ChibaBogu

[Andoru]

Noticed on KW's front page that a new online bogu store, ChibaBogu.com, will be opening soon. It says on the website that its flagship product is the machine-sewn Mine bogu. Is there a link between that one and the Mine made by Mitsuboshi?

[Masahiro]

possibly, I'd support evidence showing connections between Mitsuboshi and the new Chiba budogu company.(seeing as to how Mitsuboshi textile link is on their website) I suspect their quality should be quite good. Nevertheless, my favoriate will be "Moribudo". Do I hear a 2nd?

[Hai_hai]

Hmm, well the 2004 Mitsuboshi Budougu catalog is chock full of rich-boy show-off goodies. Just lovely.

[Alex]

Mitsuboshi are the suppliers for Chiba Bogu. So it is the same bogu.

[Andoru]

So desu ne.....thanks Alex!

[slidercrank]

The Mitsuboshi Mine bogu sold by Chiba Bogu is already being sold in the US by Eguchi as the Mitsuboshi Pitch bogu, Pitch being Eguchi's English translation of the Japanese word Mine. A bit puzzling of a translation, if you ask me.

Anyway, Chiba bogu's product explanation of the Mitsuboshi bogu is a lot better than Eguchi's, which reads like an advertisement for a witch potion. That is to say, a lot of promises without explanation.

[cst]

The way that looks up close on eguchis website...i dont know about spending $2000 for it... I dont care how utilitarian it is designed to be...It really looks cheap...

[Masahiro]

The way that looks up close on eguchis website...i dont know about spending $2000 for it... I dont care how utilitarian it is designed to be...It really looks cheap...
I 2nd Cst-san's opinion! But I've also noticed the men and doh looks pretty nice, it's the kote and the tare(especially the tare, goodness!) that doesn't look too impressive.

[Hai_hai]

I 2nd Cst-san's opinion! But I've also noticed the men and doh looks pretty nice, it's the kote and the tare(especially the tare, goodness!) that doesn't look too impressive.

Yes, it's a deterrent for rich-boy show-offs. I guess... 8 lines of embroidery on the tare is the minimum?

[Masahiro]

Yes, it's a deterrent for rich-boy show-offs. I guess... 8 lines of embroidery on the tare is the minimum?
8 lines on the tare? hai hai that is so like 3 years ago. hello? do you keep up with the fashion trend in kendo? let me keep you up to date. the newest crave now is to look for the decoration on the mae-obi, such as how many shades of blue make up the decoration on your mae-obi,(yeap the more the better!) and if you really want to show off you can even have the tare himo laced with gold stiching. now that's "over-kill"!


>>WARNING: the above messege is intended only for joking purpose, please do not attempt this in your life time! Seriously discretion is adviced!

[Kirin]

Mitsuboshi makes excellent bogu.
This Chiba Bogu is located in Katsuura Chiba (1/2 miles away from 'budai' - Kokusai Budo Daigaku, International Budo University-.........) and they will only be dealing online.....(means longer shippment)

As I said many times, if you want cheap, metalic Iroc do from korea, thats fine...but if you want good quality japanese made bogu w/ reasonable price,
no one can compete against Eguchi if you are in USA....especially their perosnal service and superb after-care!

I bet this bogu shop will have very tough time against Eguchi eventhough they carry same line of bogu.

[DCPan]

Hi everyone,

I tried e-mailing info@chibabogu.com.

Mr. Komoto replied very promptly with another e-mail account because for some strange reason, my yahoo server is asking him for authentication from his @chibabogu.com account in order for the e-mail to pass through.

I didn't even know yahoo-mail had such filtering function???

Anyone, help?

P.S. Their service and level of customization is excellent, btw.

[Kingofmyrrh]

`pitch` isn`t actually their translation of `mine`. They use the same word in japan as well, to describe a product within the mine range. It refers to the diagonal stitching, or so I`m told...

[streetcleaner]

P.S. Their service and level of customization is excellent, btw.

it must be excellent. $2000 for the 6mm machine stiched bogu... it MUST be excellent!!!

[Alex]

I have a set. I also have 2 sets of hand stitched bogu. The set of 'Mine' that I have is superior to my hand stitched sets in every way. I guess it is the materials that are used. To be honest, I was shocked at how machine made bogu could be so comfortable and resilient. I notice that even a lot of top level police like Eika, and Miyazaki also use it, so that must say something.

[DCPan]

it must be excellent. $2000 for the 6mm machine stiched bogu... it MUST be excellent!!!

Funny…

Seriously, I was curious enough that I actually made an international call to Japan to discuss this further with Mr. Komoto. According to him, some members of the Japanese team actually wore the “Mine” while competing at Worlds.

The famous Ishida sensei also wears a Mine for regular practice and competition now, as well as several famous persona as Alex mentioned.

As discussed in Kendo Nippon, April 2004 issue, there’s a misperception that closer-stitching is “better”.

For example, I wear 1.0bu bogu right now. The way hand-stitching is done, the bogu exterior surface has these bumps that are raised by the stitching method. Now, imagine bubble wrap…wouldn’t you think there is a margin of diminishing return with “tighter” bumps?

Also, as the stitching gets tighter, the bogu gets STIFFER…frankly, I’d go for 1.2bu and 1.5bu…but as it was a gift, my mom was pretty insistent on getting me the “best”…and no way I’m complaining about that, though I did try to convince her to save money and “just” get me a 1.5bu…for my credit. :rolleyes:

Good bogu should be soft and flexible (for molding to your body contour) as cloth WITH high point-pressure resistance…that’s true good bogu…with flexibility to spread the impact…think old steel car vs. new car with regenerating bumpers….

Similar misconceptions involve the ashi on the komune of the doh. There’s a misperception that sanbon-ashi (3-leg embroidery) is “better” than nihon-ashi (2-leg embroidery) because it cost more. It cost MORE because of more labor…that’s different from better. You should pick a komune consistent with your TORSO length…if you have long torso, you’d want sanbon-ashi…if you have short torso, you’d want ippon-ashi…simple.

Now, something more on topic, Chiba Bogu’s service.

Mr. Komoto speaks perfect English.

He allowed me to pick EVERYTHING. I picked the width and length of the men-futon, with their recommendation of course.

I was able to pick the material of the grill (dura-aluminum, titanium, or IBB).

I was able to pick the ago embroidery pattern, the ago trim color and style (green flower, brown flower, blue indigo plain), color of kazari (cord embroidery) and color of thread used to stitch kazari on, the thread color used to stitch the “tenchi” (the top and bottom base of the men ring).

I was also able to ask them to adjust the men-ring width so my glasses can be worn underneath. They are going to tightly stitch the men-ring near the mono-mi, so I don’t have to wear an over-sized men like the one I have currently.

It was simply custom to the end! They even offered to match it to my previous 3mm set exactly stylistically, if I send them digital pictures. I had another design in mind, so I didn’t take it up…but WOW!!!!

To top it off, I got all this with a huge sticker price difference from another place that didn’t offer any of this customization, yet cost more (I calculated everything, including shipping and handling cost).

Truly, I have NEVER had a more pleasant shopping experience…and I do shop around!

I look forward to getting my new MINE men.

[Hai_hai]

...He allowed me to pick EVERYTHING. I picked the width and length of the men-futon, with their recommendation of course.

I was able to pick the material of the grill (dura-aluminum, titanium, or IBB).

I was able to pick the ago embroidery pattern, the ago trim color and style (green flower, brown flower, blue indigo plain), color of kazari (cord embroidery) and color of thread used to stitch kazari on, the thread color used to stitch the “tenchi” (the top and bottom base of the men ring).

I was also able to ask them to adjust the men-ring width so my glasses can be worn underneath. They are going to tightly stitch the men-ring near the mono-mi, so I don’t have to wear an over-sized men like the one I have currently...
Basically, you picked a rich-boy show-off bogu.

[DCPan]

Basically, you picked a rich-boy show-off bogu.

LOL!

Actually, I picked all indigo trim...so, it'll be plain as can be, with "batten" X-Kasari instead of an embroidery pattern. Mr. Komoto called it the "work horse design".

Besides, Hai Hai, you wouldn't feel so poor if you had more KOKORO.

:rolleyes:

[moetl]

hi DC Pan,
i really enjoyed reading your post. it was very informative ^^

i am about to purchase bogu and was thinking to get the s-17 set (http://www.bogubag.com/Bogu/Machine_5mm/machine_5mm.html) from koei.
i chose this set, because
* it's supported with sorbothane on the men and kote (i expect this to absorb shock very good ^^)
* cost is distributed as it's often recommended (as much money on men and kote, less on do and tare)
* has deerskin palms on kote (nowhere else, so no rich-girl-show-off bogu :D)
* and 4.5mm stiching seems appropriate to me

it costs about 500USD, the utter most i would like to spend on bogu.

since the question of whether close stiching is good has recently turned out to be negated i am even more convinced to buy this set.

do you think sorbothane padding pays it's price?
what do you think in general about this set?

thank you all for comments in advance
and sorry for hijacking the thread ^^

[JSchmidt]

For example, I wear 1.0bu bogu right now. The way hand-stitching is done, the bogu exterior surface has these bumps that are raised by the stitching method. Now, imagine bubble wrap…wouldn’t you think there is a margin of diminishing return with “tighter” bumps?
That all depends. With tighter bumps, there's more bumbs to absorb the impact.
In any case, this is an interesting thread, especially as I'm planning to buy a new men within the next couple of months. (And yes, it will be a rich-boy show-off men)

Jakob

[DCPan]

hi DC Pan,

since the question of whether close stiching is good has recently turned out to be negated i am even more convinced to buy this set.

do you think sorbothane padding pays it's price?
what do you think in general about this set?

thank you all for comments in advance
and sorry for hijacking the thread ^^

Hey, no problem :wink:

Honestly, I've not had the chance to use bogu with sorbothane inserts stitched into the futon like the KOEI sets. So, I don't have an opinion on that.

I am currently using an external sorbothane men pad underneath my men though. It seems to work great.


That all depends. With tighter bumps, there's more bumbs to absorb the impact.

Jakob

But the pressure per area of the contact changes the dynamic of the strike.

Also, you could be sacrificing flexibility of bogu for it.

There's no one right answer for this, btw.

After all, the MINE bogu is designed to be at that stitch width with different layers of materials.

So, I don't want people to think that one stitch width is definitely better than another.

The craftsman and materials used will change how the whole thing turns out.

With some materials, you'd probably want close stitching to achieve a certain effect.

I'll let people know what I think when I've actually had a chance to wear it!

[JSchmidt]

But the pressure per area of the contact changes the dynamic of the strike.

Also, you could be sacrificing flexibility of bogu for it.

There's no one right answer for this, btw.
Well, there probably is a right answer, but it would take a lot of experiementing, something I can't afford :).
We've got a couple of people in our dojo, who have just ordered from Hakkado..I'm looking forward to seeing them...I'm sort of leaning that way in the moment. What's the production time on your bogu from Chiba?

Cheers,

Jakob

[DCPan]

Well, there probably is a right answer, but it would take a lot of experiementing, something I can't afford :).


No kidding!

However, my suggestion is that not everyone wants the same thing anyway.

Some people think bogu should be this way while others think they should be that way...etc.

Similarly, optimum stitching width may different, depending on whether you are stitching mosen, sorbothane, etc....



We've got a couple of people in our dojo, who have just ordered from Hakkado..I'm looking forward to seeing them...I'm sort of leaning that way in the moment. What's the production time on your bogu from Chiba?


How did you do that? Do you have someone who speaks Japanese facilitating the order?

I was originally leaning toward the A-1 Tokuren Men from Kanagawa Hakkodo. But the ease of getting info from Chibabogu and the other vendor won me over.

I didn't even see the A-1 Tokuren Men listed on their website from Kendo Nippon.

I'll get a production time estimate soon...I thought it was something like 30 or 60 days...

[Kent Enfield]

do you think sorbothane padding pays it's price?
what do you think in general about this set?I have sorbothane in my kote and men. I'm not sure which set they're from. When I purchased my bogu, essentially I said, "Sensei, here's how much I can spend. What's the best combination I can get?" and he got it. I know I have 4mm kote and a 5mm men. In the four years I've had the set, I can't remember ever experiencing pain when struck properly on the kote buton, where the sorbothane is. Across the knuckles or across the joint proper still hurts of course. Occasionally, I get my bell rung when people strike men, particularly if they strike deep. You can definitely tell the difference when they strike past the sorbothane. On the other hand, I'm fairly tall, so people don't strike over the top of my men very often.

The only downside of my kote is that the kote buton is *very* stiff. That isn't much of a concern though, because they fit well and that part of my arm doesn't bend anyway.

[JSchmidt]

How did you do that? Do you have someone who speaks Japanese facilitating the order?
Yes. We had a rep from Hakkado come over 3 years ago (Who actually joined our practice a couple of times) and since then our Japanese sempai has taken care of the orders. I bought their #7000 hakama and keiko-gi and even after 3 years, it barely shows any sign of wear.
It's only recently, however, that we've started ordering bogu through them.

Jakob

[moetl]

Kent Enfield, thank you very much for your reply! was it a set from koei?

further comments welcome ^^

[Kent Enfield]

Kent Enfield, thank you very much for your reply! was it a set from koei?Sorry, yes it is.

