Kendo in the Olympics

[Mike]

Now when the Olympics in Athens has started, I started thinking about the Olympic events. Seems as there are two martial arts represented, judo and taekwondo, but not kendo. Does anyone think kendo will ever make it to the Olympics? I have heard that kendo is, alongside with karate, the biggest martial arts in the world? I don't know if that's true or not, but that's what I heard anyway, and if that's the case, it should be in the Olympics. At least I think it should be there, it'd be interesting to see it on TV and maybe learn some from the masters. What do you all think about this?

[SummerlinW]

Not to be rude but kendo in the Olympics is not going to happen. It is not a new debate and I agree with not having it in the olympics. Judo and some other martial arts sports were ruined by becoming an Olympic sport. Martial arts I like to think are bigger and would hate to see kendo characterized only as a sport. If it ever made it to the Olympics I would hope that it doesn't ruin the sport. i.e. People only practing one type of kendo to win tournaments and getting nothing else out of it.

[Haowen]

See ongoing discussion here:

http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2245

[litige]

not Only that, IT CAN'T MAKE IT!!!
The IKF is not ready, and most of it's member don't want kendo in the olympics. Since it's the governing body of Kendo, it has the final word. Plus, there won't be any olympic summer games in Japan soon. I don't know if there will be any in korea soon. PLus Kumdo hasn't got enough country practicing the art.

[Legio]

It's a funny thing you brought this up... Yesterday, we all went out to a restaurant after keiko. I brought this issue up with our sensei and whether he thinks it would be a good idea. He never really gave a straight answer but he expressed his concern that the commercialization of Kendo would diminish its true meaning. I absolutely agree with him; although watching Kendo would be great, the involvement of 'money' will surely affect how kendokas will view the art. He also expressed the difficulty in judging a shiai... how would you determine the point-system in the Olympics? Judo for example is not really the judo that it used to be... there are half-points awarded for certain executions; shouldn't it be that a point be given only if the execution is done with totality... meaning no half-point nonsense. Again... the involvement of money with regards to the judges becomes an issue. Sensei said that surely the more traditional senseis will be reluctant if not totally opposed to this prospect. Japan, Korea, Canada, and the United States will be getting most of the medals anyways (just stating the pattern over the past several WKC). Kendo should not be in the Olympics!!!

[akumalkenshi]

As a kendoka I wish to see my favourite activity widely broadcast and known, as it would be the case in the olympic games.

But adapting the kendo technique for the competition for the gold, surely is going to leave out many importants aspects of kendo.

And after all, it is one of the oldest martial arts, It still has very strong ties to its past, and is one of the few who has not sucumbed to comercialism.

[DarKDawN]

I think Kendo should be in the Olympics, Actually it pisses me off that it isn't. It should be a Martial Art yes, but in the Olympics. Im very mad the Taekwondo is in the Olympics because it is the worst "self defence" art out there, yet it's so popular because it "looks cool".

[Kirin]

Highlights from the March 27-28, 2004, AUSKF Board of Directors Meeting, Detroit, Michigan:[continued]

I. United States Olympic Organizing Committee [”USOC”]Membership. Mark Uchida reported that the USOC has specific requirements for membership, several of which the AUSKF would not currently be able to meet, such as having a woman and an athlete as part of the makeup of the AUSKF Board of Directors. Additional prerequisite criteria include having all U.S. Citizens only as members, having an annual national championship tournament, being a participant in the Pan American Games, etc. Based on not currently being able to meet all of the requirements set forth by USOC, Mr. Uchida advised that the AUSKF would not be able to be considered for membership. Charlie Tanaka, AUSKF President thanked Mark Uchida for his efforts to followup on this matter and reporting the results of his findings.

From AUSKF homepage

[litige]

I think Kendo should be in the Olympics, Actually it pisses me off that it isn't. It should be a Martial Art yes, but in the Olympics. Im very mad the Taekwondo is in the Olympics because it is the worst "self defence" art out there, yet it's so popular because it "looks cool".

...I think you don't understand. It would be impossible by olympic standars (spl?) for Kendo to still be a martial art. If you don't understand that, then yes, it could piss you off. If you do understand, and it still pisses you off, then you don't like kendo.

