Christ and kendo?

[mystic_kendoka]

my only answer to all that is, that if that were true,, then,,,"You can keep your Trophy, cuz Im not interested".
you fucking prick, thts wht we've been trying to say!

[KhawMengLee]

People, let this thread die.

DaQouturd is a troll. He constantly lies and twists his words to suit his own warped mind. He is a lonely deluded idiot who has no friends. This is his only way to get attention, by making you angry.

Ignore this guy and you'll have no stress...he'll just stew because it will set in that he is a loser with no friends, save his home made klingon dildo.

JUST ADD HIM TO YOUR IGNORE LIST AND LET THIS THREAD DIE!

[DaQo'tah]

MK.......although I have tried to remember that you are young, and that you do not in any way shape or form, represent any face of Kendo, and that I should try to allow you to make the errors that young men make,,,,,


You have just crossed over a line.
I know of very few people inside or outside of the Internet that would put up with any more from you....I regret that I shall now no longer be able to see your posts, but this is as you seem to request...

We.....as it were, are finished speaking with each other.

[DaQo'tah]

KhawMengLee

....

Most of the time, I would challenge you to find any support for the things you have posted about me. But as this too is the last time I need post to you thanks to the Ignore addition, then I cant answer the question I asked myself,; "Whats the point?"

All I can say in parting is this: That you do post a lot on my topic, that every once in a while you posted well, However you too seem bent on crossing a line that MK has crossed with me. I introduced this topic with real questions, that I took to people that I felt at the time might have a history of dealing with the same questions. What I found is two posters that did try to help me keep this topic on target, but they were as ignored as much as I was .

I have never lied on this forum to you.

I have never posted in a way that was not aimed at answering the questions and comments put to me as best I could.

I did not try to use this Kendo forum to shove my religion at you, however this particular topic is dealing with my religion, so it was necessary that I enter a few ideas dealing with the same.

But I posted only what "I believe", never "What you need to believe..."

I did not even for one moment use this Kendo Forum as an outreach of my Religion. I did not tell people to ever once to change their Faith to my faith. I never suggested that people read their bible, or if they didnt have a bible to go get one.

I never have used this forum in any way other that what it is set up to do, namely: To help people with their questions about Kendo related topics.

Now whether you guys can understand this or not. There are people that come to Kendo with some very deep questions dealing with some things dealing with the whole "chi" subject. I do not believe that the "Just do what you are told by your teachers" is a good enough answer when a person is looking for more concrete answers.

But, what I have ended up with is an understanding that this "chi" stuff that some teachers in Kendo seem to center their teachings on, can be re-interpreted by the Christian believer into something that does no harm to the Kendo lessons, yet is actually able to bind the Christian closer to his Lord.

However,,,,,it takes a bit of work to pull off,,,,,because "Chi" is not a Christian idea, but like both December 25 and the celebration of Easter, can be adopted into a more Christian frame of life.


KhawMengLee
I regret haveing to add you to my list with that other kid,,,,

[Wout]

MK.......although I have tried to remember that you are young, and that you do not in any way shape or form, represent any face of Kendo, and that I should try to allow you to make the errors that young men make,,,,,


You have just crossed over a line.
I know of very few people inside or outside of the Internet that would put up with any more from you....I regret that I shall now no longer be able to see your posts, but this is as you seem to request...

We.....as it were, are finished speaking with each other.
Ehm have you ever met mystic kendoka, ehm... no

Have you ever done kendo? ...... ehm that's also a negative


So actually you are comparing one thing you don't know about with something else you don't know about.

Granted that what mystic said was not very nice, but it is what I feel about you too (maybe not in those wordings). I've been trying to tell you that you can't go doing kendo thinking that 'you know best' because you will miss out on a lot of things Simply because you THINK they do not apply to you.

Actually you do the same to kendo than to mystic.

BTW how old are YOU Da'Qo'tah I would bet 40'ish because you seem like the kind of person who said to himself 'now I've seen enought to this world, I know everything and nothing surprises me anymore'.

I call it the old mens disease, but it also happens with ppl in their late teens who confuse it with maturity, while it is actually the saddest thing that could happen in my book: not being able to learn because you don't want to admit you'er seeing new things.

Maybe now you understand my sig a bit better, I can be interested by the littlest things, like a child I always want to find out how and why.

[mystic_kendoka]

wout, have u seen his picture?

http://daqotahforge.tripod.com/
his dumb website, he makes swords by cutting them out of sheets of steel...

[Wout]

first that's not making swords that's figure makin.

bytheway, I noticed he has an adbar that promises college-degrees without 'ever setting foot in a university', hmm that seems as likely as knowing kendo without ever setting foot in a dojo to me.

AH yeah life and it's little ironies, reality is sometimes better than the best made-up joke

[Wout]

damn it was not a fixed adbar, but it was funny when I first got there

[neokensei]

Damned link! Now there's a face to go with all those pro-Imperial America posts instead of the image of a retarded penguin! AAAAAGH! :smoker:

Pax et bonum y'all

(P.S., after that post with Pax Americana...I just can't help but join in the bashing...)

(P.P.S. heheheh...is this where people release their day to day frustrations...maybe instead of cursing Daqotah...y'all should be thanking him for being the ever gracious makiwara/wooden dummy/hitting post)

[DaQo'tah]

Ehm have you ever met mystic kendoka, ehm... no

I believe that I have never met anyone on this forum in person. And this is one of the joys and problems of the Internet, the fact that I can get to know people from all over the world is great, but then again, I only get to know them from their words and the style they post in,,,past that I have no clue what you people are really like. Thats why each one of us has to always make sure we put our best foot foward. I try to always remember that each of my posts will be about all you will ever know of me, therefore that must try to reflect who I really am,,,I also expect your posts to truly reflect who you really are ....







Granted that what mystic said was not very nice, but it is what I feel about you too (maybe not in those wordings).

You have every right to judge me according to my postings, for I invite you to take any of my postings and set it up as reflective of who I really am and what I am like,,,But then again, I must have the right also to take the posts that have been aimed at me and use them to judge if the other person is the type of person who is going to pop up on my computer screen, Thats the KEY thing to remember,,,No one on the Kendo forum has a "right" to post here,,,,we all only have the "CHANCE" to post, subject to a great many things,,,one of the things is that any other person has always the ability to place a name on Ignore,,,,This fact is meant to keep everyone from making personal attacks on other people,,,,we are all just guests here, all have the same rights,,,actually, we all have the same "lack" of rights,,,as such we are equal and should treat eachother as equals.





I've been trying to tell you that you can't go doing kendo thinking that 'you know best' because you will miss out on a lot of things Simply because you THINK they do not apply to you.


I agree,,,I dont go into Kendo thinking I know better,,,thats the point in going there to "learn" things I dont know.....If I knew all there was to know, what would be the point in all this?

I have over and over explaned that I fully expect my Kendo teachers to work to train my body and my mind to do good Kendo...I will work at this as hard as I can...I have never said I had a problem with any parts of the actually sparing and the learning stuff....I have only said that i dont seek to know anything that is against my Faith,,,thats all,,I expect the next guy in the class to feel the same way,,,I dont go to a Dojo to teach him what God to believe in, so dont go trying to teach me, okay?






BTW how old are YOU Da'Qo'tah I would bet 40'ish because you seem like the kind of person who said to himself 'now I've seen enought to this world, I know everything and nothing surprises me anymore'.

well....not much actually surprises me about the way some have acted here,,,I expect to never be treated better by the World than my master was treated, (and they killed him)




Maybe now you understand my sig a bit better, I can be interested by the littlest things, like a child I always want to find out how and why.


