Romance in the Dojo

[Manslayer]

Do you have a teacher/student romantic relationship in your dojo? If so, I have 3 questions:

1. How did it start?
2. How did the people involved deal with it?
3. How is the relationship now?

[Kendoka_Han]

1. I would not look for romance in the dojo, even if....the hottest girl in the world suddenly had the hots for me, and wanted me realllllly bad, etc etc....i would still say/act/look in the ways of "no".....thats of course i will wait until AFTER the dojo ;).

[Cutie_honey]

Hey Hand Solo

You have to get to a dojo first

[Kendoka_Han]

I 110% concur.

[Togashi Yokuni]

1. I would not look for romance in the dojo, even if....the hottest girl in the world suddenly had the hots for me, and wanted me realllllly bad, etc etc....i would still say/act/look in the ways of "no".....thats of course i will wait until AFTER the dojo ;).

Just to point out...you're not exactly sticking to the point of the original post. So why even bother posting?

(This is for your own good actually...you don't want to get the Manslayer ticked off with you...believe me you don't...:ko: )

Togashi

[Charlie]

Do you have a teacher/student romantic relationship in your dojo? If so, I have 3 questions:

1. How did it start?
2. How did the people involved deal with it?
3. How is the relationship now?

I've never seen it happen between teacher and student, but have seen it happen between comrades. It seems it worked out okay - I think one couple broke up and they just agreed to be friends and have the dojo be off limits to any personal stuff.

My mother always said, "Never sh*t where you sleep," so I would be really reluctant to get involved with a fellow kenshi. (For the record, I am married to a non-kenshi.)

[MikeW]

Like Charlie said, never seen it between sensei and student but I have seen it between others. Some worked out ok, others not so good.

[bullet08]

My mother always said, "Never sh*t where you sleep,"...

thank god, i have indoor plumbing..

pete

[Seiza_Seizure]

I heard of a bust up in a Dojo between Kenshi. It got ugly and the parties all left the Club. It was a triangle theme if you know what I mean.

[pgsmith]

I saw one student/teacher affair happen. Unfortunately, they were both married to other people at the time. Both student and teacher ended up leaving the dojo. The teacher ended up going back to his wife, but never did return to training. Don't know what ever happened to the student as she just quit associating with anyone at the dojo.
To answer the questions ...
1. Extra practices.
2. Not very well.
3. Over.

The only other one I am familiar with is an instructor whose wife is also a student. It started before she started attending. They are very careful to keep anything personal out of practice. He insists on her being just another student when they are at the dojo (which I think is the right way to go!). It has worked pretty well so far.

[Bokushingu]

i have seen it happen and work well and it not work well. but i haven't seen any bad breakups. Most of te relationships in our dojo are the young early 20's so it's only natural for them to explore relationships--I just look at it as none of my business and the same thing happens in the professional arena also.
If they are adult and mature and keep it discreet &/or appropiate it's, ok.

[Knicky]

Seen it happen before. It bugs me and in the situation I"ve seen, its inappropriate feeling.

[Dervish]

"Romance of the Three Dojos" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romance_of_the_Three_Kingdoms)?

[Kenshi]

oops... posted in wrong thread.... delete

[Smakfull]

1. How did it start?
2. How did the people involved deal with it?
3. How is the relationship now?
I live with one of my sensei (he nidan, me gokyu).

1. After a year and a half of dating and later living together he talked me into kendo. Or rather, I talked myself into it.
2. It works wonderfully. We have a no-kisses-in-the-dojo-policy imposed by me :) (I don't think a relationship works in a dojo, especially not pupil/sensei)
3. We haven't argued once either in or outside the dojo, and that's probably because we have the opportunity to beat eachother with sticks on a daily basis :D

[nysamurai]

Teacher / student relationships are, generally speaking, trouble waiting to happen. And the teacher in particular should have more sense. However, if the consenting parties can keep the dojo seperate from their personal relation ship, I say more power to 'em.

[Bokushingu]

when it comes to teacher/student relationships( in the dojo), if it's a legal consenting situtation, then i feel it's ok so long as they don't make it too public or flaunt it in the dojo. teacher/student relationships should be private just like all other relationships--it really is nonone else business but the two involved.