[Caleb]

Its not only Judo and Taekwondo that are being changed from their origins. Its all budo sports. If you look at Judo for example, you can see that it can no longer really be applied to a self defense situation, because the budoka is trained to win tournaments, not defend him/her self from a mugger. With the way things are going in america today (samurai movies, increased intrest in oriental mystisism, marial arts as a money maker) I would not be suprised at all to see kendo become an olympic sport. But thats America. I do beleive that IKF will most definatly go against this idea, for the well being of kendo.
Also, Karate is known by just about everyone in the United States, while kendo isn't as widely accepted. Thats changeing very quickly, but there probably (sadly) wont be highschool teams starting, that practice in the school due to the roots of where it came (swords, violence etc.) however, Japan (thankfully) has this grandfathered in as an acceptable Junior/Senior high school curriculum. So who knows what will be around the bend. It is necessary to stop this Olympic idea for the traditions of kendo, but then again, we see dojo's do exactly what we fear without the olympics (teach only shiai, and taikai style).

[Andoru]

The ZNKR has indicated that, should kendo be an olympic event, it will pull itself out of the IKF. Enough said.

[Anime12478]

Even if Kendo were to become an Olympic sport, I think that Kendo would divide into those that want the Olympics involved and those that don't. Not everybody trains in running, swimming, karate, judo, etc to go into the Olympics. People train in those things becasue they like to do those things and the same goes for Kendo. I, for one, will be training for physical/spiritual/mental development and to have plain fun whether or not Kendo is in the Olympics. I just hope that move doesn't happen. If it does, I hope I am at the rank where I can teach officially. I wouldn't mind teaching the neighborhood kids/adults in a little sword arts.

[The Boss]

The ZNKR has indicated that, should kendo be an olympic event, it will pull itself out of the IKF. Enough said.
But many IKF members disagree with ZNKR... especially country like Korea.

why?
'casue of olympic funding form their government.
how can those money hungry kumdo MASTERs miss opportunity like Olympics!

:ko:

[Holmgren-san]

I don't think it should become an Olympic sport. Sure it would look cool to see an excellent looking video, showing two kendoka as one does a "small" Men-Do to the other. But that is seriously outweighed by all of the downsides.

Kendo would be downright butchered. Like for starters, they(I'm not sure who you want to refer to "they" as, but "they" is just simply the people who are trying to get kendo to become an olympic sport) want add in kicking for points, replace the referees with a "robot"(as "they" call it) that will take pictures to determine if a point is scored or not. "They" want to completely change the rules so that spectators can easily pick up the rules just by reading a little pamphlet or asking a more educated-in-the-sport spectator(which, as most of us know, is not possible in true kendo).

I brought this issue up during last weekend at a kendo summer camp with a fellow kendoka's dad, he doesn't do kendo, but he's one of those types that knows a heck of alot even without participating in it(although his son does). Anyway, he says if it did ever become an Olympic sport, he'd just like to see the gold medalist of this Olympic kendo try to defeat an equel rank Traditional kendoka. It wouldn't happen, and I agree with him.

My two-cents.

[reg]

the International Olympic Committee are reducing the number of events in the olympics timetable as it is. also, let's be realistic, the IOC will not really look into this matter, regardless of how vigorous the interested parties are pushing the issue. the decision lies with the IOC, not the IKF, or the Korean Kumdo Federation, or anyone else to that matter. and i think you would be hard pressed to convince them to fit a new, relatively obscure 'sport' [and potentially low in terms of commercial benefits] into the schedule.

i don't think it's going to happen, and it shouldn't happen. the day they approve kendo into becoming an olympic event will be the day i press for the inclusion of Beer Guzzling and Pro Wrestling in the next olympics.

[NorthernKendoka]

Sure it would be really cool to see kendo on TV, the questions is to what prize. Kendo will probably lose all of its dept in order to become more commercial and spectator friendly. Soon the martial art we all love will have become and commercialized martial game. One example is when I earlier today when was watching Judo. One of the competitors had a big Adidas logo on her judo gi. For me that goes against every thing kendo stands for. Kendo shouldn’t be about what brand a person wears but how their kendo is.

[DanDan]

yes, it would be nice to see kendo in the olympics but after tae kwon do became an olympic sport...many of the original concepts were lost...i don't want that to happen to kendo/kumdo...

[Washington]

I don't think that Kendo should become an Olympic event

However after reading the article on Kendo-World's main page I do agree that it might be a good idea for the IKF to associate with the Olympic Committee to insure that it is the defining word on Kendo in the world stage. If they aren't there first then Kumdo or something else in the future might be.