What I understand is just how deeply some posters will go to make others look bad....I know what depths some will go to,,,I am surprised at the cussing...thats something I didn't see coming here, I thought kendo people were not so,,,,well....in the gutter...I thought that kendo was bringing in a higher class....But ,,,live and learn. Im also surprised at the way some act when they have had enough of a topic,,,I have been On-line for years, and a member of many forums,,,,But when I see a poster i dont like, I just place him on Ignor and get on with my life,..I just find another topic,,,I dont try to "Kill" a topic...because I dont know what new things might come about soon,,I dont know who might be new to the forum and have important things to add to a conversation I have left...,I dont seem to need to try to get everyone else to think the same as I do,,,,

[DaQo'tah]

(P.S., after that post with Pax Americana...I just can't help but join in the bashing...)



I invented that term....I didnt copy that idea from anyone,,,and it's cool that one small set of words that I made up only because it fit the context of that sentence, could be so easly remembered by so many people....

[Eiliries]

well....not much actually surprises me about the way some have acted here,,,I expect to never be treated better by the World than my master was treated, (and they killed him)





Your "Master"? That's a little more info. than we needed, please keep your SM experiences to yourself from now on, there are kids and sensitive souls on this forum.

[DaQo'tah]

Your "Master"?

Yes , as in...

MATTHEW 10:24

[Kenshin Axel]

Hmmm, yes......

Did you ever meet your "Master"?
Or do you just assume he's your master cause you read a book?

[DaQo'tah]

Good question....
Christ talks about in the Bible that he "Stands at the door and knocks", and it is up to us to open the door to our hearts and lives. Christ does not force you to believe in him,,,he stands outside your life and knocks,,,,We all gets to hear the knock of Jesus,,,but not all open the door to their hearts enough to allow Christ to enter...


What I believe is true for the Christian, is that we fulfill the words spoken by Christ when he said that, "His sheep" would hear his call, and come to him.

If you do not hear "His call" on your heart, then perhaps you are not one of his sheep?

I dont know, all I do know is that the Lord has spoken to us, and has died for us, and we can believe and find life in him, or we can not believe and seek whatever elses we want....

I believe, I have life in Christ...

[Kenshin Axel]

This post is being edited

[Kimpatsu]

hi this is DaQo'tah

Im a Christian, so I dont go in for all the "inner force" stuff that so many in Kendo seem to push on students....

Im thinking about starting to take a beginners Kendo class this winter, but from what I have read about some of the ideas behind Kendo, Im not sure how my Christian faith will be able to sit still ....

I have been reading about some of the ways guys from Japan have for prayer or meditation,,,and it seems to go very much against my views as a Born-Again Christian....also if my kendo teacher tries to push that type of teaching on me, I may very well feel the need to "correct" his teachings to the class.

How do Christians work and learn within a system that seems very far from the cross of Christ...

I want to learn kendo,,,,I just dont want to have to listen to any stuff that goes against my Christian faith.....

How is this done?Why do you beleive something that is patently untrue? The Xian god is no more than a descendant of Yahvism, which in turn grew out of near- and middle-Eastern henotheism when the Jews were at a strong point in their chequered history.
Rather than trying to reconcile kendo practice with nutty religions, you might be better off examining the religion. If you're intellectually honest about it, the religious "faith" (which, I suspect without even reading your bio is really just an generational meme) you claim to have will disappear like all Xian arguments when put under the microscope.

[Kimpatsu]

Good question....
Christ talks about in the Bible that he "Stands at the door and knocks", and it is up to us to open the door to our hearts and lives. Christ does not force you to believe in him,,,he stands outside your life and knocks,,,,We all gets to hear the knock of Jesus,,,but not all open the door to their hearts enough to allow Christ to enter...


What I believe is true for the Christian, is that we fulfill the words spoken by Christ when he said that, "His sheep" would hear his call, and come to him.

If you do not hear "His call" on your heart, then perhaps you are not one of his sheep?

I dont know, all I do know is that the Lord has spoken to us, and has died for us, and we can believe and find life in him, or we can not believe and seek whatever elses we want....

I believe, I have life in Christ...So you admit to being a sheep? Try thinking for yourself, instead.
Do you realise that if you had been born in the Middle East instead of in North America, you'd be a Muslim...

[Kimpatsu]

Yes , as in...
MATTHEW 10:24Quoting from a political manifesto written to make the Jews feel better about themselves under the Roman occupation serves no purpose. Supply evidence that the events described therein actually happened; otherwise, the text is inadmiisable.
BTW, if you take Matt. 10;24 to heart, you should do what your Kenso master tells you...

[Kimpatsu]

wout, have u seen his picture?

http://daqotahforge.tripod.com/
his dumb website, he makes swords by cutting them out of sheets of steel...Ironic, he claims he's a Xian, but he wants to live in the world of Star Trek, which is resolutely non-Theistic.

[Marine_Boy]

God has answered my prayer and his messenger is Tony! :smiley:

Let shorinji kempo kick ass! :devious:

Ps, Kimpatsu, how have you been lately.

[DaQo'tah]

Kimpatsu
...Help us out here,,,

What is it about Jesus Christ and the Christian faith that seems to force you to try to get people to stop believeing in him?

What is it?....I have been told over and over that no one in Kendo will try to change my religion, nor criticize the faith that I have in Jesus Christ, and then here you turn around and totally contradict what everyone has told me so far?....

What gives?...

You just cant stand to see a Confident person with a Christian faith or something?...

Why are so so against the "Live and let live" attitude that others are carefull to maintain?

[Kenshin Axel]

I completely respect people being Christian, it's just that I find it kinda funny when theres somebody like Ned Flanders, who acts as if they've met God.
I mean, how can you be so very very sure?
Did you see Jesus resurrect?
For or you know the Christian Faith could all be just a very very big rumour, but thats the same with all other religion.

[webjunkie401]

This thread has so little to do anymore with the subject title it's not even funny.

Anyway, simple wanted to address this:

" For or you know the Christian Faith could all be just a very very big rumour, but thats the same with all other religion."

I think the key word here is faith. Yes I will readily admit that what I believe could be completely and totally wrong, but I believe it to be otherwise.

[Nanbanjin]

I completely respect people being Christian, it's just that I find it kinda funny when theres somebody like Ned Flanders, who acts as if they've met God.
I mean, how can you be so very very sure?
Did you see Jesus resurrect?
For or you know the Christian Faith could all be just a very very big rumour, but thats the same with all other religion.
Some people create God in their own image.
This is one of the biggest sins of all. Don't seek God. Seek truth and you will find God.

[DCPan]

I mean, how can you be so very very sure?
Did you see Jesus resurrect?

That's why it's faith.


Did you see Jesus resurrect?

I often like to ask my other Christian friends if they know and can prove Noah's Ark exist, would they tell the world? (To see where they stand).

I personally wouldn't even if I could. And here's why.

Abridged version of a story from my world religions class in college which I "really" liked.

One day, there was a man carrying a torch and a bucket of water down the street.

Somebody asked him, "Why are you carrying a bucket of water?"

Man, "I will use this bucket of water to douse the flames of hell so no one shall go to my father in fear..."

Someone else asked him, "Why the torch then?"

Man, "I will use this torch to burn the riches of heaven so no one shall go to my father in greed..."



For or you know the Christian Faith could all be just a very very big rumour.

Go rent the movie "Secondhand Lions". There's a great line in there where the boy's uncle tells the kid, "There comes a time in your life when you have to distinguish between what is true and what is worth believing in..." (or something like that)

Even if it's just a big joke, faith can be its own reward.

While I'm proslytizing...personally, I believe if you really want to promote your religion, you should live your life in such a way that people will be like "WOW, I wanna be like that!"

(or "I wanna be like Mike!" :rolleyes: )

Until you can practice what you preach, your words will simply fall on deaf ears.

FWIW.

[Nanbanjin]

That's why it's faith.



I often like to ask my other Christian friends if they know and can prove Noah's Ark exist, would they tell the world? (To see where they stand).

I personally wouldn't even if I could....
Settle down there, we don't want this turning into a meaningful theological debate or anything.

[DaQo'tah]

Kenshin Axel
...

You have asked a very good question.

Now if you care to know the answer, then it is already waiting for you in JOHN 20:29

If you care to find out what it says there then go look it up, but if you really dont care about such things, then Im not here to convince you one way or the other.