[Hai_hai]

I just downloaded their catalog. It's all expensive. Looks good. Perforated kote palms, interesting idea.

[Genshi]

Yes. We had a rep from Hakkado come over 3 years ago (Who actually joined our practice a couple of times) and since then our Japanese sempai has taken care of the orders. I bought their #7000 hakama and keiko-gi and even after 3 years, it barely shows any sign of wear.
It's only recently, however, that we've started ordering bogu through them.

Jakob
Hello, Jacob. Is there a Japanese website for Hakkado? I would like to check out their products.

[Taek]

Yes, nice catalogue and nice looking bogus but hmmm......over 200.000 yen for 6mm machine stitched bogu!!?? I'm sure it must be very good since already many good kendo senseis and sempais guarantee the quality but bit hard to change the general perception of what good bogu has been -you know all that 1 bu and 1.2 bu handstitched.

[DCPan]

Hello, Jacob. Is there a Japanese website for Hakkado? I would like to check out their products.

Kanagawa Hakkodo (http://www.kanagawahakkodo.co.jp/)

[Keith Hong]

Does anyone know if there's a way to contact the company on-line(an e-mail address or such)?
I would like to get in touch with them to ask them about their A-1 men and kote but can't call them on the phone cause I don't speak any Japanese.

[Keith Hong]

Apparently, the website www.kumdotv.com carries the full line of Samshin's bogu.
There's no mark up in price either, from what I see(I have Samshin's printed catalogue).
On the home page, there's a submenu for shopping mall. Click, and on the left side menu, fifth from the top, it says bogu sets in Korean.

[hammock]

DCPan:

I was just wanting a follow-up on your Mitsuboshi Mine Bogu. How is the quality, and do you feel it was worth the money paid? What was the subtotal for the entire set including shipping?

[DCPan]

DCPan:

I was just wanting a follow-up on your Mitsuboshi Mine Bogu. How is the quality, and do you feel it was worth the money paid? What was the subtotal for the entire set including shipping?

Hi,

I have not received it yet, though they should be shipping it soon.

I did not get a complete set. I only got the men.

As for the subtotal, the quotes will vary depending on your physical size and the options you choose (i.e. I chose IBB-Titanium Grille).

More will follow....

[Preacher]

I must admit te Chiba gear looks good, but pretty pricey!

[Andoru]

David - I look forward to your review.

Mind telling me how much the men is? My email is broken_shinai@yahoo.com.au

Arigato gozaimasu!

[Kingofmyrrh]

Just to counter the Mitsuboshi loving, thought I`d throw in a word about the Hakkodo A-1. Received mine a couple of weeks ago, and was incredibly impressed. Super light, but doesn`t hurt to get hit at all, even with people who use super-heavy shinai. Stylish too. The `wings` are super soft, which means that rich boy show-offs will be able to make it into any shape they want. Highly reccomended. Bought some A-1 kote as well, I was so pleased with it.
btw, Hakkodo have a pair of kote in their catalogue for 493000yen! That`s about 2400 pounds just for a pair of kote! They`re waiting for haihai to drop in...

[Swissv2]

take a picture of that bad boy :D

[hammock]

wooo~~
those A-1's look nice.

Are the Kote's deer leather? In the head, are they foam or hair?
How did you go about ordering from this company?

From the pics, doesn't look like there is much leather on the trim, looks more like cloth. For some reason, i like that more :puzzled:

[streetcleaner]

is there a A-1 set or only kote? i cant find A-1 set on there web site and can't read japanese. can you please tell me the number or exact link?

[Hai_hai]

is there a A-1 set or only kote? i cant find A-1 set on there web site and can't read japanese. can you please tell me the number or exact link?
Kakko ii!!!!
http://www.kanagawahakkodo.co.jp/picts/normalA-1kote.jpg
http://www.kanagawahakkodo.co.jp/item.html

[Hai_hai]

...How did you go about ordering from this company?...
I don't think they are expecting to do international orders from non-Japanese speaking customers because their website is designed to send to Japanese addresses. You could call their telephone number and order, if you can speak Japanese or have a friend who can.

[streetcleaner]

thanks hai hai, but what about do and prices? i can find only a-1 kote in their web-shop

[Hai_hai]

thanks hai hai, but what about do and prices? i can find only a-1 kote in their web-shop
In Japan, some companies only make a men, kote, tare set because these parts are made in a special way since they are sewn. Any do could fit into the set. Any self-respecting rich-boy show-off would, of course, have a collection of do (e.g. urushi, kiji, same) so one wouldn't need another one.

I would say the Koei S-24 parts are a better deal, and they speak English. But if you must know...
A-1 kote: 21000 yen.
A-1 tare: 27500 yen.
A-1 men: 37000 yen.
A-1 steak sauce: 400 yen.

[Swissv2]

A-1 kote: 21000 yen.
A-1 tare: 27500 yen.
A-1 men: 37000 yen.
A-1 steak sauce: 400 yen.

not getting any insects on your A-1 slathered steak during a picnic: Priceless

[streetcleaner]

thanks hai hai :)

[Kingofmyrrh]

I`m not sure about the stuffing. Yes, kote are orizashi (all fabric, no leather). Palms are leather. The left palm has little `dimples`, looks a bit like ostrich leather (it`s not, of course) to give a firmer grip on the shinai. You may have seen similar tsukagawa. The main feature of A-1 is that it`s `jissengata` or `for real fighting` (can`t remember whether the `sen` is `fight` or `application`. whatever). This means that it is made with minimum weight, while maintaining protection, in mind. Hence the orizashi kote, since deer leather is heavy. This probably means that the stuffing is not `traditional` either. I know that the men stuffing is a new material developed for the product, but I can assure you it doesn`t fall down in terms of performance. Incidentally, although appearance doesn`t appear to have been their priority, I happen to think they did alright on that front as well...
Incidentally, although I don`t own it, you really have to hold the tare to believe how light it is. It`s a joke.

I used to be a bogu traditionalist, but when I realised that using new technology gave tangible benefits with no real downsides (well, I don`t mean like that fake leather white kote palm they make, not a fan of that), I didn`t look back. These days I would buy tezashi to own a piece of craftsmanship, not for practical reasons. A-1 and Mine are even said to fit to the head quicker than tezashi. Seems to be true as well.

[JSchmidt]

A-1 men: 37000 yen.
37.000 yen for the men?..Light, protects well and soft wings?.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Just curious, how long did they take to deliver?
(Unfortunatly my friend no longer deals with Hakkado, but I might try to make him revive it just to get this men!)

Jakob

[Andoru]

Got to say - my eyes are laid on that Mine men!

[Hai_hai]

I just read up on Chiba bogu's description of the kote. What's with this "extra" padding provided in the kote? Why isn't that included on all kote? I can understand the option for extra left kote padding for jodan homies. Why don't they make kote heavily padded so one doesn't have to resort to kote protectors? Just my 2 cents.

[Kingofmyrrh]

took them a month to make it. I don`t know anything about delivery as I went to pick it up myself. However, in their magazine ads it always says that they only make for people who come to the shop or get introductions. However, given that neither of these is particularly practical for you in London, they might make an exception.

[JSchmidt]

Thanks..I kind of including production time into 'delivery'..sorry for not being clearer.
I checked with our bogu-person yesterday and they do still order from Hakkodo, so we might be able to sort it out.(I did notice that it isn't in their catalogue) Otherwise I'll have to wait until October when I get to Japan again :).

Cheers,

Jakob

[hammock]

Hi Jakob,

Do you think it is possible to PM the contact info for the rep you mentioned?

[JSchmidt]

Hammock, unfortunatly it's all friend-through-a-friend etc...although I'm sure if you were practice regularly at Wakaba in London, it could be sorted ;-)

Jakob

[Andoru]

Has anyone used or seen the kote from the Mine set?

[Swissv2]

DeathbyKendo on these forums has. He highly recommended the kote

[Andoru]

DeathbyKendo on these forums has. He highly recommended the kote
Just to clarify that it's the kote from the Mine set rather than the hand-stitch set right?

[Swissv2]

check this Andoru
http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/showpost.php?p=51283&postcount=9

I believe you should ask Kirby himself.

[Kent Enfield]

How did those of you in the US who have ordered from Chiba Bogu handle payment?

[Andoru]

Thanks Swissv2.

Kent Enfield: credit card.

[DCPan]

Hi Kent,

I used the good old plastic...there's more service charge from a bank transfer...on both ends.

They mailed the men out last week...can't wait to try it out!

:rolleyes:

[Kent Enfield]

Did you e-mail them your credit card info or what? If so, how do you keep it secure?

[Andoru]

I faxed them my detail.

[DCPan]

I faxed them my detail.

Ditto.

They want your signature and credit card secure code on the signature strip anyway....not e-mailing that anywhere....

:confused2

[Hai_hai]

Ditto.

They want your signature and credit card secure code on the signature strip anyway....not e-mailing that anywhere....

:confused2
Do you have a digital camera? I would like to see your new men.

[DCPan]

Do you have a digital camera? I would like to see your new men.

Yeah...will post when I receive it...it's on the plane right now...hope it passes through customs quickly :rolleyes:

[Kingofmyrrh]

This month the pitch men was the pick-up product in Kendo Nihon. Yeah, pretty nice... but I`m a hakkodo man now! Can`t be switching my allegiance ;-)
Anyway, I`m keen to hear about it.

[Kent Enfield]

I faxed them my detail.Ah.

Now I'll have to see if I can finagle sending an international fax from my department's office.

[DCPan]

Another day after work. The men didn't arrive.

Got my stuff quickly and was heading off to iaido when I noticed a box sitting by the door.

"My men is here?"

Wife: "Yeah, didn't you see it?" :confused2

"Did you see me yell and scream?"

Wife: "No..."

"Then I didn't see it when I came in did I?" :devious:

Wife: "I thought you had zanshin..." :smoker:

Okay, I got ripped, but the men is here!!! :rolleyes:

I'm in love!

Okay...

Just the packaging alone impressed me.

I've purchased stuff from at least four other vendors, and also purchased stuff for members of my previous dojo in Taiwan. Usually, the box is stuffed with newspapers for packing.

Not Chiba Bogu! All bubble wrap!

Looked pretty mundane at first, but once you hold it...

It is soooo light!

The futon is very flexible yet firm!

Look at how naturally it sits on the floor WITHOUT having broken it in yet.

I had to train my 1.0bu men and my previous 3mm men for a long time before it would sit like that!

My new Mine Men (http://f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/dcpan2000/album?.dir=/9861&.src=ph&store=&prodid=&.done=http%3a//f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/dcpan2000)

Can't wait until Friday practice to give it a test drive!

I tried it on, and the MONO-MI was perfect!!! The tightly stitched section on the mono-mi also allowed me to wear my glasses without it being oversized, like my current men. I'm seriously considering Chiba-Bogu's offer to resize my current men for me...especially now.

I couldn't see if my head stuck out...so I asked my wife to take some photos for me.

The back of my head sticks out more than 1 cm...but it doesn't feel front heavy...I''ll know more when I actually get hit....

The only thing that was kind of tacky was that there's red letters of "IBB" running down the vertical bar where the mono-mi is...but I can live with that if that's the only problem!

I really haven't had a men fit my face that nicely on the first try. I wonder how the fit will be after a few practices. My head probably won't stick out as much once the men-ring molds to my face more.

It is truly love at first sight. I don't know if I'll ever buy hand-stitch bogu again...at least not for practical reasons!

Still starry eyed....

P.S. I'll take more photos later when there's better lighting...besides, with dial-up, it'll take me forever to load these photos!

[hammock]

Congratulations!

did you get the diagonal stitching? (i can't tell from the pictures)

[DCPan]

Congratulations!

did you get the diagonal stitching? (i can't tell from the pictures)

No I didn't. I had the option, but Mr. Komoto said that the default Mine Men doesn't use Naname-Sashi. So, I just went with the default...didn't wanna mess with the design you know ^_^

When and if the rest of my 3mm set fails...I will probably be buying the rest of the Mine set piece-meal! ^_^

I'm eager to see if anyone wears a A-1 Tokuren men...it'd be interesting to note the differences, but that one is naname-sashi.

FWIW

[Swissv2]

DCPan, if you want, and you have a CD burner I can post the pictures up for you ;) I have plent of webspace, or can put it anywhere you want. I work at the university.

[Kingofmyrrh]

I found it pretty amusing to read your review, because if everytime you came across the word `mine` you replaced it with `A-1` then it would basically describe how I felt when I got my new men. That even includes my head sticking out the back slightly! I don`t have a digital camera so I can`t take photos, but it appears that perhaps the men-buton on the wings is slightly thicker on the mine than on the A-1. I say this for two reasons. Firstly, looking at your men sitting on the floor, it curves less under the weight (`what weight?` you say!) than mine does. Secondly, because it`s surely a physical impossibility to actually get a more streamlined look than the A-1! However, speaking more seriously, it may be a function of the naname-zashi, or my super-secret custom men-shaping technique!
I actually found someone who has one of each. I asked him which he preferred, and after screwing up his face for about three minutes, he finally settled on the A-1. However, his reasoning was that he chose a prettier stitching pattern on the throat of his A-1... so I guess we can say that they`re about the same. The one thing that he did say, which I agree with and it seems that you do to, is that tezashi has lost it`s `ease of use` crown.

[hammock]

did you get dinged much on customs?

