Kendo and Kenjuitsu

[Cat]

How close are these two arts together. If one trains in Kendo, can you switch for the shinai to a sword and make the transition? Or, are they two very different arts, and is Kendo not as much about swordmanship as Kenjuitsu? I'm curious how close they are in teaching of mind and sword or if they're drastically different. Thanks in advance.

[Wookiesmurf]

My experience so far has been that while the techniques are sometimes (very) different, many of the underlying principles are the same.

[Cat]

I'm curious, I'd like to do some looking around about Kenjuitsu. Are there any schools in Boston or North of Boston that teach this type of sword art?

[satsumaruma]

I'm curious, I'd like to do some looking around about Kenjuitsu. Are there any schools in Boston or North of Boston that teach this type of sword art?


If you wish to do Hyoho Niten Ichi Ryu kenjustsu there are sword schools north of Boston that could help.

Alas for you they are north of Boston, Lincs, Ingerland and I am quite sure you meant Boston, Mass, Americashireland.

But if you are that keen you can always emigrate to over here.:surprise:

[Toecutter]

I'm curious, I'd like to do some looking around about Kenjuitsu. Are there any schools in Boston or North of Boston that teach this type of sword art?
I believe Doshikai teaches kenjutsu on Wednesday night. Off the top of my head ScottUK would be able to tell you much more about any similarities as I don't practice kenjutsu. I'm sure there are more on this board that practice it just scott pops into my head first. If you're interested Doshikai is in Acton which is the dojo that I go to. It's kind of a haul for you but feel free to contact them, the website is down right now for some reason but here (http://www.doshikai.org/) is the link.

[Cat]

Thanks for the link, unfortunately, it doesn't seem to work. Do you have any other way I can get the info? Thanks again.

[ScottUK]

It's kind of a haul for you but feel free to contact them, the website is down right now for some reason but here (http://www.doshikai.org/) is the link.Google has a cached copy (http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:SIY1RWSFWv4J:www.doshikai.org/+doshikai&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=firefox-a) of the website.

[Cat]

Thanks, tried it but this was the message: The requested URL was not found on this server.

[Cat]

BTW, what about Guard Up in Burlington, MA?

[Toecutter]

Thanks for the link, unfortunately, it doesn't seem to work. Do you have any other way I can get the info? Thanks again.
The site might be down for maintenance but I'm not sure. I believe the email is info@doshikai.org but I'll double check that for you on Monday when I see everyone. The class Wednesday is Iaido 6:30-8:00 and kenjutsu from 8-9:30 I think. I might have the times reversed but I think those times are correct.


EDIT
Just saw the burlington thing. I have no knowledge of them, but their website looks like a mcdojo. If you're just starting out I would at the very least visit some dojos and see which ones you like and make sure they are members of AEUSKF.

[ScottUK]

Toecutter, what style of kenjutsu do you guys do?

[ScottUK]

BTW, what about Guard Up in Burlington, MA?I would ask them what they do and then report back here!

http://www.guardup.net/sword/ajapanesesword.html

[Toecutter]

Toecutter, what style of kenjutsu do you guys do?
I'm not sure I only do Kendo and Iaido, Wednesday class is a different sensei so I don't have a lot of info on it other that knowing him, he practices Iai as well. I've always wanted to try it out but there are only so many hours in the day so to speak.

[Cat]

Thank you for the help people. I'll try emailing. BTW, I've asked Guard Up about it. I think they do have Kendo and Kenjutsu according to their web site, in addition to fencing of course.

[ScottUK]

Thank you for the help people. I'll try emailing. BTW, I've asked Guard Up about it. I think they do have Kendo and Kenjutsu according to their web site, in addition to fencing of course.Unless you know what it is you are looking for, you may not realise exactly what they are offering. Ask them:

What style of iai and kenjutsu they offer
What grade their teacher is, and where he was graded

Koryu (i.e. traditional and genuine) kenjutsu is pretty rare in the U.S. but gendai (modern) schools are everywhere. In a lot of people's eyes, gendai kenjutsu doesn't exist and is in fact, just a series of sword techniques created by someone for the sake of it - unless, of course, the creator of said gendai art has a very good understanding of Japanese swordsmanship under his belt.

Once Guard Up have replied to the 2 questions above, drop us another line and let us know what they have said.

[Cat]

Thanks for the info. I wouldn't have thought to ask this as I know nothing about Kenjutsu myself. I'll ask and see what they say.

[Toecutter]

Thanks for the info. I wouldn't have thought to ask this as I know nothing about Kenjutsu myself. I'll ask and see what they say.
I would be curious as well on their kendo, just make sure to ask if they are AEUSKF accredited.

[babayaga]

Unless you know what it is you are looking for, you may not realise exactly what they are offering. Ask them:

What style of iai and kenjutsu they offer
What grade their teacher is, and where he was graded

What Scott said, ++. I see red flags in things like their focus on youth parties, LARPing, and "adventures." And the fact that they're looking for sales representatives, and are more concerned about getting along with kids than swordsmanship experience for instructors: http://www.guardup.net/sword/positions.html

Seems about right for LARPing and chanbarra. I'd be surprised if they are affiliated with the kendo federation.

[Kenzan]

Little known fact:
Kenjuitsu is much superior to Kenjutsu.

The twirling techniques are just....just...
just great.

[John Seavitt]

Doshikai's web site is back up as far as I can see. They have an (excellent) affiliated kendo program as well as an iai curriculum that starts with seitei and progresses to koryu (Muso Jikiden Eishin-ryu), perhaps at the inclination of the instructor and the experience of the student. There is a aptly named 'bujustsu' program which is probably still some Tenshin Shoden Katori Shinto-ryu derived kata work. There's probably no formal affiliation, though in fairness the instructor has some excellent body mechanics to teach, as well as a good exposure to seitei jodo. The latter probably is not being taught at the moment, but things change.

There's a couple of other programs directly affiliated with various Muso Jikiden Eishin-ryu branches nearby; I'd probably start with Boston Iaido (google-fu works).

Guard Up! wasn't so affiliated with anyone some time back, though that may well have changed. I wouldn't count on it, and there's plenty of kendo in the broader Mass/NH area anyway. Search this forum for details.

John

(http://www.akban.org/wiki/index.php/Tenshin_Sh%C5%8Dden_Katori_Shint%C5%8D-ry%C5%AB_%28%E5%A4%A9%E7%9C%9F%E6%AD%A3%E4%BC%9D%E 9%A6%99%E5%8F%96%E7%A5%9E%E9%81%93%E6%B5%81%29)

[Cat]

Their reply:

Hello Laura

Thanks for your interest in Guard Up. I got some answers for you from one of our instructors.

We have an Adult Japanese Sword Class on Tuesday nights at 7:00pm. It is primarily a Kendo class, but the last Tues of the month is "interpretation night," when they cover kendo, iaido, and kenjitsu kata. They kenjitsu styles they cover include Komagawa Kaishin-ryu, which is based on Shinkage-ryu.

Our instructors are not currently ranked, but have many years of experience. Jeff (the Tues night instructor) has taken 1st place at an All-East Kendo tournament.

You're welcome to try a free introductory class, just let me know and I'll book that with the instructor. We would have you arrive a half hour early for an introduction with the instructor.

Thanks again, hope you can give a visit!

[Cat]

Little known fact:
Kenjuitsu is much superior to Kenjutsu.

The twirling techniques are just....just...
just great.

I thought they was no difference expept with the spelling, much the same way there's no difference between Kempo and Kenpo.

[ScottUK]

An interesting koryu choice - I assume he has either practiced with Tetsuzan Kuroda - or learned his techniques from YouTube. ;)

However, as their primary practice is kendo, the lack of affiliation with the AUSKF is concerning. I would avoid. :(

[Cat]

I kind of got that impression myself...bummer. :(

[Oroshi]

They are not affiliated with Kuroda Tetsuzan, according to his website: http://www010.upp.so-net.ne.jp/shinbukan/

As they do not have approval from the leader of the school, and he specifically states that you can only learn his school at the listed approved locations, they should be avoided for kenjutsu as well.

[ben]

Nothing wrong with kids' parties and LARPing, so long as you know that is what you're getting into. Sounds like these people are upfront about what they do, and their lack of affiliation. That makes them OK in my book.

I don't mind people making stuff up for fun. I DO mind people making stuff up for profit and to inflate their own egos. The latter will rarely tell you their stuff is made up, but will shout the fact that they were ranked 10th dan by the Super Soke Hall of Fame Pty Ltd.

Just my opinion, which, as everyone knows has the same value as the money you paid for it. Or less.

b

[Jung_Yul]

EDIT
Just saw the burlington thing. I have no knowledge of them, but their website looks like a mcdojo. If you're just starting out I would at the very least visit some dojos and see which ones you like and make sure they are members of AEUSKF.

I find it amusing that they offer bogu on their site shop: http://store.sportswordstore.com/kendoboguarmor.html

Notice that it's only listed as "top quality," with no mm listed? And for just shy of $500 US? I'll stick to kendoshop and e-bogu, thanks. ;)

[Bucho]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOpM-ThMJ20&eurl=http://www.guardup.net/sword/videos.htm

check out around 2:21

[hl1978]

Sounds like they want to cover the full spread of sword styles.

We have a local fencing school which is interested in the same sort of thing run by a Russian Master of Sport (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honoured_Master_of_Sports_of_the_USSR) r who also has a number of other sword styles taught there (historical european etc). Its a very large facility, about 13,000 square feet or so and they were looking to bring in kendo as well.

[Toecutter]

check out around 2:21
Hmmm there's something missing, but it's only like half the kata and where's the kendo?

[jjcruiser]

I think that news story will be pretty useful in showing what they are and aren't; and it didn't sound to me like the guy being interviewed was saying they are more than they are. Their focus appears to be on fun safe games for kids with foam swords.

[Hank]

Cat, if you're interested in kendo at all, you're close to Shodokan dojo in Salem, which has a great kendo group (with a few members on here). Really a good opportunity. As for iai, I'm partial to Doshikai in Acton (seitei and MJER) because I go there, but I know there's at least one MJER-only group in the Boston area.

[Paikea]

I thought they was no difference expept with the spelling, much the same way there's no difference between Kempo and Kenpo.Sometimes, our friend Kenzan's wit is more subtle than new forum users can detect...