Of course that is just my opinion and many other may find that type of relationship unethical due to the relationship not starting on mutual ground: it is only natural for a student to admire a teacher & that is what unehtical people will exploit.

[Akasha]

My partner is my kendo teacher and he has taught me since i started kendo, and we met through kendo. My ex partner is also my kendo teacher now and we started doing kendo together, who incidentally, is now dating someone of a higher grade who sits 'above' him. He's also gonna be best man at our wedding!

We are all the best of friends - beat that.

1. We were friends anyway, and had the same interests other than kendo. Starting crossing paths through seasonal work etc.
2. Very well considering it was a confusing situation for while. Nobody made it their business.
3. Fantastic! Amazing! Couldn't be happier.

We don't really have any rules of what we do and don't do in the dojo. Just the common sense stuff, like don't snog each others faces off, thats hard with a men on anyway. Obviously I don't believe in the whole teacher/student thing being wrong or taken advantage of etc. We're all adults and make our own decisions.

[Aries]

My partner is my kendo teacher and he has taught me since i started kendo, and we met through kendo. My ex partner is also my kendo teacher now and we started doing kendo together, who incidentally, is now dating someone of a higher grade who sits 'above' him. He's also gonna be best man at our wedding!

We are all the best of friends - beat that.

1. We were friends anyway, and had the same interests other than kendo. Starting crossing paths through seasonal work etc.
2. Very well considering it was a confusing situation for while. Nobody made it their business.
3. Fantastic! Amazing! Couldn't be happier.

We don't really have any rules of what we do and don't do in the dojo. Just the common sense stuff, like don't snog each others faces off, thats hard with a men on anyway. Obviously I don't believe in the whole teacher/student thing being wrong or taken advantage of etc. We're all adults and make our own decisions.

wow, thats a great to have such great relationships even after the switch ups. kudos to you all.
I can just see the romantic/comedy chick flick that you could write out of that. And if someone were to make it, we could get the guys to go since it'd have kendo in it. :happy:

[Lone Kitten]

I live with one of my sensei (he nidan, me gokyu).

1. After a year and a half of dating and later living together he talked me into kendo. Or rather, I talked myself into it.
2. It works wonderfully. We have a no-kisses-in-the-dojo-policy imposed by me :) (I don't think a relationship works in a dojo, especially not pupil/sensei)
3. We haven't argued once either in or outside the dojo, and that's probably because we have the opportunity to beat eachother with sticks on a daily basis :D

I completely agree with that. My hubby and I met through our dojo. We don't argue (well, we've not been practicing recently, so I just say "just you wait til i get you in the dojo!") and I think kendo is one of those things where if you dont have a partner who understands either that you're always going to be nuts about it or that actually does/did/understands it, you're going to be screwed. In the dojo we definately dont see each other like that... although the way we both fence means we can usually have a really good fence (to quote my sempai... "are you two getting on ok?... yes?... blooming heck, i'd hate to see you argue!").

I wouldn't suggest anyone looks for a relationship in the dojo, but if it happens i'd certaily say let it run!:silly:

[Kuroh_Okami]

Well...in my dojo there was a student/student relationship between my uncle and someone else
now they are married and have a kid and hardly come to kendo at all.

[Lone Kitten]

Well...in my dojo there was a student/student relationship between my uncle and someone else
now they are married and have a kid and hardly come to kendo at all.

Have to admit, that did happen with us!!

[Inner_Silence]

in general, my opinion ts that "you must never stick the pen in the inkpot of the office" but thats in general... in my dojo the instructor dates one of the girls, but they've been together for about 3 years now and i think they make a nice couple besides nobody has a problem with that.
in my case ive dated a girl of in the dojo once, but it just lasted about 1 month (it was about 3 years ago) but obviously it didnt worked out, she wasnt my type :p

[Bailee]

I really doubt that any student or teacher would admit to a relationship on this forum. So many dojo members just lurk. Seems like it'd be trouble just waiting to happen.

[James]

"you must never stick the pen in the inkpot of the office"

In England we say : "you must never stick the Jumbo Saveloy in the creamy Fish Batter of the chip shop".