[Andoru]

David - glad to hear that all's well mate. I'm not expected to receive mine until September. T_T Might actually get myself a pair of Mine kote too.

SwissV2: I'd like to have a look at the pictures of the A-1 too please.

[DCPan]

I found it pretty amusing to read your review, because if everytime you came across the word `mine` you replaced it with `A-1` then it would basically describe how I felt when I got my new men.

Not surprised! The A-1 is the first bogu features in the Kendo Nippon article series introducing equipment with "soul (ki)" ^_^


but it appears that perhaps the men-buton on the wings is slightly thicker on the mine than on the A-1. I say this for two reasons. Firstly, looking at your men sitting on the floor, it curves less under the weight (`what weight?` you say!) than mine does.

What weight? I pushed it down and it stayed... ^_^


Secondly, because it`s surely a physical impossibility to actually get a more streamlined look than the A-1!

I must admit the look of the A-1 in the photo is more visually pleasing...I'm still used to the visual of a closing stitching....


it may be a function of the naname-zashi, or my super-secret custom men-shaping technique!

Can you find a digital camera and share? I just shape mine around where the bogu is pre-stitched to bend...but that opens up the tsuki area too much.


I actually found someone who has one of each. I asked him which he preferred, and after screwing up his face for about three minutes, he finally settled on the A-1. However, his reasoning was that he chose a prettier stitching pattern on the throat of his A-1... so I guess we can say that they`re about the same. The one thing that he did say, which I agree with and it seems that you do to, is that tezashi has lost it`s `ease of use` crown.

If only the Mine was available when my mom got me my 1.0bu...I could have gotten two sets! (I'm sure I'm getting a lot of sympathies now).

My wife has promised that one of these years (probably another 10 years), we'll visit Japan and I can get fitted for another set (yeah I know, greedy me). I'll probably try the A-1 next.

Still drooling....

P.S. I didn't get dinged on customs...unless they are sending it separately.

[DCPan]

David - glad to hear that all's well mate. I'm not expected to receive mine until September. T_T Might actually get myself a pair of Mine kote too.

SwissV2: I'd like to have a look at the pictures of the A-1 too please.

Thanks Andoru.

The doh from my old 3mm-set has 7 broken bamboo staves.

I noticed in the handy-dandy Mine catalog that came with the box says that the Mine Bogu comes with a 60-slot simulated fiber doh...gotta start writing that letter to Santa Claus....I'll never worry about flying again if I travel with a fiber doh....

^_^

[Andoru]

Oh yeah - please take more photos of the men David! Arigato!

[Hai_hai]

shabadabadoo

[litige]

I've been shopping for my first bogu for a week now and I can make up my mind. I worked hard this summer to get money for it (750$ US max on the bogu) but I don't want to spend it on some cheap-made-in-china "3 mm" that will last less longer than a real 5mm from eguchi or other places. So I'm kinda stuck here...if anyone have a good thing to say about Eguchi, now it's the time. (reading throughout the threads...I was drooling on the keyboard with your descriptions, and the pictures).

thanks

[Andoru]

Geez mate since when is Eguchi associated with this thread besides the fact that they sell the Mine bogu set from Mitsuboshi (which is 6mm by the way and exceeds your budget almost 3 times)?

[litige]

Geez mate since when is Eguchi associated with this thread besides the fact that they sell the Mine bogu set from Mitsuboshi (which is 6mm by the way and exceeds your budget almost 3 times)?

well the thread went off pretty much with hakkado.
and I now that the mine bogu exceed my budget, but not the eguchi 5mm

[Andoru]

There are heaps of threads about quality of Eguchi bogu mate - those answer your question specifically. :)

[litige]

There are heaps of threads about quality of Eguchi bogu mate - those answer your question specifically. :)

I did the search (c'mon mate, I know how to behave ;-) ) found up not so many things, just some rich-boy show-off bogu things, like the 3 mm.

I that the service is really good, I just wanted to know if some people bought the lest costly bogu, like the 5.5mm or the 4.5mm.

[DCPan]

I that the service is really good, I just wanted to know if some people bought the lest costly bogu, like the 5.5mm or the 4.5mm.

FWIW, the upstream maker of the A-1 Tokuren Men by Hakkodo is Tada Jissen, who also makes that Eguchi special you mentioned. You can see it on the Eguchi special line link.

Why not check out the stands at major taikai and see for yourself? I believe Eguchi was up at Steveston last time.

[DCPan]

OK,

Here's my impression of the first test drive.

It's amazing how much having a proper monomi line-up makes a difference! I can see much better now than before! I use to have to tuck my chin a little in my 1.0bu...now I don't!

The chinpad digs into my underchin a little bit. That's about the only discomfort I have.

The men-ring hugs the face really well, making it feel really secure.

I was worried initially because the futon is so flexible...but the impact of the strikes feel really dampened and spread out.

It actually cushions better than my 1.0bu men with a sorbothane pad! And I'm not even wearing a pad underneath! The only thing is if people hit really deep and hard, I feel it a little...because my 1.0bu has a longer futon that has more coverage.

The men-tare is also really flexible, allowing me to go into jodan without any impedement.

All in all, it feels better than my 1.0bu nagasashi men except for where the chin-pad digs a little bit.

However, it feels incredibly comfortable for zero break-in time!!!

The other incredible part is the ago...it takes tsuki incredibly well! I think because the uchi-wa is really molded to my face well, the whole things hugs my head better.

I feel more comfortable taking tsuki in the MINE than my 1.0bu. I feel a slight pressure when getting tsukied in my 1.0 bu, but with the mine, it is just the sound and the feeling of getting pushed back...my neck doesn't feel anything!!! :)

I am really amazed. People keep talking about how good bogu should be firm yet flexible...I know I knew what that meant, but I didn't really truly feel that way until now.

I'm going to punch the tenchi in the uchi-wa as Mr. Komoto recommended...that should take care of that area that's biting into my chin.

Oh yeah, the IBB Titianium grille feels functionally as light as my dura-aluminum, but does appear to absorb shock better...

[litige]

FWIW, the upstream maker of the A-1 Tokuren Men by Hakkodo is Tada Jissen, who also makes that Eguchi special you mentioned. You can see it on the Eguchi special line link.

Why not check out the stands at major taikai and see for yourself? I believe Eguchi was up at Steveston last time.

Hakkodo is supplied by Tada Jissen? Is there a web site for Tada Jissen?

Anyhow, I was considering the Tada Jissen that Eguchi sells, by it looks too light and not protective enough, especialy the kote, and they say it is not as durable as the normal weight 4.5mm (wich I can't see on their website). Anyway, I'll keep searching for a little, if I don't find anything, I'll go with that Ugly but still maybe good 5.5mm.
Thanks for the help.

[litige]

Just browsed through the Hakkodo websites, and found a complete bogu set, machine stiched 4.5mm for 59900 yen, I can translate the page, but i'll try, maybe I can order it online, i'll check, anyone interested, they have many items, including normal Kote, and some really expensive handmade bogu (5,000$ US).

[DCPan]

Hakkodo is supplied by Tada Jissen? Is there a web site for Tada Jissen?

Yup...April 2004 Issue of Kendo Nippon....page 17, caption for the last picture of A-1 Tokuren Men.

I don't know if they are "exclusively" supplied by Tada Jissen though.

Similarly, when I called Eguchi back in 1997, Ms Nomura? said that their stuff were the same as those from Hakkodo (Tada Jissen). Obviously, their supplier isn't exclusively Tada Jissen now.

:rolleyes:

[litige]

Yup...April 2004 Issue of Kendo Nippon....page 17, caption for the last picture of A-1 Tokuren Men.

I don't know if they are "exclusively" supplied by Tada Jissen though.

Similarly, when I called Eguchi back in 1997, Ms Nomura? said that their stuff were the same as those from Hakkodo (Tada Jissen). Obviously, their supplier isn't exclusively Tada Jissen now.

:rolleyes:

Ha, I'm getting dizzy here! I saw a 4.5 on the hakkodo page cheaper than the 5.5mm of eguchi.

[DCPan]

Ha, I'm getting dizzy here! I saw a 4.5 on the hakkodo page cheaper than the 5.5mm of eguchi.

Well, if you speak Japanese, it's no issue then huh?

I've been meaning to start a thread about "what you are paying for" because buying a product involves more than just a product.

In all honesty, I'd be more than happy to pay a premium for the kind of service I got from chibabogu because they made something that fit me perfectly so I don't have to go through the trouble of rectifying something that don't fit me well.

Eguchi is also providing a service. It is up to you to decide whether their services are worth the premiums that they are charging.

Besides, it's not always easy to compare bogu because you don't know what they are swapping in and out.

Take the analogy of purchasing a car...would you know whether their air-bag wiring is with copper wire or gold wire? In the BMW 3-series, the low end use copper-wire, the high-end use gold-wire. You'll never see it, but you might need the extra when push comes to shove.

Similarly, eventhough it's from the same supplier, you will not know the specific grade of leather and cloth at a glance. The millimeter width is no basis of comparison, really.

FWIW.

[Hai_hai]

I've been shopping for my first bogu for a week now and I can make up my mind. I worked hard this summer to get money for it (750$ US max on the bogu) but I don't want to spend it on some cheap-made-in-china "3 mm" that will last less longer than a real 5mm from eguchi or other places. So I'm kinda stuck here...if anyone have a good thing to say about Eguchi, now it's the time. (reading throughout the threads...I was drooling on the keyboard with your descriptions, and the pictures).

thanks

Check out
www.e-bogu.com
www.bogubag.com
www.moribudo.co.jp

[JSchmidt]

FWIW, the upstream maker of the A-1 Tokuren Men by Hakkodo is Tada Jissen
The manufacturers name is actually Tada Sangyo. I believe Tada Jissen is the 'brand name' of the bogu supplied to Eguchi.

Jakob

[litige]

Check out
www.e-bogu.com
www.bogubag.com
www.moribudo.co.jp

checked all them, bogubag asn't got any interface I can order online, with my credit card. I don't wan't some chinese made bogu sold at e-bogu. Moribudo is well, to expensive.

[litige]

Well, if you speak Japanese, it's no issue then huh?

I've been meaning to start a thread about "what you are paying for" because buying a product involves more than just a product.

In all honesty, I'd be more than happy to pay a premium for the kind of service I got from chibabogu because they made something that fit me perfectly so I don't have to go through the trouble of rectifying something that don't fit me well.

Eguchi is also providing a service. It is up to you to decide whether their services are worth the premiums that they are charging.

Besides, it's not always easy to compare bogu because you don't know what they are swapping in and out.

Take the analogy of purchasing a car...would you know whether their air-bag wiring is with copper wire or gold wire? In the BMW 3-series, the low end use copper-wire, the high-end use gold-wire. You'll never see it, but you might need the extra when push comes to shove.

Similarly, eventhough it's from the same supplier, you will not know the specific grade of leather and cloth at a glance. The millimeter width is no basis of comparison, really.

FWIW.

That's what makes it hard.
Sorry if I confused you, I don't speak Japanese, I made a grammatical error writing "i can translate the page" it was more "I can't translate the page".

[Hai_hai]

checked all them, bogubag asn't got any interface I can order online, with my credit card. I don't wan't some chinese made bogu sold at e-bogu. Moribudo is well, to expensive.
E-bogu has mostly Korean-made bogu.

You can order with a credit card through bogubag but you place your order through the telephone.

Moribudo has bogu in your price range. Ordering is done through e-mails and payment via international wire transfer. E-mail them to get their catalog unless you are interested in a set on their webpage. The prices listed are retail and you can usually get a discount.

You can order from Mitsuboshi www.mitsuboshi-web.com if you get their catalog. Just e-mail them and ask for it. You can probably get a 30% discount but their stuff is pretty expensive and you can afford something similar to eguchi 5mm set.
Tozando is the same thing.

[litige]

See now why it's hard to choose??

[Hai_hai]

See now why it's hard to choose??
No. Just choose and let it be.

[litige]

I think i'm gonna do jsut that...before my brain blows up.

[Andoru]

http://www.eguchi.net/cart_latest_news.htm

All Japan Kendo Equipment Manufacturers Association Concerned About Lightweight Bogu

The Zen Nihon Budogu Renmei (which Eguchi Budogu & Eguchi USA belong to) has noted that recently some makers have recently begun selling unsafe kendo equipment labeled as "light weight." All kenshi, especially those who are new to the art, need to be aware that light weight alone does not constitute a good, or even a safe bogu! For example- most good kotes weight roughly 300 to 400 grams; some new lightweight kotes only weigh 200 grams, far less than what is required for adequate protection.

Look closely at what you intend to invest in. If you can't see what it is you are going to buy, work out a deal with your bogu supplier to ship the item with the understanding that you may return it (Eguchi USA honors returns, and is at many events across the US throughout the year, and can help). Look at the same equipment used- find someone who bought what you are thinking about, and ask for their opinion. Give particular attention to the men and kote, as they get the most abuse. The kote gashira should have plenty of padding, and the kote buton should be able to absorb a sharp blow. The men buton should be reinforced and provide good protection to the top of the head, and should fit so that all of your head is protected (if the buton is too short ront-to-back, the back of your head is vulnerable). And as always, whenever in doubt, ask your sensei- he or she will give you the best advice possible, as they know your style and intentions.