It doesn't mean kendo becomes an Olympic event... actually the association would ensure that it wouldn't.

unless I'm reading the article wrong then ignore this hehe

[moocow65]

I also believe that kendo would lose many of its budo aspects if it became an Olympic event. However, I also think part of the reason why the ZNKR doesn't want kendo to become an Olympic event is if Japan were to lose, it would be devastating and embarassing. Kinda like how Japan lost in judo during the Olympics in Tokyo if my memory serves me correctly.

[reg]

I also believe that kendo would lose many of its budo aspects if it became an Olympic event. However, I also think part of the reason why the ZNKR doesn't want kendo to become an Olympic event is if Japan were to lose, it would be devastating and embarassing. Kinda like how Japan lost in judo during the Olympics in Tokyo if my memory serves me correctly.
but you would think that it's only a matter of time before they lose anyway. no disrespect to the japanese team of course. but everybody thought that the dream team was invincible. now they are very much beatable. with every victory to extend a winning streak, you are only one match closer to ending it.

[moocow65]

but you would think that it's only a matter of time before they lose anyway. no disrespect to the japanese team of course. but everybody thought that the dream team was invincible. now they are very much beatable. with every victory to extend a winning streak, you are only one match closer to ending it.
I totally agree. Japan is going to lose eventually. It's just that losing at the World Championships has a much less of an impact than it would at the Olympics, which is a much larger stage.

[Washington]

Not necessarily

When you throw in corporate money, state sponsorship and national dedicated teams that basically breed athletes for the Olympics even if kendo was an Olympic event outside of the IKF the World Championships would still be the top attraction.

MLB World Series vs. Olympic Event
NFL Super Bowl vs. Olympic Event (if was Olympic event)
NBA Championship vs. Olympic Event

Just doesn't compare... Losing at the World Championships would still be far greater than the Olympics

[moocow65]

Not necessarily

When you throw in corporate money, state sponsorship and national dedicated teams that basically breed athletes for the Olympics even if kendo was an Olympic event outside of the IKF the World Championships would still be the top attraction.

MLB World Series vs. Olympic Event
NFL Super Bowl vs. Olympic Event (if was Olympic event)
NBA Championship vs. Olympic Event

Just doesn't compare... Losing at the World Championships would still be far greater than the Olympics

Well, those comparisons are like comparing the Zen Nihon Championships to the World Championships. One is international and the other is not.
The loss of the Dream Team at the Olympics had a greater impact than the US losing at the world championships in basketball.

[Washington]

Maybe I don't take the Olympics serious enough.. I was thinking in terms of a Nation's sport and it's effect on the people.

Baseball is our national sport and yet on the world stage I LIKE to see other countries beat us at it. Our sport being played around the world at that level in itself is a sence of pride and identity. Being able to share that cultural aspect with the world and having your investment returned like that is really cool and very enjoyable.

If you were to open up the World Series to baseball legues from other countries that would be similar to WKC ? The World Series would still be the top draw and defining event to us as a country.. or at least me personally if that view isn't shared by the majority.

I'm not Japanese and don't have that perspective on Kendo so was just using something from my side that I view as similar in regards to World Kendo Championships vs. and Olympic Event :)

[reg]

Maybe I don't take the Olympics serious enough.. I was thinking in terms of a Nation's sport and it's effect on the people.

Baseball is our national sport and yet on the world stage I LIKE to see other countries beat us at it. Our sport being played around the world at that level in itself is a sence of pride and identity. Being able to share that cultural aspect with the world and having your investment returned like that is really cool and very enjoyable.

If you were to open up the World Series to baseball legues from other countries that would be similar to WKC ? The World Series would still be the top draw and defining event to us as a country.. or at least me personally if that view isn't shared by the majority.

I'm not Japanese and don't have that perspective on Kendo so was just using something from my side that I view as similar in regards to World Kendo Championships vs. and Olympic Event :)
i think in this case, the japanese would not like to see other countries beat them :smiley: but once it's happened, i think they'll eventually accept it. i mean, IF the US don't win the gold in basketball in this olympics, there'll be a bit of anger and disbelief i would think, but it'll soon pass.

to the professional kendo players, the WKC is not the number one in terms of prestige. sure, it's an honour to represent and win for your country, but for them, they'd rather do well in the AJKC. just a little quirkiness i noticed when reading about younger players' profile, they usually will say that they want to be japan's best player. not world.

