a comfortable fit - so try a few & get advice from the seniors in the club

likely problem areas - do sitting on your hips so not moving, boobs sticking out the sides & hence vulnerable to a missed do cut

good luck !

bianchi

30th January 2007, 01:02 AM

Well... Most Kendo Keikogi seems fine for women... They have high a tie so most girls don't have to use anything over the bra before the keikogi... And the "poofs of thick fabric flapping about our bodies" can reduce the effects of being hit outside the bogus protection, and that happens more than we like...

Cheers!

satsumaruma

30th January 2007, 01:07 AM

I don't know if this advice will help but it may do.

A few years ago when I was also doing Judo one the female judoka had huge boobs - no idea how big but they were noticeable even in judogi. As you can imagine they could really get in the way for doing judo - much more so than kendo I guess - so the lady in question borrrowed a technique from african olympic runners. She strapped them down with bandage before every session - this held them in place and protected them from knocks etc. It also 'flattened down the shape' to some degree.

Funnily enough boobs can get in the way in iaido especially on such forms as Tsuka Ate where the sword has 'rest' on ones chest. If you're built like Pammie this puts the sword at the wrong angle:rolleyes: :silly:

Solinde

31st January 2007, 10:27 PM

Funnily enough boobs can get in the way in iaido especially on such forms as Tsuka Ate where the sword has 'rest' on ones chest. If you're built like Pammie this puts the sword at the wrong angle:rolleyes: :silly:

I remember the awkwardness of learning tsukaate for this very reason - placing the sword on the boobs does not feel very samurai-ish. :wink: But, after trying for a while now to figure out in what way the angle would be wrong and not really getting it I must ask: care to elaborate? I can see that the thrust would be strange in the way that it seems it would be moving from the victims arm to his solarplexus, but how would it affect the angle? Am I misunderstanding? (Apart from being inunderstandable. :wink: )

satsumaruma

31st January 2007, 10:53 PM

Sorry Caroline,

angle was not the best 'word' to use - I was just being lazy 'cos I was in a rush. I should have put something like ...if you are built like Pammie you miss the target when you made the tsuki.....

This is in reference to the fact that Ms Anderson is noted for being amply buxom and if she placed the swod on her chest and tsuki'd from there she would be wide of the target:cheeky:

Even more worrying would be old women doing Tsuka Ate - if they place the sword level with their chests the tsuki might stab the rear oppon ents ankles:silly: :silly: :silly:

satsumaruma

31st January 2007, 10:56 PM

[QUOTE=Solinde;231835]I remember the awkwardness of learning tsukaate for this very reason - placing the sword on the boobs does not feel very samurai-ish. :wink: QUOTE]

Just re-read your post and noticed I missed this comment.

Are you saying you ARE built like Pammie?

WOWEE

In the words of Joey out of Friends ......"ow you doin'"

Right then. Back in a mo just going to get some times for flights to Sweden:silly: :silly:

Solinde

1st February 2007, 12:46 AM

Are you saying you ARE built like Pammie?

WOWEE

Well, not quite. But it still felt awkward.

(Got the angle bit now, seems we were thinking of the same thing but in different terms. Laughed at the old women's problem. :silly: )

Kuma

1st February 2007, 07:14 AM

You may also take a look at this do:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiSLupMpawI

:rolleyes:

Wow! Where can I find a sensei who can teach me that wire-fu waza? That'd surprise them at the tournament! :cheeky:

satsumaruma

1st February 2007, 08:17 AM

Well, not quite. But it still felt awkward.

(Got the angle bit now, seems we were thinking of the same thing but in different terms. Laughed at the old women's problem. :silly: )

Oh well, another dream shattered.....sigh....:wink:

Firebird

1st February 2007, 11:56 AM

I had some major problems at first...34DD. Missing do cuts gave me major bruises. But if you tough it out...it pays off. Kendo is so much fun you forget the pain! At least for me. You could also try the Shock Absorber bra (@ figleaves.com)...I got it recently and it has helped me a lot. It kind of pushes them forward but also really supports them. You could also try a really think keikogi. That takes some of the shock out of missing cuts. Goodluck! :D

satsumaruma

2nd February 2007, 11:15 PM

34DD. Missing do cuts gave me major bruises. But if you tough it out...it pays off. Kendo is so much fun you forget the pain! At least for me. You could also try the Shock Absorber bra (@ figleaves.com)...I got it recently and it has helped me a lot. It kind of pushes them forward but also really supports them.

34DD - no wonder your opponents missed with that much distraction:silly:

And you buy a device which accentuates your figure even more. have you no mercy?:silly: :silly:

Lee

Ps - I was going to offer to come over to Poland(? flag guessing) and help attend to your bruises (being a trained first aider) but that might be seen as inappropraite for these forums. Although, if you would like me to............:rolleyes:

Firebird

3rd February 2007, 02:12 AM

satsumaruma

3rd February 2007, 04:10 AM

Haha. I forgot to change my flaggie. I'm married and have a child. But nice try! Goodluck with other kendo gals though. They are the best. :D
And actually Shock Absorber stops your breasts from moving...even though they do make a nice shape. :nervous:

WAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH......

sniff......

sniff.......

sniff........

tis better to have loved and lost etc etc