kendo: revenge of the nerds

[budocop]

Can anyone shed some light on this not so popular subject? Some of the great Kenshi in Japan are police officers and kendo was developed by great warriors, the Samurai. Why is it that in the U.S., in general, I have noticed that most kendo players are not "warrior class". You do not find very many police officers, athletes, and only a few military members practicing kendo. Instead you find students, computer geeks, doctors, lawyers,and such. Mostly very intelligent people. I'm not saying this is bad. It is an interesting contrast in my opinion. The Japanese police do kendo (and judo/jujitsu), but here most cops choose something more "practical". If they are doing it in Japan though one would think it was benficial. Perhaps it is a matter of mindset. My observations and musings may be a result of my lack of experience. I by no means mean to offend. The truth is I have found myself feeling like a black sheep while doing kendo due to my occupational status. The entire time I am feeling this way the sensei joke and comment to me that the Japanes police are the fiercest kendo players of them all.

Thank you in advance for any responses.

[D'Artagnan]

Geek=>Anime=>Derranged Fantasy World=>Samurai Wannabe=>Kendo...


btw, from what I understand, at high schools in Japan, its usually the more 'geeky' and conservative kids that do Kendo, the cool kids all wanna play baseball. Thus it is often the case that intellectual (often private schools*) have strong kendo teams...


*in addition strong kendo players can sometimes be awarded scholarships to private education if the school wants them on the team...

[chidokan]

I often wonder how good the top guys in other sports would do if they had decided to do kendo instead of say, football or some other professional athletic pursuit.. vice versa... how well would top kenshi do at athletics?

[Charuzu]

Geek=>Anime=>Derranged Fantasy World=>Samurai Wannabe=>Kendo...


btw, from what I understand, at high schools in Japan, its usually the more 'geeky' and conservative kids that do Kendo, the cool kids all wanna play baseball. Thus it is often the case that intellectual (often private schools*) have strong kendo teams...


*in addition strong kendo players can sometimes be awarded scholarships to private education if the school wants them on the team...

For me it was:
Geek=>Anime=>Derranged Fantasy World (D&D 3.5e) =>gaming=>Kendo :p

Personally I think geeks like Kendo because while the football team wants to throw me...err... us in the garbage bin and the basketball wants to blast rap then throw us in the recyclables, the Kendo guys usually are nice and stand up for the less popular guys (and gals)

ya know what I'm sayin?

[Yoh]

Maybe im slightly delluded, but while on one hand there *is* the whole anime looking-awesome-with-a-sword-killing-people thing, i think theres another reason, too.

I think, at least a fair amount of kendo practicioners have a certain degree of respect for the sport, after all, respect between two kendoka is vital. I think it is usually the most intelligent people who can truly appreciate a sport such as kendo, not necessarily booksmarts, but emotional intelligence, which link to things like modesty, respect and discipline. The anime nerds die off eventually, if truly all they wanted to do was get their hands on a weapon and swing it around, but the people that remain, i think, hold a dear passion and respect for the sport. I believe it takes a certain degree of intelligence to respect such a poisful and almost ceremonial sport like kendo, especially if its from a culture other than your native one.

[Josh Reyer]

Can anyone shed some light on this not so popular subject? Some of the great Kenshi in Japan are police officers and kendo was developed by great warriors, the Samurai. Why is it that in the U.S., in general, I have noticed that most kendo players are not "warrior class". You do not find very many police officers, athletes, and only a few military members practicing kendo. Instead you find students, computer geeks, doctors, lawyers,and such. Mostly very intelligent people. I'm not saying this is bad. It is an interesting contrast in my opinion. The Japanese police do kendo (and judo/jujitsu), but here most cops choose something more "practical". If they are doing it in Japan though one would think it was benficial. Perhaps it is a matter of mindset. My observations and musings may be a result of my lack of experience. I by no means mean to offend. The truth is I have found myself feeling like a black sheep while doing kendo due to my occupational status. The entire time I am feeling this way the sensei joke and comment to me that the Japanes police are the fiercest kendo players of them all.