...okay.....I made that up

[Inner_Silence]

In England we say : "you must never stick the Jumbo Saveloy in the creamy Fish Batter of the chip shop".

...okay.....I made that up

ha! you wish to be "jumbo"... as everyone else hahahaha

funny anyway ;)

[Pugtm]

Although i am by no means experienced in either love or kenjutsu i think a quote here is needed. " A sword is a weapon. Kenjutsu is the art of killing. Whatever pretty words you use to speak of it, this is its true nature." By extension a Kendo Dojo is a place to learn how to use a sword. Not a place to have romance. Of course if it's quiet i don't have a problem with it but everything has a place and time. When you are in a dojo it is neither the place nor the time. Not to mention it could distract others and other problems. One of the reasons we Jews pray separately. So that people without family or girlfriends will not be distracted. I think (even though some may disagree) that a dojo is just as holy and deserves an equal amount of respect and reverence and concentration.

But apart from all that doesn't auskf have a no relationship policy? When i joined my dojo we had to read and sign the handbook and there was a section right under the "warning we are not samurai so don't worship your sensei or commit seppuku" Section. Doesn't anyone else have that too?

[Ignatz]

. . .When i joined my dojo we had to read and sign the handbook and there was a section right under the "warning we are not samurai so don't worship your sensei or commit seppuku" Section. Doesn't anyone else have that too?

Ichimura Sensei is a real card isn't he? And not just any card in the deck, he's the joker.


. . .One of the reasons we Jews pray separately. So that people without family or girlfriends will not be distracted. . .
That is certainly one of the many reasonable explanations.

[Pugtm]

Ichimura Sensei is a real card isn't he? And not just any card in the deck, he's the joker.
Actually it doesn't say that seppuku part but I'm not joking there is a section about worshiping your sensei and a section that forbids intimacy in the Dojo.
Here's what it says:
Dallas Forth Worth Kendo & Iaido Kyokai
New Member Information Packet
4."RELATIONSHIP TO INSTRUCTOR:
"HERO WORSHIP: Refrain from indulging in hero worship. Sensei is not a god or even a superior human. Claiming your teacher has supernatural power does nobody any good.The highest praise for sensei IS respect as a teacher . Worship of a "budo saint" simplymeans you are still a child. On the other hand, if sensei starts to believe the worship,progress in the art will surely be stalled...
NO PERSONAL RELATIONSHIPS: Don't get involved with the instructor. You can't learn budo from a lover. The teacher/student relationship is not equal, but a healthy personal relationship must have equality. Rarely can you be lovers at home, teacher and student in the dojo."
5. RELATIONSHIPS WITH FELLOW STUDENTS: Be careful getting involved with other students. Budo is for life, relationships often for a week. The end of a couple means tension and discord which, when brought into the dojo, disrupts the class. Broken relationships usually mean one or both partners leaving the dojo. NO EGO. Each class will have students whose personalities clash. Students must work to prevent this. Personality clashes mean ego. The ego has no place in the dojo.
6. DUTY AND LOYALTY: Beyond these responsibilities, students have no inherent duty or loyalty to either the art or the instructor. A student must earn the privilege of being loyal to an art or a school through many years of hard work. In the old days, a samurai (or a western knight for that matter) did not have the luxury of simply giving his loyalty to any daimyo he chose, that loyalty was requested by the lord after the samurai had proved
himself worthy of the request. Paying money to an instructor does not entitle the student to the highly reciprocal duties, responsibilities and benefits of fealty."
/|\
| Thats what i call the no seppuku section for all the otaku's we get(no offense to otaku's, i personally was, or am one).

Ichimura Sensei is a real card isn't he? And not just any card in the deck, he's the joker.
Oh yeah one more thing Ignatz-san lets not get personal about sensei's.

[Alison2805]

And as Ignatz pointed out, your sensei has a good sense of humour. Put your hackles down.

Religion has nothing to do with this thread.

[Pugtm]

Put your hackles down. Religion has nothing to do with this thread.
1. I agree i was just using it as an example.

[Alison2805]

Look up hackles in the dictionary kid.

[Pugtm]

Look up hackles in the dictionary kid.
Huh? oh i thought you mispelled shackles my bad Gomen-nasai.!!

[Alison2805]

:silly: :D :D :D No worries.