WKC and olympics are definitely a bigger stage for kendo, and its competitors. but maybe after considering the pros and cons, it's a case of bigger is not better. :evolved:

[Neil Gendzwill]

IF the US don't win the gold in basketball in this olympics, there'll be a bit of anger and disbelief i would think, but it'll soon pass.

They just about lost to Greece of all people today. I'm not normally one to laugh at another team's misfortune but they've been so obnoxious these last few games that it's a hoot to see the feet of clay.

[reg]

They just about lost to Greece of all people today. I'm not normally one to laugh at another team's misfortune but they've been so obnoxious these last few games that it's a hoot to see the feet of clay.
because they have no grace in victory, and spits the dummy when they lose. it's hard to respect a team like that. whereas most people in kendo still observe decorum and behave in a good manner even in defeat. simply because it is not a sport.

iverson shot 29% from the field. larry brown is as mad as a brush for giving him so much time on the floor.

[Kendo-Militia]

They just about lost to Greece of all people today. I'm not normally one to laugh at another team's misfortune but they've been so obnoxious these last few games that it's a hoot to see the feet of clay.
I agree, but why are we calling this the dream team. The original Pro NBA team was the only DREAM TEAM. This team they have now are a bunch of ball hogging playground ball players. It's sad that the Olymipics was orignally for ameteur athletes. When the US beat USSR in LAke Placid , that was a true team. IT's not fun watching NBA playuers beat up on college players and barely win. I hope they lose.

[Neil Gendzwill]

The original Pro NBA team was the only DREAM TEAM.
They were equally obnoxious.

IT's not fun watching NBA playuers beat up on college players and barely win.
It wasn't any fun watching the slaughter with the original dream team, either.

[Kendo-Militia]

They were equally obnoxious.

It wasn't any fun watching the slaughter with the original dream team, either.
For once the US had a team similar to the Canadian Hockey Team. You have to admit the Canadian Hockey Team is superior team compared to everyone else. Full of NHL All Stars. Even had a Hall A Famer caoch during the last Olympics. And you don't enjoy them playing either?

[Neil Gendzwill]

They're a slightly different case, as international hockey has always been strong. You'll recall 3 decades ago when the Russians came over and kicked all the NHL teams' asses. The NHL is still largely Canadian but it's still more international than the NBA. Also lots of other countries have strong leagues and professional teams. The gold we took in Olympic hockey last year was the first one since 1952, and in the intervening games we have won medals only 5/11 times. Lastly it may be just the Canuck in me talking, but I thought the Canadian hockey teams have been quite a bit more gracious than the US basketball teams.

[Kendo-Militia]

They're a slightly different case, as international hockey has always been strong. You'll recall 3 decades ago when the Russians came over and kicked all the NHL teams' asses. The NHL is still largely Canadian but it's still more international than the NBA. Also lots of other countries have strong leagues and professional teams. The gold we took in Olympic hockey last year was the first one since 1952, and in the intervening games we have won medals only 5/11 times. Lastly it may be just the Canuck in me talking, but I thought the Canadian hockey teams have been quite a bit more gracious than the US basketball teams.
True , I never said the NBA players weren't arrogant. Atleast the last 2 teams. The original team with Magic, Byrd, I think were a bit more gracious and had more team work. Therefore there result was distroying their opponent. This so called dream team are too worried about "ME" in team. that they should fail. And when they do we both will be laughing together. I just wished the Olympics used true ametuer athletes like it was intended to be.

[Nishi]

I dont think Kendo should go to the olympics either.

I have to admit, I always struggle with the size of cutting in shiai, and feel very small sashi-men strokes no longer resemble anything of kendo but more shinai-do, but I think the debate would worsen if kendo became an olympic sport. You may also see kendoka taking home hundreds of thousands of dollars for producing medals for their countries, this element of financial gain also has the potential to cheapen us.

I think our energies are better focused perfecting what we have.(imo)

[Kendo-Militia]

If Kendo became part of the Olympics, they use their judges to referee our matches. We all bitch and moan about how bad our referees can be. And these are guys and women who have studied Kendo for many years. Now just think if we take people who never seen Kendo and teach them to referee our matches. If you thought damn they guy hit my elbow and they gave him the Kotte. Just think in the Olympics it would be more like damn he hit my shoulders and they gave him the men.