What we say about this question in the church is this:That "If" you look for God, you will find Him. "If" you seek Him , you will find Him.

Because, (and here is the cool part) , because you will come to see how it was God who was moveing your heart and drawing you closer to Him all along.

We say we are saved by Grace via faith in Him, and that even this "faith" is a "Gift", from God and did not come from ourselves. We are saved by Grace , and not by Works. (Thus I can never say I earned my salvation via my on deeds because the works that I do are "because" I am saved, and were not done to "get" saved.)

This also is why I wrote that I can NEVER say I am better that you or anyone else, I cant judge myself like that. All I can do is tell you that Im saved.....That Im forgiven....

[mystic_kendoka]

Because, (and here is the cool part) , because you will come to see how it was God who was moveing your heart and drawing you closer to Him all along.

We say we are saved by Grace via faith in Him, and that even this "faith" is a "Gift", from God and did not come from ourselves.

this is stupid.. (are we allowed to swear in the flames section?)

[not-I]

this is stupid.. (are we allowed to swear in the flames section?)
Kenshin & Mystic,

I feel like a voice in the wilderness here, but why waste your words, time & energy? It's not like he's actually listening to anybody anyway. I mean, for Pete's sake, he even trolls the Christian forums (http://bibleforums.org/forum/showthread.php?t=9032).

In theory, it would be possible to have a KWF discussion about faith and to see Christianity presented in intelligent and thoughtful ways such as David was doing, but atm that's very unlikely. Our stowaway will just start spamming again and bait newbies into another flame-war.

Have you noticed that the more people ignore him, the less he posts? Try it, it's the wisest course. If he still gets your goose enough to want to "do" something, then disapprove of his posts with the "reputation" thingie. And if you're still hopping mad, try some suburi. :wink:

But for Christ's sake, stop feeding him. (pun intended)

Yours in kendo.

[mystic_kendoka]

It's not like he's actually listening to anybody anyway.
this guy has me on his ignore list,

MK.......although I have tried to remember that you are young, and that you do not in any way shape or form, represent any face of Kendo, and that I should try to allow you to make the errors that young men make,,,,,

You have just crossed over a line.
I know of very few people inside or outside of the Internet that would put up with any more from you....I regret that I shall now no longer be able to see your posts, but this is as you seem to request...

he cant read it anyway.. im telling you guys.. LOL




If he still gets your goose enough to want to "do" something, then disapprove of his posts with the "reputation" thingie.
says i have to give reputation to other ppl b4 i can give it to him again...

[moetl]

hey guys,

you know what? DaQo'tah thinks it's good how these forum members react to his posts. in fact, i believe he thinks it's very amusing how we try to "correct" him. he directed the criticism to a level that suits and pleases him:
You know what?....I think is very good the way people are dusting off their bibles and looking up a verse here, and verse there......everyone all so interested to quoteing the most "on target" Bible verse.....

Yes, it's actually very interesting the way so many are able to bring their own ideas about the Christian Faith into the Kendo Forum. I believe this is all well and good for even if people are looking to counter my understanding of something, the way their counter my arguements with a Bible verse or two of their own, (Or in the case of gsx1100s, more than two) has got to be something that is pleasing to our Lord.
imagine this situation: you (=poster) want to pick on your sibling(=DaQo'tah) but s/he just stays calm and doesn't react to your attempts. it simply won't work out. it's as easy as that.

ultimately, you don't want to argue with a person who believes that non-christians are "the lost", implying that they haven't yet realised that they are on a "false" path and hence their statements are not regarded as of equal value.
I believe Christian should Never claim to be "better" than the Lost.

like i felt a strong urge to reply to this thread, i'm sure most other posters here still feel the need to correct DaQo'tah. i will not post here again - please also try to fight your urge to post here. it's already clear that this thread won't lead anywhere.


everyone chill down :cool:

[moetl]

arrgh edit time over..

imagine this situation: you (=poster) want to pick on your sibling(=DaQo'tah) but s/he just stays calm and doesn't react to your attempts. your goal to annoy your sibling will result in you being annoyed. you get even angrier and want to pick on your sibling even more. s/he still doesn't react etc. it's an vicious circle.
exactly this is happening in this thread! open your eyes (and stop posting)!!!!!!

ps: trust me on the sibling-thing. i'm an expert :cheeky:

[mystic_kendoka]

"ps: trust me on the sibling-thing. i'm an expert"

"imagine this situation: you (=poster) want to pick on your sibling"

you bully...

[Skolld]

[QUOTE=DaQo'tah]Kenshin Axel
...

You have asked a very good question.

Now if you care to know the answer, then it is already waiting for you in JOHN 20:29

If you care to find out what it says there then go look it up, but if you really dont care about such things, then Im not here to convince you one way or the other."(end quote=DaQo'tah)




So i have a verse for you, Dhammapada verse 19. look it up.

sorry couldn't resist

[DaQo'tah]

So i have a verse for you, Dhammapada verse 19. look it up.


I never tell people what to do,,,I dont tell people what to believe in,,I never tell them to even read the bible that I trust so much...

I try not to quote word for word from the Bible in an answer to someone. What I try to do is just post the address of an important bible verse, and allow the person to look it up on their own if that wish to.
That way you can never say that I was pushing my religion onto others,,,for I dont do that. I post things and just tell people that: "If you are interested, then go check it out for yourself, but if you are not interested, then forget it"

(oh , and by the way, Im not interested in Dham 19. but thanks anyway..LOL)

[DaQo'tah]

Kenshin & Mystic,
I mean, for Pete's sake, he even trolls the christian forums.

Thanks for the link.

I did not think we were allowed to link to Christian sites here on Kendo Forum. But I guess we can now?

On most other forums they take a dim view of posting the address of other forums. Good to know that we can start posting addys now...

thanks again.

[Skolld]

I never tell people what to do,,,I dont tell people what to believe in,,I never tell them to even read the bible that I trust so much...

I try not to quote word for word from the Bible in an answer to someone. What I try to do is just post the address of an important bible verse, and allow the person to look it up on their own if that wish to.
That way you can never say that I was pushing my religion onto others,,,for I dont do that. I post things and just tell people that: "If you are interested, then go check it out for yourself, but if you are not interested, then forget it"

(oh , and by the way, Im not interested in Dham 19. but thanks anyway..LOL)

You see DaQo'tah, this is what one would call a joke, I know you have no interest in other religions and God forbid you read another religious text, but the Dhammapada as you may not know (your ignorance of world religion has plagued us here way too long) is a Buddhist text with much wisdom in it. I know, I know you'll just call it "worldly wisdom" or perhaps words of the devil or some such fundamentalist chatter and quote something from Mattew or Paul i suppose, but for the rest of the forum goers i've chosen to quote the verse here for their amusement.

"Even if he is fond of quoting appropriate texts, the thoughtless man who does not put them into practice himself is like cowherd counting other people's cows, not a partner in the Holy Life." 19

:ko:

[DaQo'tah]

Skolld
.....Im glad you have a religion that you feel happy with,,,,

I have never told others that they should read my bible,,,I have never told others that they should believe in my religion...I have never asked anyone to do anything...

But all I have asked is that others do the same.....is this asking too much?

I dont want to be told that I "have" to believe in something inorder to do kendo.

I dont want to be asked to "believe" in the ideas of "chi" or any of that stuff.....thats all Im asking....to be allowed to learn kendo, and to be allowed to post on this Kendo Forum free from being asked to believe things that stand against my own religion, as I have always stayed away from asking others to do things that are against their own religion.

This is the base for the Golden Rule that I keep dealing with matters of personal faith.-...I will treat you the way I would have you treat me.


You can go right ahead and post all the verses from whatever Holy Book you are pushing,,,I dont care,,,,all I ask is to be given the same chance to post my own verses, as well as the freedom to ignore all such things because they are "meaningless' to me...

[Tholon]

Oh shit!

Isn't this thread dead yet? Is it an example om eternity?

[DaQo'tah]

eternity?