Keep in mind that most of the great police kendo players are not cops who decided to take up kendo, but rather high level kendoka who joined the police force to be semi-pro kendoka. Their "job", in effect, is to train kendo and win tournaments.

[budocop]

Great post Josh. Very interesting thought. That being the case, maybe I am working in the wrong country. How nice would it be to get paid to do kendo. Any martial art for that matter. I am sure it is challenging and they pay their dues in training.

[braxtonhicks]

I think that if nerds aren't athletes when they start kendo, they'll surely be athletes soon enough, or they'll drop out. I think you have no choice. Either sink or swim. I feel that kind of pressure at most classes. It's tough, but that's why I like it.

What's the definition of an athlete anyway? I guess I'm pretty nerdy, I play music for a living. (But I used to jump out of planes for fun too, which doesn't really fit the nerd mold) Kendo's definitely made me fitter in the few short months I've been doing it. I've dropped 15 lbs., and my cardio is way better than it used to be. I think also once you get out of school, anyone who was an athlete in school starts to look less and less like one. I know, I've been on facebook recently looking at pictures of old school friends and acquaintances.

One of my sempai's at Toronto Kendo Club told me in high school he was incredibly out of shape, and had all sorts of knee problems. One day he just said "screw it, I'm going to do it". Now he's a really scary kendoka at 5' 4", and man, he can just go and go, and has beautiful kendo, and a booming kiai. The only word is relentless. Truly inspiring. I'd say he's an athlete for sure!

I agree with you though budocop, that most people seem to be professionals, IT guys, or people with a cultural background (Japanese or in the case of my dojang, Korean descent) who were raised doing it. One dojo I was at had a few expat Japanese there which was really cool that they chose that dojo to come to practice while in Canada. I can say though, at the two dojos I've been to, not too many firefighter's, military, police. I don't think I met one.

I think I'm into it for the discipline and focus it requires as much or more than the physical side. Same as trusting in my training when my life was in my hands jumping out of a plane, or standing up in front of an audience having to nail a performance, kendo requires a mental clarity to focus and execute. At least that's how I feel 5 months in. I guess for you, the focus you need in being a first responder or dealing with dangerous life/death situations...I feel there's some kind of warrior mindset in any of those situations, albeit with different consequences.

Perhaps that mental aspect of kendo as well is why a 75 year old hachi-dan can own a 30 year old san-dan who's at the prime of their physical/athletic life.

Sorry for the ramble.

[MikeW]

From the fire-fighter and policeman I know they usually prefer to do empty hand martial arts as it is more useful to them in their jobs. Most other athletes do what they like to do and don't want to spend the time kendo takes. So basketball folks play basketball in city leagues etc instead of doing kendo. Many begin coaching kids teams and have other physical pursuits that are not martial arts related. Kendo outside of Japan and Korea is primarily done by people that have a particular interest in Japanese budo for one reason or another and do not enter it as a primary exercise regimen (in my experiences). Not all kendoka are what I would call nerdy but certainly there is a good number of nerdy types due to fascination with Japan, anime, samurais, bushido, etc etc. It comes with the territory. I personally got into kendo due to my oldest daughter about 12 years ago because she wanted me to start with her for company. It turns out I liked it and just kept doing it even after she moved away for college. I played football in high school as well as tennis, surfed, skateboarded (primarily a vert skater not a street skater), snowboard and other types of physical activities. But kendo has a nice feel to it from the mental side and I think in some ways that is what has really kept me in it rather than the physical aspects. Oh, and I have never been overweight (I'm 5' 10" and right now I am as heavy as I have ever been at 165 lbs.) or what people generally call nerdy. Probably more of a nerd now than ever before actually lol! Perhaps kendo turns people into nerds instead of the other way around ;)

[Gideon]

I am aware of many, many police officers in the states who are nowhere near 'athlete' status much less 'warrior class' - whatever that is.