Keep in mind that a bogu should be chosen based on both your ability AND intended use. Eguchi USA has been warning kenshi for years to not buy based on looks & style, but based on practicality, safety, and comfort. If you are looking for a bogu set and plan on acting as motodachi often, then you ought to consider this when you purchase a bogu. If you have a tendency to get hit a lot, do more keiko and get a more protective bogu. If you are looking for the ultimate in light weight to get you through constant practices and long shiai, then a special lightweight bogu may be just what you are looking for.

The Jissen bogu set is a perfect example of how Tada Sangyo has listened to experienced kenshi who practice daily (Japanese riot police and kendo teams) to produce a bogu set tailored to their unique needs. Make no mistake- the Jissen bogu set is light, but the weight savings are designed in all of the right places. Tada has years of kendo equipment experience, and has utilized special construction techniques to make a bogu set that meets the needs of serious kenshi. Is it perfect for everyone? Absolutely not. We would not recommend the Jissen for someone who simply goes to practice to be a motodachi, nor would we recommend it to kenshi who may not yet have mastered their defensive skills. For less experienced kenshi, we might recommend our 5.5mm bogu, while yudansha-level kenshi performing lots of motodachi work may be more interested in the new Mitsuboshi Pitch bogu set. (my highlights)



Interesting....

[Hai_hai]

litige,
It sounds to me that you want to be a rich-boy show-off. That's okay. Just settle down and focus. Are you in a rush to buy bogu? Do you really want Japanese bogu? Does it bother you that Korean bogu costs less?
Now, if those questions bothers you like I think it does, you might want to consider holding off your purchase and saving more money. I wouldn't want you to be "boo-hoo" discontent. That would mean saving another $400 US. Get the S-22 from Koei.

[litige]

litige,
It sounds to me that you want to be a rich-boy show-off. That's okay. Just settle down and focus. Are you in a rush to buy bogu? Do you really want Japanese bogu? Does it bother you that Korean bogu costs less?
Now, if those questions bothers you like I think it does, you might want to consider holding off your purchase and saving more money. I wouldn't want you to be "boo-hoo" discontent. That would mean saving another $400 US. Get the S-22 from Koei.

Nah I need it now, the session is begining in one month, And I can't wear the club's equipement since it goes to the other beginner class. If I wanted to have a rich-boy show-off bogu, I would buy a hand-made one right now, or something similar...but I just want something real good, and Japanese is the way trust me on that. Anyway, I'm waiting for a letter from Lisa from Eguchi tomorrow, If the answer isn't concluant (...) I already got one in a shopping cart, 5.5mm from eguchi...go see how that does look rich-boy show-off.

[Hai_hai]

...but I just want something real good, and Japanese is the way trust me on that...
I don't need to trust you on that. I have Mori Budo MC-39. Seriously, e-bogu Korean-made bogu at the same price is better.

[DCPan]

The manufacturers name is actually Tada Sangyo. I believe Tada Jissen is the 'brand name' of the bogu supplied to Eguchi.

Jakob

Oops...my bad....on page 45 of the April issue, it does say the set is made by Tada Sangyo...I don't know what "Jissen" means since I don't see those kanji anywhere....

[Kingofmyrrh]

I haven`t got that issue any more, but it`s most likely 実践 practical/real use. It seems to be a code word for `shiai bogu`. I haven`t had any problems using it as motodachi, but when I get back to the UK, I certainly wouldn`t use it when there are beginners around. Although, to be honest, that`s mainly because they might damage it with their clumsy swinging!

[Nanbanjin]

I haven`t got that issue any more, but it`s most likely 実践 practical/real use. It seems to be a code word for `shiai bogu`. I haven`t had any problems using it as motodachi, but when I get back to the UK, I certainly wouldn`t use it when there are beginners around. Although, to be honest, that`s mainly because they might damage it with their clumsy swinging!
Could possibly also be 実戦 as used at the following URL.
http://www.alulu.com/budou/it22.html

[Kingofmyrrh]

It appears that you`re right. Seems I`ve been reading too many ichinikai posts with dodgy spelling. On that note, while I`d be the last one to complain about Hide.`s kendo expertise, for a waseda graduate he doesn`t seem to be too familiar with how to write in japanese using a computer...

[Nanbanjin]

It appears that you`re right. Seems I`ve been reading too many ichinikai posts with dodgy spelling. On that note, while I`d be the last one to complain about Hide.`s kendo expertise, for a waseda graduate he doesn`t seem to be too familiar with how to write in japanese using a computer...I wasn't saying you were wrong; just offering an alternative. I've seen 実践 used but have brushed over it. I have to admit I'd never thought about its pronunciation before. Anyway, you can find it in relation to 実践防具 at the following URL.

http://www.kanagawahakkodo.co.jp/warning.html

In Hide.-san's defence, he probably doesn't have time to check his spelling.

[Andoru]

Pardon my ignorance - who exactly is Hide-san? Seen his name mentioned so many times.

[DCPan]

Pardon my ignorance - who exactly is Hide-san? Seen his name mentioned so many times.

He is renshi rokudan and published a beautifully photographed kendo book that was published recently (meaning that was the most recent kendo book I picked up). Apparantly, there will be DVD available as well.

He also apparantly has an internet forum...too bad it is in Japanese.

[Andoru]

Got a link to that book by any chance? Cheers!

[Nanbanjin]

Got a link to that book by any chance? Cheers!
I've got it on order from Amazon.

http://images-jp.amazon.com/images/P/4415019153.09.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

[Kirin]

DCPan, Andoru,

I started English thread at Hide.-san's forum. Come say hello-
http://www5a.biglobe.ne.jp/~ichini/bbs2/292574233449162.html

Nanbanjin is our designated translator at this thread! :beard: :beard:

[Nanbanjin]

DCPan, Andoru,

I started English thread at Hide.-san's forum. Come say hello-
http://www5a.biglobe.ne.jp/~ichini/bbs2/292574233449162.html

Nanbanjin is our designated translator at this thread! :beard: :beard:
Come on guys, don't be shy!

[Kent Enfield]

For those of you who have communicated with Chiba Bogu via e-mail, how long was the response time? I sent them an e-mail inquiry a week ago and havn't received anything in reply.

[DCPan]

Hi Kent,

For some reason, their server will bounce e-mails if their users just hit the reply button...something crazy with header settings I guess.

I had to ask Mr. Komoto to copy and paste only the actual e-mail address before he could reply to my yahoo account.

However, he simply used one of his hotmail accounts to respond to my inquiry.

I think he was busy with the Saitama Kendo Camp...hence the delay in response.

FWIW.

[Andoru]

I just posted a message (I think I did anyway) and I got this:

書き込みを受け付けました。

書き込んだ記事へ (http://www5a.biglobe.ne.jp/%7Eichini/bbs2/292574233449162.html) 記事一覧へ戻る (http://www5a.biglobe.ne.jp/%7Eichini/bbs2/index.html) 今、書き込んだ内容が「記事一覧」あるいは「記事」に表示されない場合は、「記事一覧」あるいは「記事」を リロード(更新)してください。
このページはリロード(更新)しないでください。リロード(更新)すると、２重投稿となります 。

[Kirin]

Andoru,

You got it :)
Just translated and posted Hide.-san's reply to your post. :wink:


ps. Nanbanjin... come help translate please ..... :redface:

[Andoru]

Excellent! I am so buying the book! Available from Amazon JP I presume?

[Nanbanjin]

Excellent! I am so buying the book! Available from Amazon JP I presume?
Good work with the post on Ichinikai!

The book should arrive here in a couple of weeks. I can give you a bit of a review when it arrives. The videos might be better. Kirin said somewhere that they come with English subtitles.

[DCPan]

Good work with the post on Ichinikai!

The book should arrive here in a couple of weeks. I can give you a bit of a review when it arrives. The videos might be better. Kirin said somewhere that they come with English subtitles.

Is the DVD already available?

I just got a region-free DVD player...so, if there's a link through which I can buy the DVD, please lead on!!! :rolleyes:

P.S. Nanbanjin, please translate my question on Hide-san's page! Thanks a bunch!

[Kirin]

DCPan

DVD should be released on sometime in September. :)

[Nanbanjin]

P.S. Nanbanjin, please translate my question on Hide-san's page! Thanks a bunch!
Kirin beat me to it. Thanks Kirin.
I'm not that confident translating to Japanese. I'm more comfortable with Japanese -> English

[litige]

HAAAAAA what a relief. I finally order my F!!ng bogu...damn it feels good, it's an Eguchi 5.5mm, totally not rich-boy show-off, but any way, it will be my first. On the other hand, the shinai is really a rich-boy-Sh'nai. Madake, Chokuto, heaviest possible, with a 38 Tsukawaga lenght.

Anyway, this is my off-ChibaBogu-thread-but-sequel-to-my-other-posts about me looking for my equipment.

Hoo, Point-Made.


(I love scores)

[Andoru]

Glad to see that the "Kenshi from around the World" thread is up and running! Will add more once David's questions have been answered.

[dcarney]

Wow, I can't believe I've forgotten so much japanese, so fast. It took me the better part of an hour to grind out like three sentences. Oh well, motivation for another year of classes.. hope I didn't mangle the little bit I managed too much :P

[Hai_hai]

HAAAAAA what a relief. I finally order my F!!ng bogu...damn it feels good, it's an Eguchi 5.5mm, totally not rich-boy show-off, but any way, it will be my first. On the other hand, the shinai is really a rich-boy-Sh'nai. Madake, Chokuto, heaviest possible, with a 38 Tsukawaga lenght.

Anyway, this is my off-ChibaBogu-thread-but-sequel-to-my-other-posts about me looking for my equipment.

Hoo, Point-Made.


(I love scores)
Why did you go with 38 tsukagawa?
I did. I don't know why.

[DCPan]

Why did you go with 38 tsukagawa?
I did. I don't know why.

Depends on the length of your forearm.

Of course, if you do jodan, the story changes.

FWIW.

[Kirin]

Glad to see that the "Kenshi from around the World" thread is up and running! Will add more once David's questions have been answered.
If you have questions go ahead and post them...
Nanbanjin is comfortable translating japanese > english :wink:
I will translate english > japanese :wink:

It will save Hide.-san time if he can answer questions on one post.
He usually checks his forums around 7am JPN time. (6pm EST, 5pm CST, 3pm PST)

[Nanbanjin]

If you have questions go ahead and post them...
Nanbanjin is comfortable translating japanese > english :wink:
I will translate english > japanese :wink:

It will save Hide.-san time if he can answer questions on one post.
He usually checks his forums around 7am JPN time. (6pm EST, 5pm CST, 3pm PST)
I'll check tonight and tomorrow morning.

[Kirin]

I'll check tonight and tomorrow morning.
Your handle name will be 「通訳1号」　...you know that! :wink: :wink: :wink:

[Nanbanjin]

Your handle name will be 「通訳1号」　...you know that! :wink: :wink: :wink:了解いたしました。　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　

[dcarney]

Kirin,

What did that say? As much as I hate to admit it, I don't know most of those kanji (only 1 year of japanese so far) and I have no idea how to look them up... :confused2

[litige]

Why did you go with 38 tsukagawa?
I did. I don't know why.

well my forearm is pretty long.
This is my waza shinai. I took it heavy with the tsukawaga shorter, so I can pratice more on control, balance and tenouchi. When I get my normal dobari, it will be more natural and easy.

[Nanbanjin]

Kirin,

What did that say? As much as I hate to admit it, I don't know most of those kanji (only 1 year of japanese so far) and I have no idea how to look them up... :confused2
Can't write Japanese on the linux image I'm on at the moment.
Kirin said that my handle will be "Translator #1"
I said "Understood".

Waiting for Hide.-san's reply.

[dcarney]

Hiro@Dallas 　　 ＵＲＬ (http://www.dfwkik.org/)


dan carneyさんおぉ　名古屋（なごや）大学ですか愛知県は剣道の盛んな場所です　きっと素晴らしい道場が 見つかると思いますよ^^/ ? :confused2

[Nanbanjin]

Hiro@Dallas 　　 ＵＲＬ (http://www.dfwkik.org/)



dan carneyさんおぉ　名古屋（なごや）大学ですか愛知県は剣道の盛んな場所です　きっと素晴らしい道場が 見つかると思いますよ^^/ ? :confused2 Oh, those kanji....

-> Hello Dan Carney-san. So you're going to go to Nagoya University? Kendo is really popular in Aichi prefecture so I'm sure you will be able to find a really good Dojo.

[Nanbanjin]

DCPan and dcarney,

I have finished translating the replies to your posts on Ichinikai.

Regards

[dcarney]

Ooh, thanks! I was wondering what happened to that thread

[Nanbanjin]

Ooh, thanks! I was wondering what happened to that thread
I had a little trouble translating the term 誘い from the reply to DCPan. I hope he will get the idea from the kanji.

[Nanbanjin]

Hide.さん、
はい、４月に日本に留学します。今、剣道のお稽古は、週に三回ぐらいされておられるのです。日本に、よく剣 道を練習したい＾＾。それから、物理を研究します＾＾。

くらもとさん、
Yale大学に９月にかんと学生と練習します。くらもとさんは、Yale大学もれんしゅうしますか？I am not a Japanese teacher, but I would like to offer a few tips on using Japanese. The main thing is that what you have written will have gotten what you were trying to say across effectively.

はい、4月に日本に留学します。
→　はい、4月から日本に留学します。
4月に　makes it sound like you are going to be in Japan in April only.

今、剣道のお稽古は、週に三回ぐらいされておられるのです。
→現在、剣道の稽古は、週に三回ぐらいしております。

今　and　現在　mean more or less the same thing but 現在 is a more general time reference. 今 sounds a little like "right now".

お稽古　- the honorific お is used for what other people do. There is no need to treat yourself with respect in this context.
For example, if you are going to say "will you call you friend", you would say　お友達にお電話しますか。 However, If you were going to say "I call my friend" you would say 友達に電話します。
There are some exceptions to this. For example I think the word "tea" is usually お茶 regardless of the situation. Similarly, you usually say ごはん　（ご飯）。 The alternative めし　（飯）　is a little gutteral whether you are talking about your self or the actions of another.

週に三回ぐらいされておられるのです。

されて is する in the passive form and is used as a mark of respect to the person you are speaking to. Again, in this context you don't use this when talking about your own actions. おられる is also passive. This is triply difficult because it is the passive of おる . You usually only use おります when referring to your self, but in the passive form おられる it becomes polite. In this case you are talking about your own actions, so you should simply use しております。

Welcome to the minefield of keigo.

日本に I think is better as 日本では。

よく is a little ambiguous as it can mean "well" as well as "often". Maybe たくさん is better.
練習したい　- You should probably have added と思います as you have used です・ます form in the rest of the passage.

物理を研究します If you mean the science of ｐhyiscs, then you should use 物理学。 Maybe this sentence is better as 物理学の勉強をします。

Yale大学に９月にかんと学生と練習します。　－ I don't know the background here, but I am pretty sure かんと should be かんとう　as in 関東 (Eastern Japan)

くらもとさんは、Yale大学もれんしゅうしますか - Maybe くらもとさんもYale大学にれんしゅうしますか is better.

I am sure you will pick Japanese up very quickly and will be giving me lessons before too long.

[Kirin]

お稽古　- the honorific お is used for what other people do. There is no need to treat yourself with respect in this context.

Yes, very much true in general sence. However, in kendo many sensei uses
お稽古 instead of 稽古. (including Hide. san)
I guess it is becasue respecting your practice and your opponent　（お相手 not 相手）



ps. thx for translating at ich-ni-kai forum ^^

[Nanbanjin]

Yes, very much true in general sence. However, in kendo many sensei uses
お稽古 instead of 稽古. (including Hide. san)
I guess it is becasue respecting your practice and your opponent　（お相手 not 相手）



ps. thx for translating at ich-ni-kai forum ^^Thank you for the clarification.
The way I understood it お稽古 would be used when referring to the actions of somebody else. In the case of Hide.-san he is referring to actions carried out by dcarney, so お稽古 is appropriate. Would it be correct to say 私はお稽古します in the context of your own practice? If Mr. Carney was talking about training with Hide.-san, I am sure お稽古 would be appropriate, because he would be showing respect to Hide.-san. In the case where you are referring to an action that you will be performing with the person you are addressing, you should use polite form to show respect to that person.
"Opponent" is often expressed as 相手 when referring to your own opponent when addressing a third person. On Ichinikai people nearly always use 相手 when asking questions and talking about their own opponent. Hide.-san nearly always replies with お相手

To dcarney,

Don't let keigo scare you off. It is a little daunting at first but the more you get the hang of it the more you will realise that it is full of subtlety and when done correctly it can be quite beautiful.

[dcarney]

Thanks for the lesson! I've only had a year of japanese coursework. Actually, I just copied and pasted hide.-san's sentence about practice there, because I don't know how to talk about frequency yet (i.e., "I practice three times a week"). Man, I thought this stuff was difficult in class ;)

[Nanbanjin]

Thanks for the lesson! I've only had a year of japanese coursework. Actually, I just copied and pasted hide.-san's sentence about practice there, because I don't know how to talk about frequency yet (i.e., "I practice three times a week"). Man, I thought this stuff was difficult in class ;)
Just a year? I think you're doing really well. I could tell you had used Hide.-san's post. You have to be a little bit careful because the way people (especially polite people like Hide.-san) talk about other people is very different from the way they talk about themselves.
Like I said earlier, welcome to keigo.

[Nanbanjin]

More translations are ready for dcarney-san.

[dcarney]

Thanks again!

[Nanbanjin]

Thanks again!
See how Hide.-san picked up your keigo? Told you so! You can tell that it didn't matter.

Also, I think I was wrong about　物理学　. After I read Hide.-san's port I had a look around and it looks like 物理 is ok.

Regards.

[litige]

Hurray, I got my Bogu!

[Hai_hai]

Hurray, I got my Bogu!
Now, you may rest in peace.

[Haowen]

Hurray, I got my Bogu!

Would you post a first-impressions review? I'm curious to hear about it.

[litige]

Would you post a first-impressions review? I'm curious to hear about it.

Yes I will.

First of, it's the Eguchi 5.5 mm. The first thing that got out of the box was the kote. They where some korean made 3, 2.5 or 2mm kote (didn't measure the switch) instead of the one picture on the site, the thing I now is that they cost the same, so they sent these (maybe because they didn't had Xl large 5.5 Kote or didn't had it in stock). I tried them, they fit me like glove, just the perfect size, very comfy, and nice padding. After that I digged for the Men. Very simple ( like in really not RBSO) with cheap leather triming, cheap tsuki ago, very simple again (I say cheap in not intricate, not in, badly made) the side flaps are not stiff, but loose (more after breakage) the top partion if a bit stiff, and the back of the Men (about 1 inch large) is really close stiched, for protection. The fit is perfect, exactly what I asked for. After that I took the do and tare out. The tare is loose (ie really not stiff) with 5.5 mm stiching, 3 line decoration, cheap leather trimming, etc. It fits they way it is supposed to be, as is the do (fiber). The Do is not shiny. It's not matte, but not mirror shiny. If fits me well, but since I didn't have hakama and gi, couldn't try it well. anyway, I'll see how it performs in practice and after 6 years.

[Haowen]

Sounds great. Good luck with it!

[Andoru]

Received the men and kote from Chibabogu 2 days ago and after trying them in keiko all I can say is "WOW". The textiles were made by Mitsuboshi, but assembled by Chibabogu I believe.

After training with a super stiff men (especially the men flaps - just ask Taek), the ease in shoulder movements whist wearing the Mine men is superlative. It's like as if the flaps didn't exist at all. It's the single most important feature which impresses me the most - it actually made a difference in my kendo. I was definitely more relaxed during jigeiko. In the past I used to struggle with the stiff men flaps at times - it seems to work against me. The monomi is well placed, so I don't look downward any more, thus improving my posture. The men itself does not require much break-in at all - put it on and it fits like a glove. Protection is of course good. Workmanship is first class. Worth every penny.

The kote, being custom made, fit my hands very well. The deer skin palms offer good grip, and together with the superior fit, I was able to grip the shinai more securely. It offers better protection than my 1.2bu kote, is lighter and also more flexible.

The men and kote definitely do not look bling - their functionalities outweigh their looks. Don't take me wrong, they're not ugly ducklings by any means.

All in all, I have nothing but heaps of praise for the superlative quality and exceptional customer service. Michael Komoto, international customer service manager and KW team member, is exceptionally helpful and patient, and answered all my emails promptly. I can't see myself looking past Chibabogu for my next set in the future.

[Hai_hai]

Received the men and kote from Chibabogu 2 days ago...
You are now a rich-boy show-off.

[Taek]

Hi Andrew, so good to hear that you are happy with your chiba men and kote.
I've seen and felt Andrew's previous men and the men flaps were I guess...about twice thicker than my men. I first thought it would give more protection but it looked very stiff as Andrew described. I had a few email exchanges with Komoto san regarding repairing my current men with monomi problem and he was so fast getting back to me with so much details. It was such a great learning experience and I've so much trust with Chiba bogu. My parents-in-law's place is in Chiba so when i visit them next year the Chiba boguya will be my first shopping place. I'd love to come and have a look at your men and kote next week. I've been having a bit of rest because of my trigger finger problem.

[Andoru]

No worries Taek - take good care of your finger.

By the way, we're giving a demo tomorrow at the Opera House (3 for 3.30pm start) as part of the asian festival. We're meeting at 3pm outside the steps. Drop in if you can :)

[Taek]

I had a look at Andoru's new Chiba mine men and kote today. Guys!! totally mind blowing. Even though it is 6mm machine stitched, it is totally different to what you might imagine. Well, I can relly see what Chiba bogu tried to do with this new design of bogu. Totally pratical bogu that gives maximum mobility as well as protection. It has got plenty of padding on the top of men and kote's arm part.
In fact I've never seen any other bogu with such a thick padding before. No wonder why my head and wrist hurt so much when I'm struck in my 1.2 bu bogu with only probably as little as 1/3 of mine's padding. For the sake of looking after my own brain, I should seriously think about save some money and get the mine men soon.

[kanyil]

I was browsing through Chiba Bogu's catalog and noticed its more expensive stitched sets are fitted with non-IBB menganes, while its (relatively) cheaper Mine is fitted with IBB.

From what's available on this forum, I've always thought that the IBB is the best mengane due to its better weight distribution, but if this is true then it would make sense for all the top-end bogus to offer IBB menganes. Or is it that there are better menganes than the IBB?

I would appreciate any advice on this issue. Thanks!

[Andoru]

I'm sure IBB mengane can be requested.

[zato]

Andorus....reading Taek review on ur men make me wana buy (planing) mine chiba bogu...do u mind show picture of ur men...thankss....

[Kent Enfield]

Yesterday I finally received my new kote from Chiba Bogu. I started the ordering process in early August and finalized it in mid-late August. Fortunately, last night was also a kendo night, so I got to put them into use as well.

First, they look great. I won't post any pictures because they look like the ones in the picture on the website. They're very comfortable as well, and allow full freedom of motion with my hands and wrists. At the end of one night's practice, they seem to be almost fully broken in.

Second, the protection is magnificent. At first, I did notice that strikes felt more like a gentle push than a sharp strike like they did in my other kote, though normal strikes didn't cause pain through my old pair either. I realized how good they really are when a beginner hit high and left a welt with the weave of my keikogi visible. Watching him with another person, his missed kote were ending up at knee height. When his strikes were on target, all I felt was the same soft push on my wrist. Even strikes across the knuckles or wrist joint itself wern't painful.

Assuming that these kote are reasonably durable, I don't ever see getting another model. I might end up getting another pair, though after their performance last night, I'm saving up for a men and possibly a tare.

[Hai_hai]

Kendoka in Oregon, please stop pretending to hit hard. It's causing a false sense of security for Kent.

[grasshopper_r2]

Help. I have tried a number of times to download Chibabogu's Catalogue, only to wait aprox 40 min and the darn thing not work! Please, if anyone could post this catalogue or give some prices it would be greatly appreciated!
BTW--congrat's on the new Bogu.

[Andoru]

Andorus....reading Taek review on ur men make me wana buy (planing) mine chiba bogu...do u mind show picture of ur men...thankss.... G'day....DCPan has posted some pictures of his Mine men (mine is exactly the same except that my accent/embroidery colour is crimson instead of blue) just a few pages back.

After using the men and kote for a few weeks, I've found their functionality to be exceptional. They are not bling-bling - though the quality of workmanship and material used are so good even RBSO would appreciate. Best of all, they're custom made to fit me (and very well fitted indeed). I'm so happy with them that I have ordered a tare as well - will post a review when it gets here. Michael Komoto (a KW team member Chibabogu's customer service manager) is exceptionally helpful and efficient in his responses.

[Taek]

I've just received a Eguchi bogu catalogue today and found a 'Pitch' bogu set from Mitsuboshi selling at US$1,990.00. The set's standard feature includes titanium mengane, deluxe lacquer on 60-piece bamboo doh, full customization...and so on. If I remember correctly, Chiba's 'Mine' bogu uses Mitsuboshi's material and the Mine basically means Pitch isn't it? The price of Chiba's Mine bogu is considerably higher than Pitch and Mine's doh is yamato doh whereas Pitch's doh is 60pcs bamboo. I was wondering if Chiba's Mine is the exactly same bogu as Mitsuboshi's Pitch. I'm sure I may not get the excellent service by Komoto San and accurate fitting as Chiba's but I could save bit of money and get better stuff if I buy Men from Chiba and all others from Mitsuboshi.....any advice on this Andrew, PC Pan or anyone who bought the bogu from either of the bogushops?

[kanyil]

I guess I should rephrase my last question about the IBB and non-IBB menganes. I apologize for not making myself clear in my questions.

What I was trying to say was: "are the IBB menganes considered the top-of-the-line in the mengane world? or are there other menganes which are superior in performance/weight distribution to IBB menganes?"

The reason behind this question was, if the IBB mengane is top-of-the-line then it would make sense for the more expensive bogus to come with it as standard equipment, as opposed to what is offered by Chibabogu in their catalog (i.e. standard Mine comes with IBB, while expensive hand stitches do not). However, I am sure Andoru is right in that we can always make a special request for the IBB menganes to be used in Chiabobogu hand stitch.

[Taek]

Based on what I know, IBB mengane is better and more expensive than titanium mengane. I also saw a mengane called DLC titanium mengane. Not sure how different it is compare to IBB. May be just a different name for the same product.

[DCPan]

Based on what I know, IBB mengane is better and more expensive than titanium mengane. I also saw a mengane called DLC titanium mengane. Not sure how different it is compare to IBB. May be just a different name for the same product.

There is only ONE drawback with IBB. It is actually technically ~100 grams heavier than the standard titanium grille. This is because they need to add material strategically to shift the center of balance. So, while it isn't an issue for most people, it might be an issue if you are petite (or so I was told).

Now, as to why some top-of-the line sets don't have IBB as standard...remember the word "tradition". Why do top of the line sets not use sorbothane?

DLC is not IBB. DLC is titanium grille treated with a special coating to make it even have an even harder "SURFACE" coating...there's some diagram of crystalline structure that I'm too lazy to read carefully on the catalog. Personally, I'd avoid it just because wearing a grille with golden colored coating or charcoal color coating kinda makes you stand out...

Lastly, regarding the price on the catalog. I will say this. One rarely pays list price for bogu when purchasing. I got multiple bids for my mine men before purchase, and Chiba's prices were competitive. The actual price has to figure your personal sizing and etc. In fact, Chiba's bid was competitive enough that I accepted their initial offer without any bargaining, which is the way I prefer to do things. I don't believe in milking places that offer premium service.

[DCPan]

Oh yeah,

Personally, I didn't notice the weight difference of the IBB because the balance is so great!

Also, according to Mr. Komoto, the synthetic doh on the Mine is of a better gauge than the Yamato Doh...and it's a little better in terms of sizing (as I couldn't find a yamato doh that'll fit me).

So, I'm interested in trying it out, but simply couldn't justify making the purchase to my wife right now, at this point in time. :confused2

[Karaken]

Oh yeah,

Personally, I didn't notice the weight difference of the IBB because the balance is so great!

Also, according to Mr. Komoto, the synthetic doh on the Mine is of a better gauge than the Yamato Doh...and it's a little better in terms of sizing (as I couldn't find a yamato doh that'll fit me).

So, I'm interested in trying it out, but simply couldn't justify making the purchase to my wife right now, at this point in time. :confused2
Please excuse my ignorance. What's the diffrence betwwen the synthetic doh and the Yamato Doh?

[Hai_hai]

...but simply couldn't justify making the purchase to my wife right now, at this point in time....
Some rich-boy show-off you turned out to be.

[DCPan]

Please excuse my ignorance. What's the diffrence betwwen the synthetic doh and the Yamato Doh?

Well, there's the basic fiber-glass doh.

Then, there's the simulated 50-slot yamato doh.

If I recall correctly, the MINE has a simulated 60-slot doh of some kind of synthetic material.

I don't really know much about it, that's why I want to buy one and find out.... :wink:


Some rich-boy show-off you turned out to be.

Hear hear... :wink:

[Hai_hai]

Please excuse my ignorance. What's the diffrence betwwen the synthetic doh and the Yamato Doh?
Fiber do is lighter than a bamboo-simulated Yamato do by a smidge. The back of the 50-look yamato do has extra fake bamboo slat molded into the back. Looks good.

[Taek]

I emailed Mitsuboshi and asked if their Pitch bogu is same bogu as Chiba's Mine. And I also asked if I could buy Pitch from Mitsuboshi shop in Japan rather than buying from Eguich in USA. I got reply from them today and they actually told me to buy the Mine from Chiba.....hmmmm.
I wonder if their Pitch and Chiba's Mine are actually produced by same crafts people at Mitsuboshi. Just curious.

[DCPan]

I emailed Mitsuboshi and asked if their Pitch bogu is same bogu as Chiba's Mine. And I also asked if I could buy Pitch from Mitsuboshi shop in Japan rather than buying from Eguich in USA. I got reply from them today and they actually told me to buy the Mine from Chiba.....hmmmm.
I wonder if their Pitch and Chiba's Mine are actually produced by same crafts people at Mitsuboshi. Just curious.

I actually e-mailed Mitsuboshi for a catalog and had the same inquiry as you.

The e-mail rep I corresponded with was quite rude. Not only was his English skills very poor, he actually told me Mitsuboshi only deals with retailers, then told me off.... I should have wrote their complaint department, but couldn't be bothered....

[Hai_hai]

I wonder if their Pitch and Chiba's Mine are actually produced by same crafts people at Mitsuboshi. Just curious.
So you want to join the Mine men club? Just curious.

[moetl]

There is only ONE drawback with IBB. It is actually technically ~100 grams heavier than the standard titanium grille.eh? it though IBB is used because it feels lighter than normal menagne??

Now, as to why some top-of-the line sets don't have IBB as standard...remember the word "tradition". Why do top of the line sets not use sorbothane?that's because the sorbothane cannot develop it's shock absorbing property with tight stiching.

but: why does the mine bogu don't use sorbothane? - obvious answer: because it's protection is superb without sorbothane. it would be interesting to know what the mine bogu has what sorbothane hasn't?

[DCPan]

eh? it though IBB is used because it feels lighter than normal menagne??


Point of Balance will affect perceived weight. By moving the center of balance closer to the spine, the IBB grille feels lighter with less strain on the neck.

Eventhough IBB is heavier than the standard titanium grille, the men feels as light as my duraaluminum men, but absorbs shock MUCH better.


that's because the sorbothane cannot develop it's shock absorbing property with tight stiching.

I don't think that's true.

The demonstration of striking a lightbulb with a hammer and sorbothane padding would indicate that stitching is not required to develop that property.


but: why does the mine bogu don't use sorbothane? - obvious answer: because it's protection is superb without sorbothane. it would be interesting to know what the mine bogu has what sorbothane hasn't?

Actually, I don't know if MINE uses sorbothane or not. I was just referring to the question about why IBB isn't standard on some top of the line models....

[moetl]

seems we got a communication problem here? :o
The demonstration of striking a lightbulb with a hammer and sorbothane padding would indicate that stitching is not required to develop that property.hmmm, i did not say that stiching is r e q u i r e d that sorbothane develops it's property. i said tight stiching h i n d e r s sorbothane to develop it's shock absorbing property. now - though i think it's locigal - i did not make this statement. mr. stroud himself said that ^_^


Actually, I don't know if MINE uses sorbothane or not. I was just referring to the question about why IBB isn't standard on some top of the line models.......and i found the question interesting why mine has no sorbothane. ;) simply because it's interesting to know which material has better properties. and why this material (or technique) is not used more often, and why it took the bogu-makers so long to (re-)invent it.

[DCPan]

seems we got a communication problem here? :ohmmm, i did not say that stiching is r e q u i r e d that sorbothane develops it's property. i said tight stiching h i n d e r s sorbothane to develop it's shock absorbing property.

The MINE bogu doesn't have tight stitching...at 6mm, the stitching is pretty wide.

[kanyil]

thanks for the response guys. I guess tradition probably has alot to do with the use of non-IBB menganes in top of the line bogus.

If IBB has better balance, and duraluminium is lighter than titanium, then it would suggest that the IBB Duraluminium men will be the best choice for someone interested in a light men? Perhaps Hai Hai can comment on this as I seem to recall that his Moribudo bogu comes with an IBB Duraluminium men.

great discussion about the use of sorbothanes, I was actually just wondering about the same thing myself. It's a wonder that nobody has yet put sorbothane into a doh yet.

[Taek]

So you want to join the Mine men club? Just curious.
Ha ha..hai hai, I probably know what you are going to say but can't help myself....the Mine men is in my Christmas shopping list already.

[Taek]

but: why does the mine bogu don't use sorbothane? - obvious answer: because it's protection is superb without sorbothane. it would be interesting to know what the mine bogu has what sorbothane hasn't?

I actually asked Chiba bogu if they can rebuild my men and insert extra padding for better protection and this email from Chiba bogu might answer for the question.Also as I saw, felt and compared Andrew's 6mm machine stitched Mine men against my 1.2 hand stitched men, I can tell you that even my 1.2bu handstitched men wouldn't be a match for Andrew's mine men as far as protection and comfort levels are concerned. I think it is all to do with the material they use and how they stitch the material creates the extra bump for better shock absorption. And they only put protection where it is needed and it makes bogu lighter without sacrificing the safty.

From Chiba - Another thing about the protector pads put inside of men. *We have done a lot of rebuilds where customers ask us to incorporate the men pad, believing the pad will add extra protection and comfort to their ill-fitting men. *In reality, a properly fitted men which hugs the head will transmit impact forces over the entire men, and throughout the contact area. *If your men has not fit well up ‘till now, perhaps it is due to improper fit, resulting in the men sitting on top of your head like a pot. *In such a case, the impacts transmit their force to the crown of the head only, with high peak pressures. *This is the most painful situation, and although putting additional layers, ala the men-pad, may help, it is simply the case where the men does not fit. *In a properly fit men, given that the men-buton is of good quality, the men-pad is not necessary and may actually contribute to poor fit. *We do not recommend this in our men reconstructions.-

[moetl]

The MINE bogu doesn't have tight stitching...at 6mm, the stitching is pretty wide.Hi DCPan :D
geez, what should i say? i know that mine has wide stiching and therefor i asked myself why they don't use sorbothane...

for that matter, does anyone actually know they can fit your men properly with just two measurements?? every head has a different shape, so how do they do it?

[kanyil]

Hi guys, is anyone organizing the Mine Men's Club yet? (and has anyone new joined you guys yet?)

[Fonsz]

I started 2005 with spending a lot of cash on a ..................Mine men. You might say that I'm joining the RBSO club aka "the Mine Men's Club". Which Kanyil has so eloquently stated. It took a long while considering the pros and cons, reading all the testimonials and the fact that if you got a question you will get an inmediate reply has tilted the balance to Chiba Bogu's favor. The quick response is also something that the Korean shops should take notice they can be lacking in this field. I cant't wait till it arrives and I will post pictures when it does. Funny practicing Kendo makes you part of an exclusive club and now we have a club in a club.

[Andoru]

Welcome to Team Mine, Fonsz!

[kanyil]

I started 2005 with spending a lot of cash on a ..................Mine men.
Same here! I splurged out on a Mine men with IBB mengane and indigo deerskin and set of Clarino Mine kotes with micro-punched palm and stuffed with deerhair (and extra-paddings on both kotes).

I was originally leaning towards the Duralumin+clarino option for the men, but oh well. :D

[Andoru]

Bwahahahaha more Team Mine members....*rubs hands*

When are your men expected to arrive?

[kanyil]

Bwahahahaha more Team Mine members....*rubs hands*

When are your men expected to arrive?
Michael Komoto said this is the "slow" period for them so the men will arrive in about 6 weeks, instead of the usual 8. Will post photos in due course. :D

[DCPan]

Same here! I splurged out on a Mine men with IBB mengane and indigo deerskin and set of Clarino Mine kotes with micro-punched palm and stuffed with deerhair (and extra-paddings on both kotes).

I was originally leaning towards the Duralumin+clarino option for the men, but oh well. :D

So, what kind of material is the micro-punched palm? On the website, it would appear the clarino option of the kote has synthetic filling...did you get a special request?

I just playing around with the options...a dura-aluminum+clarino option would put it right in range with the A-1....I know the A-1 has the duraaluminum grill...but I wonder about the futon.

I really would like to see all three types of futon side by side and really compare them...wouldn't that be fun?

:wink:

[JSchmidt]

I'm in the process of buying A-1 kote's..I'll let you know how they turn out :)

Jakob

[kanyil]

So, what kind of material is the micro-punched palm? On the website, it would appear the clarino option of the kote has synthetic filling...did you get a special request?

I just playing around with the options...a dura-aluminum+clarino option would put it right in range with the A-1....I know the A-1 has the duraaluminum grill...but I wonder about the futon.

:wink:
The micro-punched palm is made out of clarino. The deerhair fillings were a special request at Michael Komoto's suggestion. The result of trying to combine the best of both worlds, hopefully. :D

I was actually leaning towards the dura-aluminum+clarino option for the exact same reason, light, good quality, and less expensive. but after extensive discussions I ended up going with the more-or-less standard Mine options.

[kanyil]

The micro-punched palm is made out of clarino. The deerhair fillings were a special request at Michael Komoto's suggestion. The result of trying to combine the best of both worlds, hopefully. :D

I was actually leaning towards the dura-aluminum+clarino option for the exact same reason, light, good quality, and less expensive. but after extensive discussions I ended up going with the more-or-less standard Mine options.
Will do a full write-up/review of my orders shortly, but let's just say I am an extremely satisfied client. My order of Chibabogu's Kote and Men was shipped directly to my hotel in Tokyo, I broke it in a little that night and took it to practice with me the next day. Simply great.

The all clarino, micro-punched palms and deer-hair filled kote worked like a charm. It is easily half the weight of my previous 1.2 bu tezashi kote but I have yet to feel a kote strike (and I have now spent 3 days practising in Japan). As an added feature, the clarino wicks mosture and dries extremely fast, so the kote is generally complete dry only 1-2 hours after practice.

As far as the men's concerned, I ended up with an all deer-skin, naname-zashi men fitted with IBB Pro mengane (it's only 8,000 yen extra). Figuring a 10% increase in price is a good price to pay in order to satisfy my curiousity, I forked over the additional money and went with it. I will be comparing this with my standard IBB back home when I go back.

The men felt quite light, and was certainly noticeably lighter than my other men, but it protected very well. I have yet to feel any pain even after being clubbered in the various Japanese dojos. Even a strong men from Toda sensei's overweight daito felt manageable.

[Andoru]

Your next target: Mine tare! :D

[kanyil]

Apologies for double posting.

Andoru asked me to copy/paste my review of the Mine here so that all Mine Reviews can be consolidated, and therefore more accessible to anyone who may be interested in such information. A link to my original thread can also be found below


Kanyil's Mine Review

As promised earlier, here is a review of the Mine men and kote (not the entire bogu) after approximately 1 months of fairly frequent keiko.

I was originally leaning towards the Kanagawa Hakkodo's A-1 series as a lightweight bogu would be much easier to carry around on Taipei's crowded public transport systems, but due to the difficulties of buying A-1 as an overseas customer, I was won over by Chiba budogu's excellent service. Every email inquiry was returned promptly and the answers were always helpful. They actually went and weighted the different menganes in order to answer one of my questions.

1. Specification

My order was for a Mine Men and a Mine Kote.

The options I went for was as follows:

Mine Men:

(1) Standard indigo deerskin

(2) Diagonal Stitch (+3,000 Yen)

(3) IBB Pro Titanium Mengane (+1,500 to upgrade from regular titanium to IBB; and +8,000 to upgrade from IBB to IBB Pro)

(4) Kansai style chichigawa (no extra charge)

Mine Kote:

(1) All clarino option with micro-punched palms.

(2) Deer-hair fillings instead of synthetic fillers.

(3) Extra paddings on both kotes (great for jodan or nito practitioners, but I highly recommend it for everyone)

As you can see, my order was extensively customized. For both the men and the kote I requested special options that were not usually available and Chiba budogu gladly accommodated my requests.

2. Shipping/Delivery

The Mine set is said to be completely customized from scratch, and in light of my unusual customization requests, it has to be. It took Chiba budogu about 2 months to produce my order.

I originally asked for my order to be mailed to me by EMS (their only option) at the cost of around 6,000 yen. 2 weeks before the men is due to be shipped to me I changed my mind and decided to pick up my order during one of my trips to Tokyo. Once again they were happy to accommodate my request and refunded the shipping costs I paid. The order was sent to my hotel immediately before my check-in date and was waiting for me at the check-in counter on the date of my arrival. Chiba budogu did not charge me for the inland delivery.

Because I carried the bogu back with me as part of my luggage I paid no customs duty on the purchase.

3. First Impression

After picking up the package from the check-in counter (and after enduring the check-in staff's friendly smiles at this weird guy who came to Japan to have a kendo holiday) I immediately noticed that the parcel containing my order felt exceptionally light, which is always a good thing since lightweight is exactly what I wanted.

Admittedly, the appearance of the bogu was somewhat ordinary. The appearance of the 6mm stitching width alone made it difficult to swallow the cost of the men. But as I examine the men and kote a little more I slowly began to notice its difference. It's so soft and supple, and thickly padded where required! The men fitted me extremely well. The monomi was spot on. The kote was probably only 3/4 the weight of my 1.2 bu kote despite having a padding that is easily twice as thick as the 1.2 bu.

It is difficult to gauge the differences between the IBB mengane and the IBB Pro mengane, despite my many attempts to compare the two, as they are both attached to differently constructed mens. One cosmetic difference I have noticed is that the IBB Pro is finished to a higher degree (i.e. a neat shiny metallic IBB stamp instead of the normal red IBB characters) and that the monomi does not seem as noticeable (i.e. the monomi gap did not appear significantly larger than the other gaps in the IBB Pro mengane, as was in the case of the IBB mengane). I think the balance may be a little better for IBB Pro, but am not entirely sure.

Other than the above, it's difficult to tell what my additional 8,000 yen bought me but I am happy with the feel and balance of my new IBB Pro mengane.

4. Review After One Month

My Mine and I attended more than 20 keikos last month. Each keiko was about 2-3 hours in length, and consists mostly of uchikomi-geiko and jigeiko. I originally bought the Mine men to rotate with my other men, but I now exclusively use the Mine men. It just felt so much nicer.

The men and kote were put through 3 consecutive days of keiko immediately after I got it. I actually took the men and kote to a 4 hour keiko the day after I received it. Amazingly, I noticed no stiffness in the shoulder flaps despite how new the men was. The men, despite its softness, protected remarkable protection. I used to use a men pad and a wrist protector with my 1.2 bu set, they now rest along side the 1.2 bu set in the cupboard. It is not necessary to use protectors underneath the Mine men and kote.

The Mine kote dries extremely fast and would be almost dry by the time I get home from the dojo, and the only reason why I would use my other pair is because I don't want to wear out the Mine kote (flawed logic, I know).

A sensei took one look at the Mine set and scoffed at how cheap it looked. "too cheap, wide stitching" he told me as he continued walking the other way, and he arrived at this opinion without even touching the men or the kote. Those other senseis and sempais who actually touched the Mine kote and men were able to see through the wide-stitching, and quickly saw the merits of the Mine design. Some were especially impressed by the lightweight, quick drying and thickly-padded kote. A sensei is actually thinking about getting it for his next set.

After a month of use, the micro-punched clarino palms are holding up well, except for some small signs of wear that one would also expect to see on a pair of deerskin kotes. Although I am feeling a bit guilty about not using my 1.2 kote as much, so I might start to rotate them more. Eventually. Maybe. HA.

5. Conclusion

This is the bogu I should have bought in the first place. With the above being said, however, the Mine line is no small investment, and probably not the best idea for people who are just starting kendo. The value of the Mine lies in its functionality.

But in the case of the Mine, you really do get what you paid for. I regretted every cent I spent on the A120 that could have gone into a full Mine set. But I guess we live and learn.

The next step? The Mine Tare!

http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6313

[Andoru]

An update:

I've been using the mine men and kote for close to a year, and the mine tare for 9 months. They are still as good as ever! While the men may have since been covered with some salt stains, the integrity of the lacquer coating outside the men has kept exceedingly well. Still looks like new from the outside. Kote protects well with no issues whatsoever - might even get a second pair for rotational purposes.

Out of the three, the tare has matured the best, like an excellent aged wine - it started out with just a bite of stiffness, but has now grown soft and supple yet protects really well (took a couple of tsuki ball waza really well I might add). Lots of kendo friends, including senseis, have admired it. I could hardly feel the tare brushing against my thighs when I move.

Overall, I'm completely satisfied with the functionality of the bogu. I haven't yet come across another set of bogu, be it machine or hand-stitched, which could challenge the mine, especially in light of its relatively cheaper cost. One of my dojo-mate switched from a Koei S-22 men to the mine men and he's a happy chappie too.

The one and only downside: you cannot blame the equipment anymore. :D

[DCPan]

The one and only downside: you cannot blame the equipment anymore. :D

Downside #2: No excuse to go bogu shopping because you aren't happy with your "current" bogu! :wink:

[Andoru]

So true! :D

[DCPan]

So Andoru, are you going to get the doh and make the set complete? :wink:

[Andoru]

Nah, I'm a pretty firm believer of the benefits of a bamboo doh at this stage. I used a synthetic doh before and discovered that it didn't protect as well.

[DCPan]

Nah, I'm a pretty firm believer of the benefits of a bamboo doh at this stage. I used a synthetic doh before and discovered that it didn't protect as well.

You know, my first doh was a bamboo doh.

I decided to try the F-50 for travelling, since I didn't want the duct-tape doh to happen again.

Surprisingly, I haven't noticed a real difference yet.

Unlike the conventional Yamato Doh that I've seen, the F-50 is Kanto style...so it is more box shaped than round...perhaps that's giving it more structural integrity. Also, rather than running straight up and down, the doh is set kinda bent, so it molds with the beery belly (if you have one). You can see even in the catalogue that the doh on the mine set is shaped slightly different than other dohs.

I really don't know if the F-50 is "better" than the conventional fake-50 look as I've not tried other fiber dohs...but I like it.

FWIW.

[Andoru]

Wow! I didn't realise that there's a kanto style for doh. It's a good thing that you raised it here so everyone knows what it is.

When my current doh expires, I'll consider it.

[LNGUYEN]

I am going to order a Mine Kote (for the begining, more will follow). The question is:
After using it for a while, what option do you wish to have for the protection and movement purpose?

[ratdeau]

I am going to order a Mine Kote (for the begining, more will follow). The question is:
After using it for a while, what option do you wish to have for the protection and movement purpose?
None, they are really good. Perhaps if you plan to study jodan, go for the extra padding for left kote.

[Andoru]

I am going to order a Mine Kote (for the begining, more will follow). The question is:
After using it for a while, what option do you wish to have for the protection and movement purpose?

None, like what ratdeau said. Unlike ratdeau, my kote has the extra padding for both. :D

[Kmav]

It would be cool to get some feedback on their bogu.

[k3narki]

If your referring to the Mine bogu, there is already a review thread of the bogu. I just ordered the Mine set, and it should arrive withing 6-10 weeks as mentioned on their website.

I just can't express how great Michael is in regard to customer service, he really does know how to treat he's customers. Somehow, you think he walks around with a portable computer because of his rapid responses. Even late at night we will find ourselves sending emails at 10pm-1am.

Sorry, I just had to tell you about my experience with Michael from Chiba. It appears I'm just validating something that everybody already knows about.

[nebosuke]

I'd say Michael is great at responding, but so far his record at initiating contact has been bad. So far whenever I write to him, he responds within the next day or two, but when he says he will contact me after a certain action takes place, he has failed both times. There was also a disparity between what somebody at the shop said when we first called them, and what Michael then told us via e-mail. He did explained that, and hopefully what he said is accurate. I only proceeded to deal with them after that based on what people have said here, I would have gone elsewhere at that time otherwise.

I went to them in the first place because of the very high recommendations made by people here. So far, I wouldn't say the experience hasn't been anything special, I've gotten better service from Lisa at Eguchi in the past. So my hope is that when the order is delivered, the quality it will make me forget about everything else.

[Andoru]

Nit-picky today are we? :)

Michael is easily one of the most self-less guy I've ever met in kendo.

[LarsCW]

I've ordered a catalogue and even then I got the quick responce you all are discribing here.

[LNGUYEN]

I ordered a pair of Kote with clarino micropunch palm, as Komoto-san recommended. I also ask for tsuba gusset. Hope everything is going to be fine. Hey, how much is member fee to join the Mine club?

Next target, THE MEEEN.

[Fonsz]

I ordered a pair of Kote with clarino micropunch palm, as Komoto-san recommended. I also ask for tsuba gusset. Hope everything is going to be fine. Hey, how much is member fee to join the Mine club?

Next target, THE MEEEN.
Just buy the Men, that should be sufficient to join the club. Start saving now, eat one meal a day, sell your car and a second mortgage on your house and you'll be part of an elite within the elite............:rolleyes:

[LNGUYEN]

My car is 11 years old. My house was bought two years ago and the mortgage is still up my neck. I bring lunch to work since no money for buying lunch. I save $10 dolard a week for Kendo and my wife only giving me enough for monthly fee. the only thing is available for consolidation is my Kidney and my balls (I mean to have two soccer balls at home :beard: ), eventhough my balls are all scratchy (due to my cats), it is still useful.

[nebosuke]

Nit-picky today are we? :)

Michael is easily one of the most self-less guy I've ever met in kendo.
What can I say, when somebody says that when X happens, they will e-mail me, I expect them to do so. Especially in business, and furthermore when a few thousand dollars are involved. I'm not saying anything about him on a personal level, I don't know him.

[LarsCW]

Got a really nice suprise in the mail today. My gf decided to suprise me with a zekken and ordered me one from chibabogu and it's absolutly beautifull if you ask me, she also got me one with the dojo symbol and dojo name in kanji and the detail they made it with is so nice.

http://highlanddreams.lmaoland.com/wordpress/wp-content/Zekken_Lars_400x533.jpg

[k3narki]

It looks really nice mate! Everything from Chibabogu is pretty much high quality. I can't wait to get my zekken also, plus my Mine bogu :)

[LNGUYEN]

Ra Ra Ra Ra Ra, dancing around the fire under the Moon naked. I got the Kote.

Option I have:
Deer Skin with deer hair Kashira
Tsuba gusset on both kote
Extra padding on left kote
Clarino with Micropunch palms.
Name with olive green thread (I thought I got olive green thread somewhere on the kote too, but not so)

Good God in heaven, I can't believe it is so light compare to my old one. It fits very good but I think after break-in it will fit perfectly. So far, I am only do general break-in like the manual on Chibabogu. the futon is thick, very thick. It doesn't feel like steel plate but more like cushion. I will put it into action this Saturday.

Dealing with Komoto-san is very relaxing and comfortable. Every email was replied ASAP with good answer. Several times, the emails were answered right away like live chat. Some one over Japan gives him a good hug for me please.

[k3narki]

Congrats LNGUYEN!

Today it finally arrived. Luckly enough, I didn't get screwed by customs. So it'a all good here. All that is left is for my Do to be finished. Well heres a picture.. hope you enjoy.

[Yiu Fai]

Ra Ra Ra Ra Ra, dancing around the fire under the Moon naked. I got the Kote.

