Association of Grade and Kendo

[Sentunim]

I was wondering, what is a normal grade associated with certain parts of kendo?

Such as, what grade are most people by the time they:

Wear Hakama/Gi?
Wear Part Bogu?
Wear Full Bogu?
Participate in Tournaments?

Is it different everywhere? I'd assume so, but hey, I'm a newb.

[Kirin]

Usually ranks are awarded after you are in full bogu.
In general, lowest rank for adult is 6kyu (in bogu and can do basic men)

If you see any dojo starting with 10 or 8 kyu, the dojo is more commercial/ non-traditional kendo dojo. They just want testing fees :redface:
(one really good way to determine legit dojo or not)

Regarding participating tounaments, if you are in bogu and know proper shai reiho (tournament etiquete) you should be eligible.

[Sentunim]

Well here is something weird. My dojo must truly be unique. There are no testing fees there, however, the lowest grade I have seen is 8th kyu given to some people who recently started. I am 5th kyu, but I don't even have a hakama/gi.

Is this strange or normal. I guess we have a rather small group of people, and less who go regularly.

[Old Warrior]

"If you see any dojo starting with 10 or 8 kyu, the dojo is more commercial/ non-traditional kendo dojo. They just want testing fees
(one really good way to determine legit dojo or not)"

Please forgive me, but this is nonsense. At $28/ft. plus common area charges for rent, you can't run a school with full time 5th dan+ instructors without revenues. Learning Kendo is a privilege, that comes at a price. Just because one is a member of a commercial dojo does not mean that the quality of the kendo is bad. There are a number of members of this board that have been guests at our dojang and I think everyone would attest to the quality of what we are taught. The test fees are just part of the tuition and testing serves a real purpose when most of the students are teenagers.

[Kirin]

In US, each regional federations regulates ranks under supervison of AUSKF.
Our federation SWKIF (Southwest Kendo & Iaido Federation) general provisions states,
The recognized grades for which examinations shall be taken are comprised to 6-kyu rans and 8-dan ranks. The dan/kyu grades shall be granted by representative organization according to the overall ability of grantee and shall be mutually recognized as being equivalent among organizations. 1-kyu is required before testing for 1-dan (shodan) per IKF guidelines.

Testing Fees are;
Kyu age 17 and under $10, Kyu age 18 and over $20, Dan (1-4) $30

Testing Criteria ;
6-2-kyu jikeiko, kirikaeshi (kihon uchikomi)
1-kyu jikeiko, kirikaeshi kendo kata (1-3) & written exam
1-dan jikeiko, kirikaeshi kendo kata (1-5) & written exam
2-dan jikeiko, kirikaeshi kendo kata (1-7) & written exam
3,4-dan jikeiko, kirikaeshi kendo kata (1-10) & written exam

I am 5th kyu, but I don't even have a hakama/gi.
Fmmm... I do not know Canadian regulations, but in US, it is require to do jikeiko for 5-kyu. wonder how you can do jikeiko w/o bogu.....

Please forgive me, but this is nonsense. At $28/ft. plus common area charges for rent, you can't run a school with full time 5th dan+ instructors without revenues
wow expensive!! do you pay your sensei too? :rolleyes:
Just because one is a member of a commercial dojo does not mean that the quality of the kendo is bad. There are a number of members of this board that have been guests at our dojang and I think everyone would attest to the quality of what we are taught.
Soo true.
The test fees are just part of the tuition and testing serves a real purpose when most of the students are teenagers
NO and Yes.
Testings are conducted by your regional federation, not by each dojo.
Testing fee should not be part of your dojo's operational cost (rent, pay to sensei....etc)

[Nishi]

Ive been a member of the BKA and now the CKF and the rules are the same for both. Every grade below Ikkyu (1st Kyu) is the responsibility of each individual dojo.

I have found this though...some schools do suppress the student, and drag things out for ages, other clubs are empowering and encourage the student to set there own goals, and encourage them to decide when they will acheive self set objectives. These students often decide when they will test, while suppresive schools control when you grade by "granting permission". This is often abused.

Personally I was in hakama 2nd week, bogu by week 4, and was permitted to grade and compete at my will. The first words out of my mouth were "no way, I need training" The dojo I started in, has always had a 'yes you can' approach, for grading and competition. They would also say "yes you can' when I was about to collapse from kakarigeiko, there is a relationship there.

Out of interest (http://www.kendo.org.uk/articles/gradingletter.shtml)

[JSchmidt]

I'm with David on this one. I strongly believe that the whole 6th-2nd kyu grading system is holding people back...it's simply setting the targets too low.

Jakob

[kendokamax]

I totaly agree,

I have heard horror story about people (1-2 year of kendo) training in japan and not being permited by their country federation to grade for like 1st or 2nd dan, because they would become as high as the top teachers in theyr respective countries.