When my dad was a young man just out of the army, a doctor once told my dad that he needed to stop smokeing and drinking and staying out too late.

The doctor said that if my dad did stop doing all them bad things, that he could live a long time.

My dad answered that if he did stop doing all them things, it might just "seem" to be a long time....

[gsx1100s]

As I can't read the rubbish our puritanical God botherer is typing I thought I'd pop in a joke . Maybe to steer the thread off the idiot and regain some sanity.


What did St Patrick say to the snakes as he drove them out of Ireland?

"Are you alright there in the back boys??"

lol

cheers Michael

[DaQo'tah]

the rubbish our puritanical God botherer is typing


I read this over a few times,,,and Im not still sure who you called "Puritanical"...is it me, or is it God?

Im not too sure I have even been called "Puritanical" before,,,that would be a new one...LOL

[Kote-Men]

well a loooong time ago, (when I used to go to church) I was sickened at what happend at a picnic...

The whole church was going up for like a 7 hour ride to Virginia for a picnic. On the way there, a 70 year old man in our van died. Instead of bringing him back to his wife back at home, we went on, through my protest, because 'he was in a better place and we should be happy that he died.' What the (#*&$&R? I mean his wife thinks all is well and we didn't even give her a telephone call:" Hey by the way your loving husband died in a van but we're gonna take his corpse up to virginia because aren't we all happy? He died and now he's in heaven :)." So we went up to Virginia and had the picnic while his corpse rotted in the van. We slept over night then came back and told the dead man's wife... She wasn't that happy.

From that point on I was re-baptised... As an athiest.



I strongly question God now, that experience frightened me.

[Atama]

well a loooong time ago, (when I used to go to church) I was sickened at what happend at a picnic...

The whole church was going up for like a 7 hour ride to Virginia for a picnic. On the way there, a 70 year old man in our van died. Instead of bringing him back to his wife back at home, we went on, through my protest, because 'he was in a better place and we should be happy that he died.' What the (#*&$&R? I mean his wife thinks all is well and we didn't even give her a telephone call:" Hey by the way your loving husband died in a van but we're gonna take his corpse up to virginia because aren't we all happy? He died and now he's in heaven :)." So we went up to Virginia and had the picnic while his corpse rotted in the van. We slept over night then came back and told the dead man's wife... She wasn't that happy.

From that point on I was re-baptised... As an athiest.



I strongly question God now, that experience frightened me.




Are seriously trying to tell us that your church group spent the night in a van with a corpse ...smells a lil funny to me.

And if it is true you where in a van with some very iresponsible idiots who shouldn't be allowed to organise any outtings.

Also you can't judge every christian by the actions of a few misguided individuals and this aplies to people from any religion.

Lisa

[Marine_Boy]

Ok this thread has gone on for too long.

I suggest that the moderators ban daqotah from this website. He is not contributing anything proactive to this forum nor is he attempting to.

Afterall it is a "KENDO" forum and not a place for some over zealous christian to vent his rantings.

Ban him now.

[DaQo'tah]

rantings.

"Rantings?......I have answered questions ...I have had to overlook many harsh personal attacks as I have stood up for what I believe...However I dont believe I have ever posted one word that could be called a "rantings"...

If you have something in mind that I have writen, then name it and I will go have a look at what I have writen and see if perhaps you are correct.

But try to remember, this topic has been moved to the "FLAMES" section of the forum. As such there is a clear warning at the beginning of this whole "FLAMES section that tells the guest that this part of the Kendo Forum is not like the rest of the forum. Here we are warned that many of the posts found here would have been judged "Offensive" had they been listed on other topics.

Given this fact, given this fact that the leadership of Kendo Forums has clearly warned you about the "Flaming nature" of the posts in this section....then what do you find yourself getting so upset about?

[DaQo'tah]

Kote-Men
....

Just so I understand your post...You are saying you stopped believeing in God, not so much based on the Bible or reason,,but due to the actions of a van filled with people on a 7 hour road trip?

You have every right to believe or not believe,,I support your freedom to decide for yourself and wish you the best in all things.

[Marine_Boy]

"Rantings?......I have answered questions ...I have had to overlook many harsh personal attacks as I have stood up for what I believe...However I dont believe I have ever posted one word that could be called a "rantings"...

If you have something in mind that I have writen, then name it and I will go have a look at what I have writen and see if perhaps you are correct.

But try to remember, this topic has been moved to the "FLAMES" section of the forum. As such there is a clear warning at the beginning of this whole "FLAMES section that tells the guest that this part of the Kendo Forum is not like the rest of the forum. Here we are warned that many of the posts found here would have been judged "Offensive" had they been listed on other topics.

Given this fact, given this fact that the leadership of Kendo Forums has clearly warned you about the "Flaming nature" of the posts in this section....then what do you find yourself getting so upset about?

I fully understand that this post has now been moved to the flames section. I am not upset at all. But I find your exsistence on this forum to be completely pointless.

As for "rantings", that is a subjective word and I believe that your posts are rantings as they do not contribute to this forum at all and it seems like you are stuck like a broken record. Therefore, even when you are answering to posts, you still "rant " on.

In all my time on various budo internet forums, I have met pointless people who troll around. You are the worst, as you never back down, compromise, or take the hint that no one likes you around.

Mods, get rid of him please.

[Nanbanjin]

Mods, get rid of him please.
Pretty please.

I remember how much I disliked Yowai when I first signed up to this forum. Thing is I actually started liking him. Why? Because he made intelligent arguments to back up his troll posts. A lot of what he said was well argued and valid criticism.
This new guy detracts much, adds nothing. He's been on my ignore list for a week, but that's like having a turd in the middle of your living room floor and being unable to clean it up. You do your best to ignore it, but it's still a turd and its still there.

[Kote-Men]

a turd in the middle of your living room floor and being unable to clean it up. You do your best to ignore it, but it's still a turd and its still there.:) :) :)

anywayz, yes that corpse in da van story is very very very true.

Da'qotah isn't arragont or intruding. He hasn't become a troll yet because he doesn't post mean things, but I must agree with Mr. Marine Boy that Christianity has nothing at all to do with kendo. Go take some kendo/kumdo lessons, Da'Qotah, then post some useful things. However, DaQotah doesn't deserve to be banned. Yet.

[DaQo'tah]

Marine_Boy
....

If you feel so strongly, I'm led to wonder why you are among the few who seem unable to keep themselves from continually posting to me?

It's like your hooked on my posts like Im a drug and you cant get yourself free....LOL

[DaQo'tah]

Kote-Men
...


good post..

I started this topic with what I felt at the time was a legitimate question,,,and I got some very good advice...(well, here and there),,,however along the way I managed the stir up a lot of anti-christian sentiments from guys who are clearly not into the same faith as I am,,,

I guess this is to be expected,,,

[KhawMengLee]

Com'n guys! Stop feeding the turd!

Every one of his posts are non constructive and non kendo. As Not-I said he loves to hear the sound of his own voice. Getting you pissed off is how he gets his jollies(since no one with a sane mind would sleep with him). He is just a sad, frustrated moron.

If you ignore him, he will go away. If you feed him, he will stay.

[KingCanute]

born again christians are usually far too fundamentalist and narrow minded. Kendo and Christ do not conflict in any way. There is nothing in the Bible to sugget that they do and you just cant reason that there is a problem. Dont make one.

[B0rnAgain]

Daqo’tah,
This message is for Daqo’tah, I felt compiled to Register on these forms just so I can post to you.
First off I must say thank you for staying faithful in Jesus, he will lead you. Always
Remember that he loves you and will always be with you even threw the tough times.