If you're at practice, you're at practice and go from there. Who cares if they're a nerd or an all star athlete. I'm starting to think there's a bit more over-generalization about the otaku out there taking up kendo and ruining practice for everyone else, and kendo, and the world in general. I suppose if it keeps one up at night though... :P

[James]

To agree with what Josh and D'Artagnan said most people starting Kendo in the West are still starting as adults, whereas most people here are starting at schools, or earlier. My kid had his first lesson (in a police dojo) when he was 3yrs old.
Also not all schools have strong budo or even kendo teams, it depends on the school. (Although that is changing).
Therefore after the Police, the second strongest people at kendo tend to be University or college instructors drafted into places with strong kendo traditions - they can also end up being kind of semi-pro. Third is probably companies with the tradition such as Mitsubishi, whose budokai I was invited to a couple of years ago and they were big enough to take over the Nippon Budokan with inter-departmental tournaments, kendo, karate, iaido even kyudo.
Most of the good kendoka here were strong at School/University and it helped them land their job where they mainly look after the University's or Company's kendoka in a semi-pro role.
Final point, since most start at school another factor is the parents, some families are budo families and so their sons and daughters are following in their parents path, as such these kids are often from families where reigi etc is more observed and so these kids can come across as more reserved etc. (more polite) than kids from baseball families.

[LowFatMat]

The weight of history and tradition surrounding kendo must also add to it's intellectual appeal - you can go away and read books about kendo/budo etc. Proper books with chapters and that.

[rainmaker]

Historically, in my personal opinion, most Samurai doesn't need to be tough and macho people. In order for you to fight smarter, you need a samurai with brain. As you already know, Miyamoto Musashi was very intellectual person too. Come to think about it, how often do you remember any dumb and strong character in history ? Except Samson....

Also, most of Japanese and Korean polices are not carrying guns with them. Even though some policeman carries them, they rarely use them. Instead they often carrying police baton as main weapon. When anyone(including suspect) try to resist to police, they try to enforce them with martial art, so they put high priority with judo, taekwondo and kendo. So they have been more emphasize in hand to hand combat then other technic.

Korean police uniform
http://img5.epochtimes.com/i6/51117180300628.jpg
http://i.blog.empas.com/bhnbh5677/26209880_393x326.jpg

Japan police uniform
http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/images/news/photos/2008/04/25/japan-torch-getty-80854905.jpg

[Fallen]

Can anyone shed some light on this not so popular subject? Some of the great Kenshi in Japan are police officers and kendo was developed by great warriors, the Samurai. Why is it that in the U.S., in general, I have noticed that most kendo players are not "warrior class". You do not find very many police officers, athletes, and only a few military members practicing kendo. Instead you find students, computer geeks, doctors, lawyers,and such. Mostly very intelligent people. I'm not saying this is bad. It is an interesting contrast in my opinion. The Japanese police do kendo (and judo/jujitsu), but here most cops choose something more "practical". If they are doing it in Japan though one would think it was benficial. Perhaps it is a matter of mindset. My observations and musings may be a result of my lack of experience. I by no means mean to offend. The truth is I have found myself feeling like a black sheep while doing kendo due to my occupational status. The entire time I am feeling this way the sensei joke and comment to me that the Japanes police are the fiercest kendo players of them all.

Thank you in advance for any responses.

Personally I think that the idea of nerds starting only is a misconception. We've had all kinds of people join the dojo from Hairdressers, Geologists, Welders, IT guys etc, etc. I think the key thing that keeps "warriors" away are that they do not exist as such. Most people who are police, in the military and the like work jobs which have schedules that do not coincide with western training times... remember japan offers far broader training timetables. As others have said, the fact the japanese have alot of kendoka in the Police has more to do with them doing kendo and getting jobs because of their talent more so than their stereotype.

[J Mettler]

Part of it could be availability. I don't know about other areas of the country, but where I grew up in northern Minnesota (specifically the Embarrass and Virginia area of St. Louis county) there were no dojos or high schools that offered it. The closest dojo that I was able to find was in Minneapolis. (A 4 hour drive for me at the time.)
If the situation is the same in other parts of the country, then more conventional sports or martial arts would be more widely practiced. Perhaps if there was a greater exposure to kendo more police or other professions (really, more people in general) would actively practice it. The police I grew up around played in softball leagues, or bowling, or boxing because it's what they liked from what was available.