[Ignatz]

I don't know, shackles are kind of exciting. In any event, I have known your sensei for a bit longer than you have Pugsly.

[Pugtm]

I don't know, shackles are kind of exciting. In any event, I have known your sensei for a bit longer than you have Pugsly.
Really? how do you know him? If you want ill tell him you said hello.

[Landorph]

well.. sex in the dojo is strictly forbidden... and no flirting in dojo.. and teachers are old.. uni students dont like old people.. ^_^

I mean.. everyones shinai are the same size... so you cant really compare can you :P

j/k

[SmellsLikeBogu]

once the bogu goes on, everyone is free game :p

about the relationships, I have no problems with that, but once you step on the floor your partner should be nothing more then another dojo member, waiting to get whacked over the head.

once you step off, have fun, but do it safely ;)

[h2o]

I really doubt that any student or teacher would admit to a relationship on this forum. So many dojo members just lurk. Seems like it'd be trouble just waiting to happen.
Uhm, there's been at least two personal accounts already.

Me and my girl are both each others students and teachers. I teach kendo and she teach iaido.
We had however been together for at least three years before we started doing kendo/iaido.

I don't see any problem as long as there is no special treatment involved.

[D'Artagnan]

My partner is my kendo teacher and he has taught me since i started kendo, and we met through kendo. My ex partner is also my kendo teacher now and we started doing kendo together, who incidentally, is now dating someone of a higher grade who sits 'above' him.


I'll expect to be called 'sensei' from you from now on then :silly: haha

no, wait, I think i would prefer 'master' or at least 'sir'...


best man at the wedding

not often those two words collide in the same sentance when reffering to me

p.s. about the actual thread I think its pretty obvious from Kim's post (hahaha I just named you on the internet :silly: ) where I stand on the whole romance in the dojo thing - basically in whatever context theres nowt wrong with it as its really nothing to do with anyone else. And for any dojo to say it's 'forbidden' is just a bit sad really, bit of an invasion of privacy too, I think...

[Bailee]

Uhm, there's been at least two personal accounts already.

Me and my girl are both each others students and teachers. I teach kendo and she teach iaido.
We had however been together for at least three years before we started doing kendo/iaido.

I don't see any problem as long as there is no special treatment involved.

Yeah...Guess I'm a little slow on the draw...Sorry!

[Magenta]

1. Our senseis are mostly the same age or younger, so of course it's interesting...Since the men is restricting your point of view , you can be very private even during practise...

2. The others never knew..

3. Didn't work out but that had nothing to do with kendo or it way it started (in practise)

[Purr]

OK, can't resist this thread, so here I go....

1 We were introduced because we both did "that wacky martial arts stuff", but we didn't practice together untill we were already a couple.

2 I think it's not a problem, my team mates and sensei love to tease me with it. In fact, I think they are way too interested in our private life!!! :mad:

3 we're still very happy with each other.

[Theodore]

Here is the ethical standard from the USOC Coach's handbook:



1.14 EXPLOITATIVE RELATIONSHIPS

(a) Coaches do not exploit athletes or other participants over whom they have supervisory, evaluative, or other authority.
(b) Coaches do not engage in sexual/romantic relationships with athletes or other participants over whom the coach has evaluative, direct, or indirect authority, because such relationships are likely to impair judgment or be exploitative.


Pretty explicit, no hanky-panky between coach and athlete. Between coachs OK, between athletes OK.

[yoda-waza]

Who knew some dojos produce good soap opera. Maybe KW should start a "Tabloid" forum.

[chidokan]

I have a student/student one at mine... they make a nice couple but he's a lazy so and so and sometimes stops her training I think...
As for me and girl students, I have a wife at home....(once bitten, twice shy as they say....)and anyway they mostly seem to be lunatics who under normal conditions you would run like hell from...:D

[Bokushingu]

Here is the ethical standard from the USOC Coach's handbook:



Pretty explicit, no hanky-panky between coach and athlete. Between coachs OK, between athletes OK.

that's a bullseye. Student are inclined to admire teachers. The natural admiration of a student can be exploited by someone with no ethics or moral boundries; however, if two consenting adults want to have a private relationship outside the dojo, it shouldn't concern anyone.