[PhoenixProfile]

If Kendo became part of the Olympics, they use their judges to referee our matches. We all bitch and moan about how bad our referees can be. And these are guys and women who have studied Kendo for many years. Now just think if we take people who never seen Kendo and teach them to referee our matches. If you thought damn they guy hit my elbow and they gave him the Kotte. Just think in the Olympics it would be more like damn he hit my shoulders and they gave him the men.
Front your point of view i can understand fully why Kendo shouldn't be in the Olympics, at first i thought it was a good idea if it did but from reading everyones comments i can see how much can be loss at Kendo.

[Neil Gendzwill]

I think the refereeing situation would remain the same. Every other sport uses qualified refs sanctioned by the governing body, kendo would be no different. It would be the subtle, and then not so subtle rule changes to make it suitable for TV, plus the inevitable shift to exclusively competition oriented dojo that would eventually kill it. Who knows, there might even be a bunch of crappy strip-mall dojo springing up to take advantage of a trend, just like TKD.

[ZenNoZen]

Hi,

I do agree with most of my fellow kendokas. Kendo in the olimpic games is not going to happen. Kendo still one of the purest martial arts in current times and, as you know, the olimpic games are intended for sports, not for martial arts. Including Kendo in the games will contribute just to the corruption of this art and I, personaly, do not want that.

[The Boss]

Who knows, there might even be a bunch of crappy strip-mall dojo springing up to take advantage of a trend, just like TKD.
you mean kumdo dojangs? there are plenty out there :rolleyes:

[Shazzanzzz]

I would actually like to see kendo as an olympic sport for many reasons.

1. There is the WKC already, and, tournament kendo already exists, so, how would having it in the olympics hurt it? Don't like the small hits? That's why we have judges, just make sure small hits don't count as a point. If judges simply don't score the small hits, people will stop doing them.

2. Not just saying kendo is 'just' a sport, but, i think it's much more a sport than that's say that thing we saw in winter olympics, where house wives push puck with a broom stick. People in kendo train decades to get better in kendo, so, i think people in kendo are worth olympic medals, the ultimate glory for any kind of competition.

3. I think kendo is one of those things that if you don't get the mental side, you'll never get better in kendo. So, i don't think olympics would hurt it, because still only the best kendoka who have the right set of mind will win.

4. It's the job of the senseis and sempais to teach students good manner. They should make sure competitions don't change that.

5. As for addidas and Nike making kendo gears, i think that would be a good thing. I now a lot of people who don't do kendo because they can't afford it. So, mass producing kendo products will help that. A little Nike mark wouldn't hurt kendo that much i dont' think.

6. Having kendo as an olympic competition would definitely make kendo more well known and attract more people. I think everyone would like to see that happening.

I think if the high ups of kendo just refine the system and make competition a competition they want to see, having kendo in olympics shouldn't be a problem.

That much said, I wouldn't mind kendos staying the way it is at all.

Comments are more than welcome. :)

[Neil Gendzwill]

I would actually like to see kendo as an olympic sport for many reasons.

1. There is the WKC already, and, tournament kendo already exists, so, how would having it in the olympics hurt it?
Because as soon as it gets into the grubby paws of the IOC, it spins out of control. Because a primary goal of people driving for olympic inclusion is to wrest control of kendo from ZNKR.

The point is moot, anyways. Kendo doesn't sell coca-cola, and that's the IOC's main goal these days.

[Kirin]

Q: How does a new sport, discipline or event get added to the Olympic program?
A: First, the respective sport's IF must be recognized by the International Olympic Committee as a federation operated and organized under the principles and regulations of the IOC. Second, for a new sport to be considered for the Olympic program, the IF must present proof that the sport is widely practiced (i.e., national championships, regional competitions such as the Pan Am Games, world championships and other international competitions are held on a regular basis). Starting in the year 2000, for those sports seeking inclusion or currently on the summer Olympic program, sports for men must be played in at least 75 countries on four continents before being considered for inclusion on the Olympic program and, for women, the sport must be contested in at least 40 countries and on three continents. Any new sport must be admitted to the Olympic program at least seven years before the next Olympic Games and, with a few rare exceptions, no changes are permitted after that time. The standards for admission of disciplines or events to the Olympic program are very similar to those for a sport.
from IOC FAQ

75 countries ...... IKF only have 44 participating countries.

[litige]

75 countries ...... IKF only have 44 participating countries.

I hope that will stop the debate, and the fears...

[Washington]

The point is moot, anyways. Kendo doesn't sell coca-cola, and that's the IOC's main goal these days.
considering the price of bogu i wouldn't mind a logo or 2 for free stuff :) a nabisco men might be kinda cool...

[reg]

considering the price of bogu i wouldn't mind a logo or 2 for free stuff :) a nabisco men might be kinda cool...
i think some players in the korean tournaments carry endorsements. it might have been on their zekken or elsewhere, can't remember. saw the photo a while ago in kendo jidai.

[Nanbanjin]

i think some players in the korean tournaments carry endorsements. it might have been on their zekken or elsewhere, can't remember. saw the photo a while ago in kendo jidai.

I think there should be a probe!

[taiwnezboi]

you mean kumdo dojangs? there are plenty out there :rolleyes:

my dojang is anything but crappy

[reg]

I think there should be a probe!
are you saying there should be a probe to all korean players with endorsement? down to the coaches and administrators? a massive probe-o-rama?

[Kendo-Militia]

So what happens if Korea, enters Kumdo into the Olympics? What would be the effects to the Kendo world?

[reg]

So what happens if Korea, enters Kumdo into the Olympics? What would be the effects to the Kendo world?
you'll see a split within the IKF.

oh, and also massive probe.. :smiley:

[Ninjujinkaku]

Judo and some other martial arts sports were ruined by becoming an Olympic sport
Im a judoka, and excuse me but i think you have no idea what your talking about. How has judo been ruined by the olympics? As far as kendo being an olympic sport i dont think it will happen.

[Kirin]

Im a judoka, and excuse me but i think you have no idea what your talking about. How has judo been ruined by the olympics? As far as kendo being an olympic sport i dont think it will happen.
Once Judo was considered as part of budou.... saddly not anymore.
For example,
-even there is a start line, they do not use it
-they do not bow correctly
-they do not dress properly (some even wear gi lose, for advantage)
-changed pointing system (do not use old style scoring)
-jumping up & down celebrating before bow out.
-sponsorship endorsements

Lost all essential part of budou and became a SPORTs

[Neil Gendzwill]

Im a judoka, and excuse me but i think you have no idea what your talking about. How has judo been ruined by the olympics? As far as kendo being an olympic sport i dont think it will happen.
In addition to the degradation of the reiho Kirin mentions, many long time judo players feel that the olympics have gradually eroded the quality of the play itself. You hardly ever see beautiful ippon now, even though they call them ippon. The Olympics caused the introduction of weight classes and (I think, I'm having trouble finding a reference) the partial point system. Before that, there was only ippon. When I started Olympic judo was only 10 years old and it seems to me (memory being what it is) that the requirements for the various points were much more stringent - ippon was a perfect throw, and the rare ones in competition were just that - complete control on the part of tori throughout the throw and the completion, uke on his back with considerable force. The scoring now seems to award ippon for any old half-decent throw. In addition to the degradation of ippon, there are other rules (blue uniforms, assorted time limits) that are meant to make judo more palatable for TV.

Because of the Olympics, lots of dojo are heavily competition oriented. I think there's still good judo around, and I still enjoy it. I started up again last year as my son wanted to do it. But it's not what it was.

[Lloromannic]

So what happens if Korea, enters Kumdo into the Olympics? What would be the effects to the Kendo world? Imagine if Mexico entered american football as an olympic sport, but since it was entered by mexico you would have "futbol americano" and Mexico could modify the rules.


@Kirin & Neil: I thought kodokan judo was still not as "affected" by this (or not so much at least). Is this wrong?.

[litige]

So what happens if Korea, enters Kumdo into the Olympics? What would be the effects to the Kendo world?

Won't happen, stop wondering.