[Paburo]

i think in spain there is a fair share of policemen who do kendo.... lots of IT's yes, but lots of lawyers as well :D :D i'm not sure what's worse....

actually the hardcore geeky type doesnt last much in kendo. as soon as they find out kendo is not like in anime and we dont actually practice with ancient japanese flaming swords they just quit...

doctors and nurses in the dojo are always a plus, so best not to complain in that area... :D :D

[Kenzan]

-Because being intelligent means we look for unique experiences which will stimulate our minds and bodies, rather than just going with the crowd.

[H.Sandsleth]

What is so intelligent by doing things that are seen as accepted/nice/good by your own crowd of people? Not much.

[Kenzan]

What is so intelligent by doing things that are seen as accepted/nice/good by your own crowd of people? Not much.

Perhaps it is because most intelligent people have difficulty finding common ground with most, in not any, "crowds."

[Omnis]

No Star Wars nerds here? I was exposed to Kendo from a video game on sega genesis, and later, things like star wars and animes like samurai champloo made me remember kendo. That's how I started researching it and how I got into it. Most people don't do it here just because they haven't been exposed to anything remotely like it. Most of the people I know like kendo when they understand what's going on. The only thing is they just can't see tbe selvles doing it. It's the same kind of thing where people like watching the NFL but would never put the pads on to go play for the team.

[Kenzan]

No Star Wars nerds here?

The last three films pretty much nailed the coffin on my fanboy-ism in that regard.

[Omnis]

The last three films pretty much nailed the coffin on my fanboy-ism in that regard.

Lol. I'm more of a fan of the "universe" than the films.

Anyway, I was going to edit this in, but my time expired: I think you see more "nerdy" types doing kendo in the US because they don't have the cookie-cutter social model to conform to. Nerds are more used to constructing their own culture, so it's no big deal that starting kendo is something that is unusual or can be viewed as eccentric.

[Kenzan]

Lol. I'm more of a fan of the "universe" than the films.

Anyway, I was going to edit this in, but my time expired: I think you see more "nerdy" types doing kendo in the US because they don't have the cookie-cutter social model to conform to. Nerds are more used to constructing their own culture, so it's no big deal that starting kendo is something that is unusual or can be viewed as eccentric.

Out of hand, I reject the categories.
The truth is, people from all walks of life study Kendo, and for a variety of reasons.

[hl1978]

Man I got into kendo because of some movies I saw as a kid in the 80's. For example the movie "Aloha Summer" which takes place in the 60's and has a lot of surfing. The evil kid from karate kid 2 was in it and studied kendo with his father.

[michaelm]

I do it for the chicks!




(can't believe I beat Neil to that one.)

[Anonymous]

I do it because its fun. That, and its actually way cheaper than some of my other hobbies like paintball and judo once you get past getting your own bogu.

[Charles Lockhar]

actually the hardcore geeky type doesnt last much in kendo. as soon as they find out kendo is not like in anime and we dont actually practice with ancient japanese flaming swords they just quit...

At first I disagreed with this statement, as I think I'm a pretty hardcore geek/nerd kind of guy. But I think my disagreement was a matter of definition: the hardcore geeks and nerds I know are way too serious to see much value in anime fetishism. That's a whole 'nother type of oddball...

-Charles

[Charles Lockhar]

What is so intelligent by doing things that are seen as accepted/nice/good by your own crowd of people? Not much.


Perhaps it is because most intelligent people have difficulty finding common ground with most, in not any, "crowds."

I'm going with Kenzan on this. It's not about being different in the same way everyone else is being different, which is essentially just chasing fashions.

Heh, of course, I could be stretching it a bit involving myself in any discussion regarding intelligent people. But I will say that within my "primary clique" of friends, kendo scores me no points.

-Charles

[LowFatMat]

We don't only get nerds at our place. There's also geeks, weirdos and freaks.

Only joking of course.

Hope none of them read this.