[chidokan]

I have one minor problem regarding the relationships between coaches....
everyone I know who is an instructor is a man over 50. I just can't bring myself to fancy even one of them....:D

[MikeH]

that's a bullseye. Student are inclined to admire teachers. The natural admiration of a student can be exploited by someone with no ethics or moral boundries; however, if two consenting adults want to have a private relationship outside the dojo, it shouldn't concern anyone.

Met my girlfriend in the (aikido) dojo, I was (and still am) her instructor. We're getting married next summer. From the very start we were very careful to keep our relationship in the dojo totally separate from outside the dojo. When we're in the dojo I'm her teacher, when we're not in the dojo I'm not her teacher. Additionally she is also my teacher but not martial arts, she teaches me to ride horses and about natural horsemanship. So we both teach each other really. Don't think that could be counted as exploitative. But I can see how someone could exploit such a relationship, however we were careful to make sure this wasn't a possibility. So I don't think all relationships between coach and student are necessarily bad.

Mike

[kartoffelngeist]

But you guys should see what he made her do to get her blue belt...:p

I'm still looking for romance in the dojo, need more young female members though...

[Dragon Ninja]

I dated one guy at my dojo. I just thought he was cute and I started talking to him and acted like my aggressive self. We broke up because I just stopped liking him. He would still show up to practice and we would still converse, but I think since I broke up with him, he was the one who was acting more awkward.

I haven't seen him in a year, but apparently he just came back to the dojo (I'm taking a kendo break because of injuries).

Went out with another kendoka, but from a different dojo. I fell for him while doing kodachi kata #3--his forearms were MMMMMM delicious :)

I was never into senseis or kohais, but SEMPAIS on the other hand...:-D

[chidokan]

I get loads of young female students who turn up for our first lesson, then seem to leave after a short period of time.
I suppose it could be our club t-shirt slogan..." I have a three foot long weapon". They must be disappointed due to the fact that I won't let them play with mine, or the fact that some of the lads only have a short one at 30 inches.

One other thing.... I often wonder about why girls want to play with big weapons for long periods of time.... :confused:

[Andoru]

I haven't seen a relationship between sensei and student, but I've witnessed several relationships in the dojo. Some well, some not so well, but their relationships were never an issue in the dojo.

[subygal]

Well my partner used to do kendo and has talked me into it (and I was intrigued) and he has just come back into the dojo after a long absence - no issues here - as we have been together for 2 years before this anyway :)

He makes a great teacher :D

[JoDuncan]

But you guys should see what he made her do to get her blue belt...:p

I'm still looking for romance in the dojo, need more young female members though...

Man, a seeing-eye-dog would make a great shiai ally.

...you don't actually expect any girls with 20:20 vision to fall for you do you?!?! :p

...but then again sometimes blind people get hightened senses of smell; you are screwed.

[samurai999]

i remember my sensei from northern cal always wanting to start a womans team, but always jokingly complained about inter-dojo romances ruining things leading to them getting married and the woman getting pregnant. Therefore, he never gets the opportunity to start one. :D

[Another_kenshi]

I never dated anyone from kendo. But I do know lots of sucessful stories

A) A friend of mine is kendo instructor. he practices for around 25 years. and is married with a woman for around 10 years. she started kendo 3 years ago. they are a nice couple, have that "no kiss in the dojo" policy and all

B) I know 2 guys who dates their female kendo instructor. they're both young couples around 25 years old and all. I don't see them very often, but last time I checked it was all fine

C) two senseis I know, in their 50's have their wives, in their 50's too training together.

D) and a few other student/student relationships

Personally, I don't like when it happens between students because can lead to some trouble:

When I was younger (not that I'm old...) there was this couple, a guy and a girl (duh) both friends of mine and around the same level.
During a shiai I tsukied the guy fiercely and hit his neck...twice.
The girl was all angry with me. and they didn't speak with me for around a month...

[satsumaruma]

I don't see why people who share an interest shouldn't be allowed to get it on together just so long as they are not actually doing anything overt in the dojo.

Its up to an individual to decide who they go out with. We've had it in our dojo before and it has not been a problem.