Let me tell you a little about myself,
At age 11 is when I started Martial Arts (Tae Kwon Do), I was not a Christian, I knew who God was, and this guy name Jesus.
But I knew nothing else. At age 18, I asked Jesus into my life, I repented of my sins, I got to know Jesus. I was
Saved in a Church in WV in front of 200 people, It was a day of freedom in my life. I told my Master that I was a Christian, and believed in Jesus. I started to feel that my Master hated me, brushed me off when I would talk to him and would pretend that I was not in the Dojo with him. He even went to as far as not letting me sit by his side before when bowed in anymore. My last class I was at my Master knocked me out. I started to pray and found that is it really worth it, going there? The answer of course was NO!!! So after going to a Dojo for over 10 years, I left. Was
it my Master's plan to get rid of me I will never know, do I hate him, NO, I will cherish the years I was with him and his family, and will pray for him and my forgiveness towards him.

After that happen I started to train on my own in my different styles and people that I knew, but never step foot in a DOJO because of the fear I had. This past 2 months ago I did step foot in a Dojo. A Kumdo dojo, Since then I have grown closer to Jesus. I am excepted at my Dojo as a Christian, there is another strong Christian at the Dojo. A couple days before class started my Master had us do meditation. Do you know what I did, I meditated on the Bible, on versus in the Bible, I talk to GOD! I though of all the wonderful things his had done in my life and keeps doing. I find that it is my Quiet time with Jesus, when I meditated in the Dojo. I understand your fears, believe me I have been there. Don't worry people will make fun of or mock what they do not understand, the only thing you can do is Love them in return, I know that is easier said then done. Always respect your Master, bow before you enter and leave the dojo and to the Master, these are just a sign of respect, there is no witch craft going on with that :) I wish you good luck in your journey. Believe me when I say there is a place for Jesus in Martial arts. So I say to you do not worry about it, Trust in God, you know what is right and wrong let him led you. Maybe God wants you to learn Kendo so that in the future you can have a Dojo of your own and have it be a Christian Dojo (these are my goals in life).

If there is one thing I learned you can't force Christian faith on people, you can't point a gun at someone and tell them to Love God, the only thing you can do is plant a seed. Then maybe one day that seed will grow and they will learn the truth.

And to answer that question I saw some were on the page of this form,
If God made the earth then who made God?
Everything has a beginning and a end to things, there will always be a first and a last to everything in life. So how can you create nothing from something? Or something from nothing. It is like saying what came first the chicken or the egg? People will try to figure
out what is wrong with what we don’t understand or believe.

I will not be posting again so if you feel the urge to flame me or make fun of me, by all means go ahead.
Take care Daqo’tah, I will meet you someday.
I am running the race with you, the road is narrow and the door is small, but I will be at the Throne of GOD!

Your Brother in Christ.

[nodachi]

"If there is one thing I learned you can't force Christian faith on people..."

Here here!!!

Or any religion/philosophy/life system for that matter, so let's just let this thread die. You may burn it, bury it, throw it in the sea or treat it however you will afterwards according to your method of choice.

Just let this thread die. It's wasting precious computer memory better spent on kendo topics.

[Kenji]

Daqo’tah,
This message is for Daqo’tah, I felt compiled to Register on these forms just so I can post to you.
First off I must say thank you for staying faithful in Jesus, he will lead you. Always
Remember that he loves you and will always be with you even threw the tough times.

Let me tell you a little about myself,
At age 11 is when I started Martial Arts (Tae Kwon Do), I was not a Christian, I knew who God was, and this guy name Jesus.
But I knew nothing else. At age 18, I asked Jesus into my life, I repented of my sins, I got to know Jesus. I was
Saved in a Church in WV in front of 200 people, It was a day of freedom in my life. I told my Master that I was a Christian, and believed in Jesus. I started to feel that my Master hated me, brushed me off when I would talk to him and would pretend that I was not in the Dojo with him. He even went to as far as not letting me sit by his side before when bowed in anymore. My last class I was at my Master knocked me out. I started to pray and found that is it really worth it, going there? The answer of course was NO!!! So after going to a Dojo for over 10 years, I left. Was
it my Master's plan to get rid of me I will never know, do I hate him, NO, I will cherish the years I was with him and his family, and will pray for him and my forgiveness towards him.

After that happen I started to train on my own in my different styles and people that I knew, but never step foot in a DOJO because of the fear I had. This past 2 months ago I did step foot in a Dojo. A Kumdo dojo, Since then I have grown closer to Jesus. I am excepted at my Dojo as a Christian, there is another strong Christian at the Dojo. A couple days before class started my Master had us do meditation. Do you know what I did, I meditated on the Bible, on versus in the Bible, I talk to GOD! I though of all the wonderful things his had done in my life and keeps doing. I find that it is my Quiet time with Jesus, when I meditated in the Dojo. I understand your fears, believe me I have been there. Don't worry people will make fun of or mock what they do not understand, the only thing you can do is Love them in return, I know that is easier said then done. Always respect your Master, bow before you enter and leave the dojo and to the Master, these are just a sign of respect, there is no witch craft going on with that :) I wish you good luck in your journey. Believe me when I say there is a place for Jesus in Martial arts. So I say to you do not worry about it, Trust in God, you know what is right and wrong let him led you. Maybe God wants you to learn Kendo so that in the future you can have a Dojo of your own and have it be a Christian Dojo (these are my goals in life).

If there is one thing I learned you can't force Christian faith on people, you can't point a gun at someone and tell them to Love God, the only thing you can do is plant a seed. Then maybe one day that seed will grow and they will learn the truth.

And to answer that question I saw some were on the page of this form,
If God made the earth then who made God?
Everything has a beginning and a end to things, there will always be a first and a last to everything in life. So how can you create nothing from something? Or something from nothing. It is like saying what came first the chicken or the egg? People will try to figure
out what is wrong with what we don’t understand or believe.

I will not be posting again so if you feel the urge to flame me or make fun of me, by all means go ahead.
Take care Daqo’tah, I will meet you someday.
I am running the race with you, the road is narrow and the door is small, but I will be at the Throne of GOD!

Your Brother in Christ.


From this long and tedious post, it is easy to infer what B0rnAgain is saying. 'DaQotah, join a dojo, if you are asked to meditate, meditate on God then. There are other Christians in the world beside you who are taking Kendo/Kumdo'

I hope you take his/her advice.

[DaQo'tah]

B0rnAgain
...


Very Good Post!
I must say that reading your words came at a good time in my life, for I was just about to give up posting here, But now I feel different,,,I feel that in a very real way I have much more left to write!..Thanks for the encouragement!

It is also important to notice your reaction to being treated baddly because of your faith at the Dojo.

You correctly understood that it was not the falt of Martial Arts, that you had to step away from that 1st Dojo, but just the falt of a few bad teachers.

You very wisely looked for a Dojo that was more able to allow a "Live and let live" style of Kumdo that you needed.

You didnt blame Martial Arts!

That is something different than what I have read from others who now say they dont believe in God based only on the very foolish actions of some so-called Christians....

[Skolld]

Daqo’tah,
This message is for Daqo’tah, I felt compiled to Register on these forms just so I can post to you.
First off I must say thank you for staying faithful in Jesus, he will lead you. Always
Remember that he loves you and will always be with you even threw the tough times.

Let me tell you a little about myself,
At age 11 is when I started Martial Arts (Tae Kwon Do), I was not a Christian, I knew who God was, and this guy name Jesus.
But I knew nothing else. At age 18, I asked Jesus into my life, I repented of my sins, I got to know Jesus. I was
Saved in a Church in WV in front of 200 people, It was a day of freedom in my life. I told my Master that I was a Christian, and believed in Jesus. I started to feel that my Master hated me, brushed me off when I would talk to him and would pretend that I was not in the Dojo with him. He even went to as far as not letting me sit by his side before when bowed in anymore. My last class I was at my Master knocked me out. I started to pray and found that is it really worth it, going there? The answer of course was NO!!! So after going to a Dojo for over 10 years, I left. Was
it my Master's plan to get rid of me I will never know, do I hate him, NO, I will cherish the years I was with him and his family, and will pray for him and my forgiveness towards him.