Option I have:
Deer Skin with deer hair Kashira
Tsuba gusset on both kote
Extra padding on left kote
Clarino with Micropunch palms.
Name with olive green thread (I thought I got olive green thread somewhere on the kote too, but not so)

Good God in heaven, I can't believe it is so light compare to my old one. It fits very good but I think after break-in it will fit perfectly. So far, I am only do general break-in like the manual on Chibabogu. the futon is thick, very thick. It doesn't feel like steel plate but more like cushion. I will put it into action this Saturday.

Dealing with Komoto-san is very relaxing and comfortable. Every email was replied ASAP with good answer. Several times, the emails were answered right away like live chat. Some one over Japan gives him a good hug for me please.

I'm sure it's a very nice pair of kote, just be sure to keep the kote away from those dammed cats from a thread which i remember you started!

[JSchmidt]

Ra Ra Ra Ra Ra, dancing around the fire under the Moon naked. I got the Kote.

Option I have:
Deer Skin with deer hair Kashira
Tsuba gusset on both kote
Extra padding on left kote

Congrats, but why the extra padding on the left?

[kanyil]

Congrats!

The deer hair/clarino combination is great! It's nice and light, but molds well to your hands. You'll grow to love it so much that you may eventually abandon your other kotes.

Come your next practice you'll be doubly impressed with how fast it dries. mwa ha ha ha~

I got the extra padding on the left kote as well. Mainly because I do nito sometimes. But I would still get it if I was an itto only kind of guy, since it's extra protection at no extra cost! :D

[LNGUYEN]

I'm sure it's a very nice pair of kote, just be sure to keep the kote away from those dammed cats from a thread which i remember you started!

Those cats will be in hell if they ever lay their eyes on my Kote. In general, over my dead body.

And why I chose extra padding on left? I just think about symmetrical. I hate to see if it is not. Feel like limbing.

[LNGUYEN]

Congrats LNGUYEN!

Today it finally arrived. Luckly enough, I didn't get screwed by customs. So it'a all good here. All that is left is for my Do to be finished. Well heres a picture.. hope you enjoy.

????? What did you get? What pictures?

[k3narki]

Mine Bogu Set
Boston Bag
Zekken
2x gi
2x hakama
etc,

Just waiting for the Do to be ready. Can't seem to upload pics.

[k3narki]

umm.. u should be able to view them here.

http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tare29oy.jpg
http://img383.imageshack.us/img383/8030/mine5ek.jpg

[k3narki]

http://img382.imageshack.us/img382/9958/dark0kx.jpg
http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/5295/dark16di.jpg

here are just a few. however i do have more, just PM me if you wanna see more.

[LarsCW]

I'm jealous now.

Looking at *virtual* piggy thinking about breaking it for my own set.

Looking around paranoid for Hai Hai RBSO attack's:rolleyes:

I think I'd better first learn to kendo properly before going for something like this and listen to my sensei

[Andoru]

umm.. u should be able to view them here.

http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tare29oy.jpg
http://img383.imageshack.us/img383/8030/mine5ek.jpg


Give us a review after a month or so. :)

Actually, with the tare, give us the review after 6 months, and then 12 months. You'll notice the difference!

[Walras]

That is hot.

[nebosuke]

Received mine today. Shipping was fast, they sent it out Friday, and it was at my house on Monday. Unfortuantely nobody was home, so I got it today.

First impressions:
The cloth is soft and very flexible. This will be interesting to see how it compares to my old bogu (from eguchi) which is quite stiff.
It appears that they missed the accent color (http://www.chibabogu.com/catalog/popup_image.php?pID=32&image=6) on my men, I haven't been in contact with them yet about that, but it isn't really important. Just one of those small annoyances when you think about the money and reputations involved.
The men fits snugly, but I think it will break in and be great. I was surprised at first, but once tying it on it seemed to get into place.
The kote I am slightly concerned about. Length wise they seem to be perfect, but width wise they are very snug. It's been a while since breaking any in, and I've never had custom made ones, but it is so narrow that my pinky and ring finger end up overlapping when I try to grip. I am hopeful it will work out and be good.
The do is a little different that I expected. Size wise it seems perfect, but haven't practiced in it yet to be sure. It's the color that is unexpected. I opted for rough black (http://www.chibabogu.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=92) because I didn't want a glossy do again. However it really looks more gray than black, I am hoping it doesn't stand out to much, not at all the effect I was after. In photos it looks super gray.
The tare, what is there to say, looks nice, we'll see howthe softness protects.

Tomorrow wil be first practice with it, but the kote wont beput into action yet, still trying to break them in. My fingers are getting tired from it.

I put some photos (http://www.flickr.com/photos/sfvkendo/sets/1377818/) up, probably keep them there for a little while, but not forever.

[DCPan]

The do is a little different that I expected. Size wise it seems perfect, but haven't practiced in it yet to be sure. It's the color that is unexpected. I opted for rough black (http://www.chibabogu.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=92) because I didn't want a glossy do again. However it really looks more gray than black, I am hoping it doesn't stand out to much, not at all the effect I was after. In photos it looks super gray.


Looks like ishime finish to me. Rather than smooth, the surface feels textured, correct?

[nebosuke]

Yes, it is textured, that was understood from the description on their site of "rough" and from the photo they have up. It's just the color that is questionable to me. I'll be able to get a fresh perspective on it today at the dojo, out of my home lighting.

[DCPan]

Yes, it is textured, that was understood from the description on their site of "rough" and from the photo they have up. It's just the color that is questionable to me. I'll be able to get a fresh perspective on it today at the dojo, out of my home lighting.

I don't know if you do iaido or not, but ishime saya vs. kuroro saya are common saya choices that don't cost any extra.

I considered getting ishime saya because finger and hand prints aren't obvious when you are training, but opted out for the "shiny" reason.

Also, there are different grades of ishime finish...I wonder how that affects the shine....

FWIW.

[RC_Kenshi]

When we visited Chiba Bogu, Michael explained one of the downsides of the ishime do is that it's rough enough to scratch other kenshi's do.

Might make you a bit unpopular among others. On the other hand, it may be considered payback to those with overenthusiastic taiatari's.:happy:

RC Kenshi

P.S. The example do with the ishime finish I looked at seemed pretty black to me. But then again, I wasn't looking at it that closely. Have you contacted Chiba Bogu? It is possible they may have sent you the wrong do. Michael is quite helpful, and I'm sure would be able to answer any questions you have.

[k3narki]

Give us a review after a month or so. :)

Actually, with the tare, give us the review after 6 months, and then 12 months. You'll notice the difference!

No problem, i will try to post a review after a few month or two. Not sure exactly how useful my review would be as the only comparison i can refer to is club armour.

Nebosuke: i had the same concern as you regarding the kote, but after breaking it in abit it seems to fit just fine - 6 sessions. The kote protects well and overall very pleased with it. For my men, i noted that i wanted no thread accent at all, however i recieved a blue accent on the ago. You can see this in my pictures above. Personally, im not worried about it and its nothing to create a fuss about.

I hope you enjoy your chibabogu, i luv it !

[LarsCW]

I'm in the process of ordering my Mine bogu now.

I've send the sizing and pictures requested and got a reply the same day cause I also had put in some questions about the lenght of my hakama.

I got some advise about that and send some pics back in full bogu with hakama on measured height so they can advise me how much it can be shortend.

On the bogu part, I'll have to choose about which details.

This is the nice part of all this hard work:D

[LNGUYEN]

Hai Hai is right, too much pain to follow this thread.

[Morvran]

It sounds to me that you want to be a rich-boy show-off. ...

Only got through about five pages of this thread before seeing this comment like 4-5 times. What the hell is wrong with someone being able to pick and choose a design for their bogu? Especially if they have the money to customize it to their liking? Rich-boy show-off? That's like, middle school language. That's something a person would say if they're either a) a teenager or b) someone who doesn't have the money to spend on whatever the item is and for some reason wants to make others feel bad about buying it for themselves. If someone wants to spend a lot of money on a great quality bogu set, more power to them. If someone wants to spend a lot of money on a bogu set so they can feel like they look good, more power to them. It's not going to help them in a match, but it's not hurting anyone either. It seems that to you, anyone who would buy something like this is doing it just to show they have money...a bit judgmental don't you think?

[LarsCW]

Only got through about five pages of this thread before seeing this comment like 4-5 times. What the hell is wrong with someone being able to pick and choose a design for their bogu? Especially if they have the money to customize it to their liking? Rich-boy show-off? That's like, middle school language. That's something a person would say if they're either a) a teenager or b) someone who doesn't have the money to spend on whatever the item is and for some reason wants to make others feel bad about buying it for themselves. If someone wants to spend a lot of money on a great quality bogu set, more power to them. If someone wants to spend a lot of money on a bogu set so they can feel like they look good, more power to them. It's not going to help them in a match, but it's not hurting anyone either. It seems that to you, anyone who would buy something like this is doing it just to show they have money...a bit judgmental don't you think?

I've been working really hard to get the money to do this and I happen to like a plain looking bogu but then maybe they will show a nice option i'll like even more. I just wanna get a high quality piece of bogu which also is comfortable and protects me well besides durable.
Sure I could get a cheaper set and get less complaints from others but I might wouldn't be fully happy and got out to buy something better and have this set laying around the house not getting used in practise.

[Kiso Tatsu]

Hello,

I know that you have done it (but all of them are impossible to open), but please could you post some photos of your Mine bogus bought at Chiba Bogu. I am thinking of buing some, but I want to know it better.
Now I have 4mm bogu bought at Kendo Shop Korea and I am not satisfied with it. Mine Men at Chiba Bogu is very expenssive for my (I am a student with very bad work), but you are saying that it is worth every yen spend.

Thank you very much
Michał

[streetcleaner]

Hello,
Now I have 4mm bogu bought at Kendo Shop Korea and I am not satisfied with it. Mine Men at Chiba Bogu is very expenssive for my (I am a student with very bad work), but you are saying that it is worth every yen spend.

4mm? maybe you should buy kendoshop 2mm men, for example? it costs about 200$ instead of 800$ by chiba and protects well (if sized correcrly). i think there's no reason for student with very bad work spend such a money. but decision is upon you, of course

hmmm... looking at your profile you are the 4th kyu. 4mm is normal for 4th kyu. just ask you partner (they are begiiners too?) not hit that hard

[tantadi]

Hello,

I know that you have done it (but all of them are impossible to open), but please could you post some photos of your Mine bogus bought at Chiba Bogu. I am thinking of buing some, but I want to know it better.
Now I have 4mm bogu bought at Kendo Shop Korea and I am not satisfied with it. Mine Men at Chiba Bogu is very expenssive for my (I am a student with very bad work), but you are saying that it is worth every yen spend.

Thank you very much
Michał
I think beginners should have the best men they can afford, because they practice with other beginners that have little control. But I agree with streetcleaner that you don't have to buy something that is in the most expensive class.

[Kiso Tatsu]

Hello,

Thank you very much, but I have bought one bogu at KendoShop and I won't do this again. I have to say that it is crap. Badly shaped and so on. It is really better to buy someting from Japan.

I have updated my profile and something chenged from last time (informations were from a year ago). I have started to train with better persons, go to semminars and shiais. And now I am thinking of some better men. My is really heavy and uncomfortable. And I thing it is better to collect some money and buy something better and use it for 10 years than buying the men I will have to change in 2 years time.

But I will replay my question, culd somebody post some photos of Mine Men and Kote.

Thank you :)

[LarsCW]

Hello,

Thank you very much, but I have bought one bogu at KendoShop and I won't do this again. I have to say that it is crap. Badly shaped and so on. It is really better to buy someting from Japan.

I have updated my profile and something chenged from last time (informations were from a year ago). I have started to train with better persons, go to semminars and shiais. And now I am thinking of some better men. My is really heavy and uncomfortable. And I thing it is better to collect some money and buy something better and use it for 10 years than buying the men I will have to change in 2 years time.

But I will replay my question, culd somebody post some photos of Mine Men and Kote.

Thank you :)

I think the best you could do is email Micheal at Chiba and he'll be more then welcome to explain anything I'm sure.

[nebosuke]

Hello,

But I will replay my question, culd somebody post some photos of Mine Men and Kote.

Here are a few. Nothing great, not much light in here for shooting dark indigo obkects so the depth of field is small, and they are a bit grainy.

Men 01 (http://homepage.mac.com/sosb/.Pictures/chibabogu/men01.jpg)
Men 02 (http://homepage.mac.com/sosb/.Pictures/chibabogu/men02.jpg)
Men 03 (http://homepage.mac.com/sosb/.Pictures/chibabogu/men03.jpg)
Kote 01 (http://homepage.mac.com/sosb/.Pictures/chibabogu/kote01.jpg)
Kote 02 (http://homepage.mac.com/sosb/.Pictures/chibabogu/kote02.jpg)
Kote 03 (http://homepage.mac.com/sosb/.Pictures/chibabogu/kote03.jpg)
Kote 04 (http://homepage.mac.com/sosb/.Pictures/chibabogu/kote04.jpg)

[LarsCW]

Finally got the whole ordering part done now so the time of waiting has started.

The do will be a 64 piece bamboo do-dai from shouryuu with a taller and wider mune. I'm really looking forward to it all and will post some pictures once I have the bogu.

The men, kote and tare should come sooner then the do because I have ordered it a few weeks earlier to think some more about the choices I had for the do and the manufacturing of the do takes 3 months. Still I think it will all be worth waiting.

[Commander]

Heh good for you Lars.

My men should arrive here beginning of July.

Exciting eh :D