[Another_kenshi]

There was also this girl who was a bit interested on me and was a bit interested on her but...
not only she was my student but she was a bit too young for me, around 20 years or something. A student/instructor relationship wouldn't look nice, and with a 10 years difference would look worse...

I decided not to continue and I told her I already had a girlfriend...(yeah, it's a lie but...)

[Kenzan]

Went out with another kendoka, but from a different dojo. I fell for him while doing kodachi kata #3--his forearms were MMMMMM delicious :)


This guy must make you hot.

http://www.moah.org/exhibits/archives/movies/images/popeye.jpg
:D

[satsumaruma]

There was also this girl who was a bit interested on me and was a bit interested on her but...
not only she was my student but she was a bit too young for me, around 20 years or something. A student/instructor relationship wouldn't look nice, and with a 10 years difference would look worse...

I decided not to continue and I told her I already had a girlfriend...(yeah, it's a lie but...)

Personally I think you should not be too bothered about what others think of such things. If you like her and she likes you then that should be enough for others to accept. If they cannot accept it then they are not worth knowing.

And ten years difference doesn't mean anything unless you want it to - so long as you are both consenting adults.

[sid]

so there were 2 senseis(both nidan) behind the same girl (5kyu)...the girl got a lot of stuff like bags,watches,etc ....both expected a reply from her.... fought each other harder each time in keiko

and then the girl said i want no romance in the dojo...

all are still regulars at the dojo....but give ample chance for us to pull thier leg...:smiley:

P.S:-
sometimes beginners are just more matured than u expect :laugh:....

[Ignatz]

One, f the many good things, about being senior is that the spread between ages doesn't mean as much as it does when you are younger. For instance, my son (going on 35 yrs) mentioned that if he went out with a girl half his age he was flirting with prison time but if I did it no big deal.

Another most important thing is that when I was younger I pursued women because I had to, now, if I do, it is because I want to. It easy now to just enjoy someone's company. (but I'm not dead, of course:laugh:)

[Inner_Silence]

One, f the many good things, about being senior is that the spread between ages doesn't mean as much as it does when you are younger. For instance, my son (going on 35 yrs) mentioned that if he went out with a girl half his age he was flirting with prison time but if I did it no big deal.
nowadays girls become woman much younger, anyway in my unified theory on girls, a girl really turns in to a woman when she is about 30, before that they THINK that they are woman but they are not



Another most important thing is that when I was younger I pursued women because I had to, now, if I do, it is because I want to. It easy now to just enjoy someone's company. (but I'm not dead, of course:laugh:)

true. in this age, hormones rule your logic...

[Inner_Silence]

so there were 2 senseis(both nidan) behind the same girl (5kyu)...the girl got a lot of stuff like bags,watches,etc ....both expected a reply from her.... fought each other harder each time in keiko

and then the girl said i want no romance in the dojo...

all are still regulars at the dojo....but give ample chance for us to pull thier leg...:smiley:

P.S:-
sometimes beginners are just more matured than u expect :laugh:....

so typical....

[absenteekendoka]

My ex and I started Kendo together many years ago now...and both had been progressing well. All except our relationship, which fell apart after I began seeing one of her friends on the side ( Yes, I know it was assinine.....years ago I was quite a different guy)

We officially broke up one Wednesday.......but both of us still went to Kendo that night........Sensei was unaware of our issue ( as her and I had agreed not to let anything interfere with our kendo)

It was a nice idea....but when she got her bogu on and proceeded to do keiko with me...well lets say she was very spirited about it! :) My head was rattling for about two weeks after that..LOL!! Now, however we get along pretty well.

Romance in the dojo can work....it is however subject to all the same issues as romance outside of the dojo.

[Inner_Silence]

I had a similar experience. too bad the girl couldnt touch me in keiko wich made her even more... ehm... "annoyed" ... I could have let her hit me, but that way it would have lost all the funny part

[Toshiro Mifune]

I've seen the good, bad and the ugly. I think the people who have the most success are those that can separate their relationship and personal lives. You can hug or kiss whatever when not practing but ultimately you should take your practice seriously. Depending on many different factors dojo romances can affect the dojo or clubs dynamic. Me personally I don't care who people date in the dojo just don't bring any drama during practice. :pirate: