Question of Etiquette?

[Craig Jones]

I am very interested in learning a new kamae (nito to be precise) but I dont know if it is appropriate for me to ask if I can switch. About two years ago my sensei offered to teach me Jodan but at the time I was not confident enough in my basics (distance, timing, footwork, etc) or in my abilities with Chudan, to take on a different kamae. My skills and confidence have grown since then and I would like to switch, but would it be appropriate for me to ask?

[moocow65]

You can ask, it's just a matter of whether your sensei will let you. Or you can be like me and just start nito without asking my sensei for permission. HAHAHA.
It depends on a number of factors:
1. How long have you been doing kendo?
2. How well do you understand the basics of kendo?
3. How well do you understand seme, timing, etc.
4. How much confidence does your sensei have in you?
5. Are you willing to COMPLETELY throw away seigan? never ever ever ever use seigan again.
6. How much dedication are you willing to put into nito.
7. A whole bunch of other factors.
Let's say he lets you practice nito. Who's gonna teach you? Jodan and nito are similar, but also very different.
I believe that it's always Okay to ask for permission. If he does let you practice nito, be prepared. It's gonna be extremely hard.

[Old Warrior]

As strange as this may sound it is the absolute truth. Ten months ago Master Seong took my 39 shinai from me and returned with a shoto and a 37. He said "You learn". Ever since that day I became the one nito person in the dojang. He has given me a nito version of every technique and if there is none - he has me do something else.

Now, I'm too old to ever be any good, but my bouting skills have vastly improved and thus my enjoyment of kendo is even greater. Because of the language barrier I still have no clue as to precisely what was on his mind, but he has sure made the pursuit more interesting and satisfying.

[mystic_kendoka]

wat is seigan?

[Shazzanzzz]

As strange as this may sound it is the absolute truth. Ten months ago Master Seong took my 39 shinai from me and returned with a shoto and a 37. He said "You learn". Ever since that day I became the one nito person in the dojang. He has given me a nito version of every technique and if there is none - he has me do something else.

Now, I'm too old to ever be any good, but my bouting skills have vastly improved and thus my enjoyment of kendo is even greater. Because of the language barrier I still have no clue as to precisely what was on his mind, but he has sure made the pursuit more interesting and satisfying.

Any reason behind your sensei making you switch to nito? something physical?

[Old Warrior]

All I can say is that I'm old guy with losts of fencing and close quarters combat experience. I have very bad knees and I will never be as quick as my classmates. He must have figured I could catch on quickly and become a problem for Kenshi who did not see nito often. While I am hardly becoming a rising Kumdo star, I am sure enjoying the journey.

[nodachi]

wat is seigan?

Sometimes it seems like people use the words chudan and seigan interchangeably.

However, seigan is actually a little different. It is a little higher than chudan. For example, instead of pointing at the throat like in chudan, you point at the persons eyes. My apologies if this explanation is a little off, but unfortunately I haven't practiced Ittoryu since leaving Japan and that is where I learned and used the seigan that I am trying to explain. Sigh... :(

I also don't know if this is a kendo/kumdo difference of vocabulary or not.

[Neil Gendzwill]

Seigan is a variant of chudan with the tip a little up and to the right. One variation is to point it at the opponent's left eye, so that all he sees is the tip of your shinai (making it difficult to judge distance/movement). If the opponent takes jodan, aim at his left wrist to simultaneously attack there and protect your kote. Shidachi's initial kamae in kendo kata #5 is seigan.

[canadasword]

wat is seigan?It is chudan in kendo.
In old kenjutsu styles, it was called seigan, literally "clear eye"...

Cheers!

[canadasword]

unfortunately I haven't practiced Ittoryu since leaving Japan and that is where I learned and used the seigan that I am trying to explain.
If you don't mind me asking, what branch of Itto Ryu and which teacher?
Just curious. Studied it too in Japan.:wink:

[nodachi]

I am not sure what branch, but I was being taught by Suzuki sensei. He came from Tokyo once a week to teach at the Chiba budokan. Sorry, I lack the kanji for his name if you need it. Super nice person. They told me he has some direct connection family history wise to the beginnings of the style or it was passed down to him. Sorry, the specifics are foggy as this was told to me briefly in a short conversation.

[Kirin]

Seigan is a variant of chudan with the tip a little up and to the right. One variation is to point it at the opponent's left eye, so that all he sees is the tip of your shinai (making it difficult to judge distance/movement). If the opponent takes jodan, aim at his left wrist to simultaneously attack there and protect your kote. Shidachi's initial kamae in kendo kata #5 is seigan.

Neil,
You are talking about hira-seigan.
When you use sword, from chudan turning/twisiting your both wrist to right, kendo kata 5 hon me, kissaki (tip of sword) points opponent's left wrist.
At this position, sword looks flat. hira means flat ----> hira seigan

Seigan is same as chudan.
(also direct translation of seigan is 'true eye' or 'straight eye')