[cst]

Kirin...maybe you should try to devote your whole existence to the martial arts and try opening a kendo school on your own...When you are trying to live off the generosity of others...it aint that easy....But no one here is questioning your kendo and intent to teach others....You just have to eat more than a Big Mac everyday...

[AlexM]

Well here is something weird. My dojo must truly be unique. There are no testing fees there, however, the lowest grade I have seen is 8th kyu given to some people who recently started. I am 5th kyu, but I don't even have a hakama/gi.

Is this strange or normal. I guess we have a rather small group of people, and less who go regularly.

Ignore everything being said by the Americans regarding gradings, they work with a different system then the CKF does.

You should NEVER be charged for a grading in Canada below ikkyu. The dojo rank means very little, if anything at all: Don't pay for something worthless. Rank and getting bogu aren't really that related. At my first "grading" I received 3rd kyu and THEN got into bogu. Other dojo may require bogu for grading.

All the stages of development you spoke of earlier depend on each individual dojo, and sometimes on each individual situation. At one time a dojo gives bogu quickly and at others not so quickly.

You're looking for some kind of guiding principal (rank as related to equipment) that doesn't exist.

Kyu grades are practically irrelevant in Canada.

[nodachi]

I'm with David on this one. I strongly believe that the whole 6th-2nd kyu grading system is holding people back...it's simply setting the targets too low.

Jakob

I was under the impression that the kyu grades were meant for younger children. Of course all dojos and federations are different, but an adult can wait a year or years between tests so they can go after higher ranks and ignore lots of the kyu ranks. I am used to people starting their tests at ikkyu. Adults/older children have the patience to see their gradual improvement over long periods of time. However, children need some tangible set of benchmarks so they can feel that they are improving. Extreme example, but a 5 dan can wait 5 years before testing and feel that they are learning and their effort is leading them to something better. Children need much shorter, smaller goals to feel progress. Otherwise they get discouraged or lose interest because it feels like an impossible task to "level up".

[Kirin]

I see .... BKA and CKF has totally diffrent concept of grading. :rolleyes:

But I know AUSKF format (lower kyu ranks are regional federation's responsibility not dojo) is just as same from AJKF.

I wonder how many countries are similar to CKF testing guidelines.....

[Neil Gendzwill]

Our testing guidelines correspond roughly to IKF guidelines. Ikkyu is the first real grade. Anything below that is dojo responsibility. Most don't bother for adults. In Saskatoon, we use a 6 kyu system for our kids. 6 kyu is beginner, 5 kyu means basic suburi and etiquette learned, 4 kyu means able to wear bogu. For adults we just have one test, whether they can wear bogu or not, so if they ask what rank that means we tell them 4 kyu.

[Nishi]

I was under the impression that the kyu grades were meant for younger children.

Ive seen kyu grades used for kids, I think its a good thing, it really teaches goal setting, hard work, and reward. For adults we used a kyu grade system as an excuse to have mock gradings that would emulate the BKA gradings, this was really to teach the grading format, just like we would teach kata, or kote-men. These were open-gradings and the kenshi testing could achieve a random kyu based on performance. The grade would stay the same or rise, but never drop. By the time they decided they where ready for ikkyu, they had seen and participated in something similar....helps the nerves.

[Hai_hai]

Well here is something weird. My dojo must truly be unique. There are no testing fees there, however, the lowest grade I have seen is 8th kyu given to some people who recently started. I am 5th kyu, but I don't even have a hakama/gi.

Is this strange or normal. I guess we have a rather small group of people, and less who go regularly.
I think you'll encounter testing fees if you're testing to get a menjo from your federation. Somebody's gotta pay for that paper.

[taganahan]

i don't think the senseis in my dojo gets paid. i've heard from some of the people from my dojo that our sensei do it as a volunteer thing.

~taganahan

[Neil Gendzwill]

i don't think the senseis in my dojo gets paid. i've heard from some of the people from my dojo that our sensei do it as a volunteer thing.
Nobody in Canada gets paid. But still, money is required to cover practice space rental and other costs. When we run a grading in Saskatoon, we have to pay transportation, accomodation and meals for the sensei. This comes out of the seminar and grading fees we charge. The federation incurs costs for maintaining the records and issuing certificates, so they charge certificate fees. Excess fees go into club or federation coffers, where they support kendo in various ways. Even including equipment costs, kendo is a cheap martial art and this is entirely due to the volunteer spirit of the instructors. Buy yours a beer today!

[ben]

Read an interesting quote today attributed to the founder of Goju Ryu karate (Chojun sensei?), "Don't eat from karate." IOW karate shouldn't provide your living. Wow, did THAT ever fall on deaf ears...

b

[Andoru]

Kyu-rank grading requirements in Australia are tougher compared to other countries but I'm sure you guys already know that! ;)