After that happen I started to train on my own in my different styles and people that I knew, but never step foot in a DOJO because of the fear I had. This past 2 months ago I did step foot in a Dojo. A Kumdo dojo, Since then I have grown closer to Jesus. I am excepted at my Dojo as a Christian, there is another strong Christian at the Dojo. A couple days before class started my Master had us do meditation. Do you know what I did, I meditated on the Bible, on versus in the Bible, I talk to GOD! I though of all the wonderful things his had done in my life and keeps doing. I find that it is my Quiet time with Jesus, when I meditated in the Dojo. I understand your fears, believe me I have been there. Don't worry people will make fun of or mock what they do not understand, the only thing you can do is Love them in return, I know that is easier said then done. Always respect your Master, bow before you enter and leave the dojo and to the Master, these are just a sign of respect, there is no witch craft going on with that :) I wish you good luck in your journey. Believe me when I say there is a place for Jesus in Martial arts. So I say to you do not worry about it, Trust in God, you know what is right and wrong let him led you. Maybe God wants you to learn Kendo so that in the future you can have a Dojo of your own and have it be a Christian Dojo (these are my goals in life).

If there is one thing I learned you can't force Christian faith on people, you can't point a gun at someone and tell them to Love God, the only thing you can do is plant a seed. Then maybe one day that seed will grow and they will learn the truth.

And to answer that question I saw some were on the page of this form,
If God made the earth then who made God?
Everything has a beginning and a end to things, there will always be a first and a last to everything in life. So how can you create nothing from something? Or something from nothing. It is like saying what came first the chicken or the egg? People will try to figure
out what is wrong with what we don’t understand or believe.

I will not be posting again so if you feel the urge to flame me or make fun of me, by all means go ahead.
Take care Daqo’tah, I will meet you someday.
I am running the race with you, the road is narrow and the door is small, but I will be at the Throne of GOD!

Your Brother in Christ.

Interesting DaQo'tah, did you write this yourself?
just for future reference, people who practice Kumdo, don't play in a Dojo nor do they use the term "master".
I'll give you credit for your efforts at being totally annoying.

[Fenix]

certainly sounds like it...as soon as i saw, new user, BOrnAgain...i knew it was daqo'ta related...wouldnt be surprised if they were both him.

[Kaoru]

Interesting DaQo'tah, did you write this yourself?
just for future reference, people who practice Kumdo, don't play in a Dojo nor do they use the term "master".
I'll give you credit for your efforts at being totally annoying.
Kumdoka practice in a dojang which means dojo. So, actually, it is correct to say dojo. He probably forgot the Korean name for it. Yes, they call their sensei "Master," which really annoys me. No offense Old Warrior-san! (He does Kumdo.) Asking someone to call you Master is so presumtuous... Especially when in Kumdo, there are a lot of 4 dan and up who require that.(All of them.) At that level, you aren't even perfect yet. The title of Master then, sounds so... awkward and assuming. Just my humble opinion... Though, let's not get into a debate on that. I'm not trying start one. :) To me, calling a teacher "sensei" is enough. There's a Korean equivelent for "sensei" but I forgot it. Master(Sabunim in Korean.) definately is not it.

Kaoru

[Skolld]

Kumdoka practice in a dojang which means dojo. So, actually, it is correct to say dojo. He probably forgot the Korean name for it. Yes, they call their sensei "Master," which really annoys me. No offense Old Warrior-san! (He does Kumdo.) Asking someone to call you Master is so presumtuous... Especially when in Kumdo, there are a lot of 4 dan and up who require that.(All of them.) At that level, you aren't even perfect yet. The title of Master then, sounds so... awkward and assuming. Just my humble opinion... Though, let's not get into a debate on that. I'm not trying start one. :) To me, calling a teacher "sensei" is enough. There's a Korean equivelent for "sensei" but I forgot it. Master(Sabunim in Korean.) definately is not it.

Kaoru

Kaoru,
You know you're ruining my trap, right?
oh well, maybe next time.
No worries though :rolleyes:

[mingshi]

Ahh... all of you, just be more constructive by posting some of higher quality elsewhere in the forums!!! Wasting KWF's bandwidth responding to someone who is never going to pick up kendo is good for nothing...

If you feel like feeding him, why not feed the rest of us?

hmmm anyone answering back owes me a beer!!

[wickedhavoc]

HERE IS YOUR BEER!!;);););)
http://webclipart.about.com/library/Stpats/beer02.gif
So is it a date???

[Marine_Boy]

HERE IS YOUR BEER!!;);););)
http://webclipart.about.com/library/Stpats/beer02.gif
So is it a date???

What kind of beer do you call that??? :confused2

[Wout]

maybe he slipped something in it

tssk tsssk :p

[KhawMengLee]

HERE IS YOUR BEER!!;);););)
http://webclipart.about.com/library/Stpats/beer02.gif
So is it a date???

Is it St Patrick's day already?

[amanharan]

daqo'tah
hang in there man, forall of us in teh same battle, you aren't alone in this. it just makes it harder when the things we really enjoy seme to contradict our beliefs, just stand firm in what you believe in.
Aman

[wickedhavoc]

What, you guy/gals never had green beer before?

Green beer is good any time of the year.:ko: (http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/misc.php?do=getsmilies&wysiwyg=1&forumid=0#):ko: (http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/misc.php?do=getsmilies&wysiwyg=1&forumid=0#)
:ko: (http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/misc.php?do=getsmilies&wysiwyg=1&forumid=0#)

[GrandCentral9]

Just for the uninitiated:

I would think that the Korean equivalent of sensai (which I understand to be "teacher," and used not just for the martial arts, but for pretty much anyone who is wiser than yourself) would be sunsaengnim (apologies if i'm not following McCune system... I write it like it sounds). Strictly translated, it means "teacher," but i've heard it used for other respected persons such as doctors or any older person.

Also, be aware that sabunim doesn't necessarily carry with it all of the Western cultural assumptions and connotations of "master." Consider it an elevated form of "teacher," if you must, but you shouldn't think that the holder of the title is requesting to be called "master" in the Western sense.

[Kaoru]

Just for the uninitiated:

I would think that the Korean equivalent of sensai (which I understand to be "teacher," and used not just for the martial arts, but for pretty much anyone who is wiser than yourself) would be sunsaengnim (apologies if i'm not following McCune system... I write it like it sounds). Strictly translated, it means "teacher," but i've heard it used for other respected persons such as doctors or any older person.

Also, be aware that sabunim doesn't necessarily carry with it all of the Western cultural assumptions and connotations of "master." Consider it an elevated form of "teacher," if you must, but you shouldn't think that the holder of the title is requesting to be called "master" in the Western sense.
hehe, There is no McCune system as far as I know. Never heard of that. It is just called Romanisation according to my Korean/English dictionary. Hangul is Hangul. The roman letters only say what sound the character makes. If I had Korean enabled on my computer like I do for Japanese, I'd show you. Anyway, you are close. It's spelled "son-saeng." It means only "teacher" or "instructor." according to the dictionary I have as you said. Sabunim does mean Master. I've never not heard a Kumdo teacher 4 dan and above be referred to anything other than Master or Sabunim. Old Warrior might know more. He does Kumdo. Darn the PM system being down... I can't ask him to come here and reply. Oh well...

Oh yeah... it's spelled "senSEI" not "senSAI." Here it is in Japanese, using Hiragana: せんせい　so: せ- se ,　ん - n　,　せ- se　, い - i :)

Kaoru

[GrandCentral9]

The McCune-Reischauer system of romanization is the "official" standard for translating hangul into the latin alphabet in Western academia. I'm Korean, so I feel like I have the right to spell it like it sounds, systems of romanization be damned... (other Koreans will back me up on this as well, as the McCune system doesn't lead to all the sounds being quite right). Also, a dictionary will attempt the best translation of a word, but like I said earlier, sabunim doesn't connote Master in the Western sense. Nor is sunsaengnim reserved strictly for teachers/instructors ;)

As for sensai vs. sensei... well, I'm not Japanese, so I guess i'm guilty of not following whichever standard has been adopted for Japanese. I'd suspect, though, that the majority of Japanese people will also suggest that the "proper" way to romanize Japanese words often leads to poor spellings. For example, "Chudan" vs. "Judan" vs. "Joudan." Three different ways to spell the same word.

[gsx1100s]

What, you guy/gals never had green beer before?

Green beer is good any time of the year.:ko: (http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/misc.php?do=getsmilies&wysiwyg=1&forumid=0#):ko: (http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/misc.php?do=getsmilies&wysiwyg=1&forumid=0#)
:ko: (http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/misc.php?do=getsmilies&wysiwyg=1&forumid=0#)


I home brew so yes, I've had green beer , but not by choice ...more by infection BLEUCHHHH:surprise: .

cheers michael

[kenshin13]

Christ to beer. :rolleyes: What are the odds.... (laughs)

bye bye,

Noah

[wickedhavoc]

I home brew so yes, I've had green beer , but not by choice ...more by infection BLEUCHHHH:surprise: .

cheers michael
I think i know what you meen. I just made my first brew.......:confused2

[gsx1100s]

I think i know what you meen. I just made my first brew.......:confused2
LOL , Don't you give up ! You just have to get the equipment realy sterile. I just use boiling water but there are a heap opf products out there.Good Luck!

cheers michael

[reg]

we made ginger beer for chemistry class in highschool when we were doing organic chem.. it turned out well, but the alcohol level was rather brutal. not quite sure how high it was, but it was rather deadly. luckily for us, nobody found out about it.

[gsx1100s]

we made ginger beer for chemistry class in highschool when we were doing organic chem.. it turned out well, but the alcohol level was rather brutal. not quite sure how high it was, but it was rather deadly. luckily for us, nobody found out about it.
Great to see the next generation of Australian scientists , turn their collective minds to what realy matters ....world peace???....no....beer :)

cheers michael

p.s. my Dad made ginger beer as well , can still remember it exploding under the house . Sounded like a distant bombing raid.

[Nanbanjin]

Great to see the next generation of Australian scientists , turn their collective minds to what realy matters ....world peace???....no....beer :)

cheers michael

p.s. my Dad made ginger beer as well , can still remember it exploding under the house . Sounded like a distant bombing raid.

Must be an Australian thing. I remember making a few potent batches of ginger beer with my old man. We used to keep it in the dog kennel to stop the glass from flying too far.
I remember one time we were left with a few bottles at the end so I took them to primary school and set up a store. The stuff was totally alcoholic but the teachers let me get away with it. I made $18 but lost it at the bus stop.

[reg]

I made $18 but lost it at the bus stop.
maybe there is a God. a God who punishes underage, unlicensed grog bootlegger.

[Nanbanjin]

maybe there is a God. a God who punishes underage, unlicensed grog bootlegger.

Same God who put nipples on men.

[aikanaro]

Practicing kendo doesn't have to be in conflict with your beliefs. Anyway, it maybe could help you researching a little bit about meditation, "inner force" (are you talking about ki?), etc. (other topics which might interest you) - If you don't have enough information, you can perceive something unknown as weird, or conflicting with that what you know. Having more information will help you to form your opinion.

I think that in practicing a martial art you'll find whatever you want to look for. It might help you just to adjust your point of view, and think of kendo as a sport, when meditating you can just have a mokment of rest and clearing your mind, don't see "inner force" as a mysterious force but as the focusing of your will or intention and effort, etc. These practices are not part of any belief system which would contradict Christianism.

As a matter of fact, I've got a Christian friend at the dojo who told me that, while meditating, thinks about or does a little prayer to Christ (sort of "dedicating" the class or effort, I guess) ... I think that's just as well, since nobody's trying to impose a way of thinking or belief system on anyone else, much less a religion.

By the same token, there's no need to "correct" anyone about this, as anyone is free to have their own beliefs (After all, even Christ didn't try to impose his views on anyone, did he? ;) ) , just practice kendo as a sport you like and enjoy it.

[Melancoholic]

Some good posts in this thread... I'm surprised it's rated down so low. Anyway, I know it's a can of worms, but I'm jumping in. Here are a few thoughts.

To the original poster, be careful not to paint too broad of strokes when you describe the situation between Christ and Kendo. There is a distinguishing line between philosophy and religion. To that end, I think there are several discussions going on in this thread, and I'll try to address each one.

1. The conceptual struggles between the concepts of Kendo and Christianity.
2. The influence of a Christian Kendoa on a dojo
3. The influence of a dojo on a Christian Kendoka

Kendo and Christianity
Let's be very clear — a sword is a weapon meant for killing. Techniques learned in martial arts are meant to disable, disarm or dispatch an enemy. To deny that is to be blind to thousands of years of war and bloodshed. They are all purposeful in their intent to resolve a conflict with you victorious over your enemy. In times of relative peace and prosperity such as today, martial arts thrive on the secondary side of self-discovery and growth. But knowing yourself is only half the equation of overcoming your enemy. You must know yourself and your enemy in order to defeat them. Martial arts differ from other "sports" in that all the aliases and links in our techniques point to more than just scoring a point. By comparison, Christianity is about laying down your life in joyful obedience to God. You fight and struggle, but your struggle is not against flesh and blood. The ultimate aim of Christianity is to make much of God and to enjoy him. The conflict is with anything that gets in the way of that, how to put aside all hindrances that get between you and God. The enemy and ultimate aim are very different. Modern Kendo has a wide spiritual answer through specific physical means, while Christianity has a specific spiritual answer through wide physical means.

Influence of a Christian Kendoka on a dojo
Again, let’s be very clear. Christians, it’s not about you as much as it is about God. Are you there to evangelize to the dojo? Are you there to be a witness? Why are you there? I can’t answer this question for you specifically, but I can say with all assurance that Christians are meant to influence people everywhere they go, always to have an answer for the hope that they have, but to give it in all gentleness and respect and with a clear conscience. Look at missionaries. It takes wisdom for them to reach out to people, not to mention years of building bridges and trust. People must make their own decisions on all matters, it should never be forced upon them. So, whatever you do, whether you are hitting kote-men or chatting it up after class, do it in such a way as to glorify God, and to not be a stumbling block for people to come to God.

Influence of a dojo on a Christian Kendoka
This is hard to say because each dojo is different. Some emphasize the spiritual aspect of the martial arts moreso than the others. I struggled with this for a long time, especially in some schools where we are asked to bow to a picture of the deceased founder (i.e., O Sensei in Aikido). In the end, you have to realize that there are a thousand things influencing us every day. Media, programs, people, news… everything asks us to see things in their way. I think if a Christian has a strong enough faith to know what they believe, and are not easily swayed by all the countless influences out there, than they should not be worried about a dojo influencing them away from God.

Sorry for the long post, but there is a lot to say. I guess if I could summarize my thoughts, I’d say that Kendo is not a religion. It has great physical influence, but an open spiritual demand. I think Christians should prayerfully consider first why they are studying Kendo, and how they can be good examples of people who claim to be children of an all-holy, all-loving God in all aspects of their life in and out of the dojo. I actually think Kendo and martial arts provide a great foundation for talking about spiritual matters, and to share viewpoints, because there is respect there. I hope that can be the case for both sides.

[Shieldwolf]

japanese people were originally from israel????
i never knew that.... they look a little different.. That freaks me
out! My writing is shaped in a pyramid!
As a biologist who teaches evolution among other topics, I can say that the evidence is very clear that all humans (and their ape ancestors) came out of Africa. One group migrated North to the middle east, then to Europe, Great Britain, etc. Another group headed more east to form people of India, Australia, and Russia/Japan/China. From Japan/Russia it is thought that some migrated over to Alaska then down to North and then South America.

