View Full Version : please explain: kakari-keiko and uchikomi keiko
5th July 2002, 12:34 PM
Could someone please help me by explaining what is meant by the term "kakari keiko" and "uchikomi keiko", and what is the difference?
5th July 2002, 01:43 PM
well.. Uchikomi keiko is more of making a cut to the motodachi when he or she open up for you.. this including all sort of openning.... Men, Kote, Do, Kote-Men, Kote-Do, Kote-Men-Do, etc etc...... This helps you to take note the instant the motodachi opens up for you. It helps you with your 'eye to brain to body 'reactions and reflexs. An average passes is about 5-7 depending on each Dojo or motodachi
Kakari Keiko is similar.. but difference is you make the opening yourself, and the point is to make as many cuts as possible within the time given... also, motodachi will sometime counter attack you.. but you should not block or run away from their attack... you keep on going...
Well this is what i think, but I might be wrong,...
What do you guys think Ben, Richard, and my other senpai???
5th July 2002, 03:04 PM
qpuppy is on the correct track, but I would like to add the following clarification
Uchi komi geiko: The motodashi provides clear opportunities to deliver a cut. The student then performs the cut with correct form, kiai, follow through and zan-shin, speed is not as important as performing correctly. The emphasis should be on correct technique, not speed, fast is OK as long as all is correct.
Kakari geiko: Some times called continouos attack practice. The motodashi should stimulate and encourage the student, the student creates their own opportunity to cut. The student must show strong spirit. The student performs the cuts with FULL vigour and zanshin and keeps on creating the openings and attacking until the end of the exercise.
Kakari geiko will differ depending on the grade or experience level of the student, obviously a motodashi will make it more challenging for say a fit 4th dan, than for a new student.
Kakari geiko can be quite challenging physically if done correctly.
5th July 2002, 03:32 PM
so when i was in the dojo doing an exercise somewhat like the "shuttle run" and hitting "men-kotemen-men-kotemen-men" is that kakari keiko or uchikomi keiko?
and for kakari keiko, "you make the opening yourself", and so how is that different from jikeiko?
5th July 2002, 07:55 PM
I don't know what's up with this shuttle thing.
kakari geiko differes from jigeiko in the sense that it's not a bout, but an exercise. usually the moto only strikes if the student fails to show correct concentration, kiai, and vigour. Think of it as an incentive.
In Uchikomi geiko, the moto opens the targets and you strike them. In Kakari geiko, he stays on guard and you must find a suki, use seme or simply try some harai waza to get his shinai out of the way prior to attacking. Else you're going to receive a nice poke on the nodo.:rolleyes:
Our old japanese sensei makes us do about 20 passes, for about five times switching motodachi. This after a exhaustive 1:30 hour of suburi, kihon and waza practice. And after kakari geiko and uchikomi, keiko with him for about 5 minutes.:o
5th July 2002, 08:08 PM
Hi andysif, and welcome to the forum.
Firstly - nicely put Kendoka/qpuppy - well explained.
Andy - what you have described sounds like kakari keiko. As Kendoka has said, the point with kakari is speed and fluidity - it should be spirited and non-stop. Sometimes your motodachi (receiver) will get you to do a set pattern (men-hikimen-men-men etc) other times not. The "making your own opportunity" means that sometimes you may have the option to strike kote-men or plain men; therefore you determine the attack and its timing, but aim to just keep on going. Technique is not paramount. Uchikomi is more like- square off...wait...<I see, he's now offered kote>..KOTE!...etc
The main differences from jikeiko are that
a) you have a motodachi (ie you are not "equal", or doing the same things - this is not to say that motodachi doesnt have their own work cut out for them too ;) )
b) motodachi stays (largely) static, whereas you are running through in alternating directions
c) uchikomi is about single correct cuts, kakari is more about "rocking out", if you get me.
Depending on the dojo, and what is being shown, motodachi may "punish" badly/slowly done cuts by blocking/returning a cut/retracting the offered target/pushing you as you go past. As has been said, motodachi tailors this to your skill and experience. This is done to illustrate your shortcomings - but is done more to experienced kendoka who should know better :D Again, according to the dojo, motodachi may do this in either kakari or uchikomi.
Hope this helps
6th July 2002, 01:06 AM
first, i want to thank you all for all your enthusiatic responses.
but unfortunately, i am now getting more confused.
let me try to sum up what i have gathered, and correct me if i am wrong:
the main difference between kakari and uchikomi is that in uchikomi, the motodachi opens up, while in kakari you have to find/create the openings.
kakari keiko is continuous attack. So it is like the "shuttle run" exercise i described above, you running back and forth non-stop, and hitting the motodachi for every passes. but how about uchikomi? is it also continuous or is it one by one - kamae, kiai, wait and strike, zan-shin and then kamae, kiai wait and strike again?
and here is the confusing part. while david thinks that the exercise i described above is kakari keiko, and in support of that our sensei does require that the exercise should be done with speed and non-stop, thus fitting the "continuous attack" description. however, the motodachi is not gurading but rather more like just a target in the drill. in that sense, it is more like uchikomi keiko. and what is worse is that i remotely recalled that sensei had referred that to as uchikomi. so now i am totally confused.
any suggestion, gentlemen? (of course i will also ask my sensei)
6th July 2002, 01:24 AM
I think to a degree we're into differences between dojo's here. Most times I have done kakari, the motodachi has offered (and even sometimes named) a target to be hit - though obviously you could kote-men rather than just kote etc.
To use a football analogy (please dont dive in - I know nothing about football :D), I guess that in soccer training, the coach would say "ok, now dribbling practice" - but the way he does it may differ from another coach at another club.
Hope this helps!
8th July 2002, 08:28 AM
i think you got it, except for one thing. while it might *look* like running back and forth and hitting the motodachi with every pass, if that is how you approach it then your kakari geiko will lack something.
the feeling is constant attacking, not just with your shinai but with your whole body, especially your lower body. sometimes you will pass the motodachi, sometimes you will crash into them. you must focus all your energy into attacking your opponent with eveything you've got. if you do, hopefully each time time you will find you have a little more.
the difference between *attacking* and just *running* is something you will have to study carefully, as Musashi might say.
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