As for Jesus being an ancestor of Japanese, I find the evidence overwhelming that Jesus is simply a mythical figure-- this is not said lightly or out of hate; in fact i was once a bible-banging born again Christian. But I dared discover the evidence that points to jesus as but one of over a dozen mythical savior figures in human mythology. if you care to explore the evidence yourself, here it is:
http://heretic.sparlo.net

[Richiro]

I'm a christian too. There is nothing wrong with kendo religiously. Kendo meditation is not praying, its a way to clear your mind.Theres nothing wrong with kiai. My dojo here in hawaii is at a buhhdist temple, none of the members are buhhdist. We practice there because it is the olny place to go to. I dont know if they cane even call it a temple its just an empty room. And it your questionable about bowing, its just a way to show respect. kendo is not to teach you buhhdism, its to teach you japanese swordsmanship.

[Kaoru]

Guys,

DaQ'ota, the original poster who started this thread, was banned months ago. Look under his username. It says "banned." No need to convince him of anything. If you click on his usename, you will be able to see his other threads and posts to see just why he was banned.

That will save you guys the trouble. :)

Kaoru

[Kaoru]

As a biologist who teaches evolution among other topics, I can say that the evidence is very clear that all humans (and their ape ancestors) came out of Africa. One group migrated North to the middle east, then to Europe, Great Britain, etc. Another group headed more east to form people of India, Australia, and Russia/Japan/China. From Japan/Russia it is thought that some migrated over to Alaska then down to North and then South America.

As for Jesus being an ancestor of Japanese, I find the evidence overwhelming that Jesus is simply a mythical figure-- this is not said lightly or out of hate; in fact i was once a bible-banging born again Christian. But I dared discover the evidence that points to jesus as but one of over a dozen mythical savior figures in human mythology. if you care to explore the evidence yourself, here it is:
http://heretic.sparlo.net
Something to think about...

Taken from that site:


The Lord's Prayer is not an original oratory by Jesus, but is a collection of sayings from the Talmud (Old Testament), many of which are derived from ancient Egyptian prayers to the Egyptian savior-God Osiris.
The Talmud is not the old testament. The Tanach is. You are gonna believe just anything you read? Heck, they can't even get a simple definition right. Would I go ahead and believe anything else they say?

Sorry. Make your own choice. Don't base it on what some yahoo wrote on a website. Just my humble opinion...

Kaoru

[Light Samurai]

hi this is DaQo'tah

Im a Christian, so I dont go in for all the "inner force" stuff that so many in Kendo seem to push on students....

Im thinking about starting to take a beginners Kendo class this winter, but from what I have read about some of the ideas behind Kendo, Im not sure how my Christian faith will be able to sit still ....

I have been reading about some of the ways guys from Japan have for prayer or meditation,,,and it seems to go very much against my views as a Born-Again Christian....also if my kendo teacher tries to push that type of teaching on me, I may very well feel the need to "correct" his teachings to the class.

How do Christians work and learn within a system that seems very far from the cross of Christ...

I want to learn kendo,,,,I just dont want to have to listen to any stuff that goes against my Christian faith.....

How is this done?Meditation is clearly the mind, think of it as not of thinking of anything. As it says, 'Meditate on God's word.' Take it as literal as you want :)

[Light Samurai]

Something to think about...

Taken from that site:


The Talmud is not the old testament. The Tanach is. You are gonna believe just anything you read? Heck, they can't even get a simple definition right. Would I go ahead and believe anything else they say?

Sorry. Make your own choice. Don't base it on what some yahoo wrote on a website. Just my humble opinion...

KaoruIn the book the Templar Revelation It states so. But believe what you want, I tend to disreagrd that statement as well.

[Kendo Spirit]

Kendo is not a religion so dont freak, it is martial art. We study it, we practice it, we try to understand it.

true, there is some religion influence of confucianism. That is the way kendo is, Samurai's of old have developed this art as their way of life, their way of the sword, their ideas, beliefs all molded into it. It does not tell you to defy your god.
You can choose to accept that fact if you like

but if you dont you cannot change it, it would not be kendo anymore if you did nor would it be kendo is you preached in a dojo hahaha

history is what makes "Kendo" the way it is. If you find that that is too much into spiritual type of things perhaps general fencing might be your kind of sport.

Different people get different things out of Kendo so we cant tell you what it should mean to you.
if you think it is too violent, or evil etc then maybe it might not be you.
but really what you do with kendo is your own business.

perhaps you should study it a little further to get a little more understanding. perhaps kendo can fill in some parts you wont find in a bible, I dont think they have a section for sword fighting.

bottom line is .. Dont be concerned, because if your christian faith is so unbreakably strong then nothing bad should effect you.

[Kaoru]

In the book the Templar Revelation It states so. But believe what you want, I tend to disreagrd that statement as well.
Ahhh, but ask a Jewish person, and they'll tell you otherwise. :) The Talmud is a Jewish book, not Christian. It is a book on Jewish Law. The Tanach is the Jewish Bible and is the Old Testament. They don't have the Christian New Testament.

Some links about what it is:

http://www.sacred-texts.com/jud/talmud.htm

http://www.jewfaq.org/torah.htm#Talmud

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talmud

Information on what the Tanach(also Tanakh, Tenach) is:

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/Tanakh.html

http://www.ou.org/about/judaism/tanakh.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanakh

http://www.hareidi.org/bible/bible.htm

:)

Kaoru

[Kendo Spirit]

sorry not confucianism, I mean the religious influences on samurai's were budhism and zen philosophy and that them as individuals.

[James1287]

Wow can you believe this thread was started in 2004 by a user who was banned for reasons we can easily guess.

[Wifenmummy]

So, whatever you do, whether you are hitting kote-men or chatting it up after class, do it in such a way as to glorify God, and to not be a stumbling block for people to come to God.
agreed on that..
kauro whats with all the attacking? i thought u reserved that for kendo? ;) lol!
the starter of the thread was obviously troubled and wanting some help.. of course there was tons that gave no help at all... *sigh* what use was it for them to post?!

[Estel Duron]

I think it is perfectly alright for a Christian to take up Kendo. And why not? A Japanese Christian was actually involved in the development of Kendo!:smiley:

Enter Sasamori Junzo (http://www.isu.edu/%7Ejon/kendo/swordsmen.html):


Dr. Sasamori Junzo (1886-1976) was a member of the House of Peers in Japan, and was a master swordsman. Dr. Sasamori cowrote with Gordon Warner the definitive English language text on Kendo, titled This Is Kendo. His contribution to education furthered the popularization of Kendo, and have earned him a special place of respect in the history of the art.

The pleasant fact is that Sasamori Junzo's a Christian (http://www.fightingarts.com/reading/article.php?id=370)!:D


In the Kansei period (1789–1801), the seventh head of the school, Ono Tadayoshi, taught a Tsugaru retainer by the name of Yamaga Hachirozaemon Takami the entire Ono-ha Itto-ryu curriculum and after that, the Tsugaru and Yamaga families worked together to transmit the system. This semi-formal collaboration continued until the Taisho period (1912–1926), when Sasamori Junzo, a well-known kendoist, Christian minister, and educator, who later became an influential politician noted for his work for international peace, inherited the ryu. The seventeenth generation headmaster, active today, is Junzo’s son, Takemi, also an ordained minister and prominent educator. Ono-ha Itto-ryu is also practiced independently, outside the purview of the mainline of the ryu, by kendo teachers, some daito-ryu organizations and other exponents throughout *Japan, and is thus probably the most widely disseminated form of Itto-ryu today.

Sasamori Takemi (http://home.cogeco.ca/%7Etokumeikan/many_thanks.htm) is elsewhere described as "a Christian priest besides being a swordsman" and "a great teacher studying both military art and religion".

So there is really nothing wrong with a Christian taking up either Kendo which (unlike more traditional ryu like TSKSR) is not really associated with any established religion.

[Marine_Boy]

This wretched thread is STILL going on!

Begs beyond believe... :rolleyes:

[nikolaj]

heh, I guess this thread goes to prove that when you start discussing about religion, it never ends...

Personally, I'm not much of a christian even though I was baptised, so religion never was an issue for me. I guess you can go as far as you want with kendo, if all you want it to be is a sport, then that's what it'll be...

[ziggey]

posted in the wrong topic ^^
sorry for waking up a sleeping thread =(=(=(

ETA no longer sleeping - dead.