[darkluc3]

IF kendo wouldn't change, even if an olimpic discipline, it would be ok i think... the kendoka could show everyone that they don't participate because of the glory or the money but because of the reasons everyone of us has for doing kendo (which aren't influenced by "bad" things (like money) which have a big influence on sports)
my "dream":
the kendoka would win the match for the gold medal, but he wouldn't jump around and cry, but go back to his place and bow respectfully, leave and that's it- he won, well, and ?
and of course nobody would have advertisements on the keikogi, there's nothing i hate more...
the people would see that kendo is different, and if it was like that i would like it...

but after all, kendo is great like it is and it would be the best thing to let it how its is :)

ps: i hope u can understand my english ;)

[taiwnezboi]

IF kendo wouldn't change, even if an olimpic discipline, it would be ok i think... the kendoka could show everyone that they don't participate because of the glory or the money but because of the reasons everyone of us has for doing kendo (which aren't influenced by "bad" things (like money) which have a big influence on sports)
my "dream":
the kendoka would win the match for the gold medal, but he wouldn't jump around and cry, but go back to his place and bow respectfully, leave and that's it- he won, well, and ?
and of course nobody would have advertisements on the keikogi, there's nothing i hate more...
the people would see that kendo is different, and if it was like that i would like it...

but after all, kendo is great like it is and it would be the best thing to let it how its is :)

ps: i hope u can understand my english ;)

if the winner were someone who started Kendo after it became a part of the Olympics, he/she probably wouldn't behave the same way as someone like Eiga or Miyazaki would after they won.

[darkluc3]

that depends on the sensei and on how it would all evolve... i know it's not very realistic, that's why i prefer how it is now...

[Nanbanjin]

oh, and also massive probe.. :smiley:

...about 120cm long and applied morote-tsuki fashion.

[litige]

Guys, shut up! It won't happen.

:mad2:

[kendokamax]

Guys, shut up! It won't happen.

:mad2:
it could happen. You can predict the future?

[reg]

Guys, shut up! It won't happen.

:mad2:
i think he needs a probe

[litige]

it could happen. You can predict the future?

Partialy. The IOC is restricting the number of entering events at the olympics and the new ones are part of affiliated IOC org. and those one will pass very very before any discipline not in or around the IOC. Also as Kirin quoted, Any new sport must be admitted to the Olympic program at least seven years before the next Olympic Games and, with a few rare exceptions, no changes are permitted after that time. The standards for admission of disciplines or events to the Olympic program are very similar to those for a sport, and this sport (if for men) must have 75 participating country on four continents. If you add the fact that kendo is really not a sport. then I think we won't see it in the near future (wich I can partialy predict).

[Hai_hai]

Each country's Olympic committee needs to have a sport's representative. The AUSKF attempted to join the USOC but were denied because they didn't have enough females representing their "sport".
Whether or not it's going to happen, we need to probe litige. He's not being very kendo-ish at all.

[Ninjujinkaku]

Once Judo was considered as part of budou.... saddly not anymore.
For example,
-even there is a start line, they do not use it
-they do not bow correctly
-they do not dress properly (some even wear gi lose, for advantage)
-changed pointing system (do not use old style scoring)
-jumping up & down celebrating before bow out.
-sponsorship endorsements

Lost all essential part of budou and became a SPORTs

Your concept of judo is just that yours, its not reality, go here.
http://www.e-budo.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=27628

[jmarsten]

Each country's Olympic committee needs to have a sport's representative. The AUSKF attempted to join the USOC but were denied because they didn't have enough females representing their "sport".
Whether or not it's going to happen, we need to probe litige. He's not being very kendo-ish at all.
I don't know where you came up with that info but I believe it to be in error. There were several hoops we did not jump through in order to be accepted. I personally as the president of AUSKF investigated and initiated action to the joining of the USOC. Not enough women was not even close to our problems.
On another note after watching some Taekwando gold medal matches please don't subject kendo to that kind of emasculation.
J Marsten AUSKF founding president

[Hai_hai]

I don't know where you came up with that info but I believe it to be in error. There were several hoops we did not jump through in order to be accepted. I personally as the president of AUSKF investigated and initiated action to the joining of the USOC. Not enough women was not even close to our problems.
On another note after watching some Taekwando gold medal matches please don't subject kendo to that kind of emasculation.
J Marsten AUSKF founding president
Sorry, that was my mistake. I had to re-read the info I got from the AUSKF website. It was that there was no female who is a woman and athlete on the AUSKF Board of Directors among other things.

[jmarsten]

I would like to point out that the reason we were looking at the US Olympic Committee was not to be in the Olympics. Our purpose was to gain access to the training facilities and techinical knowledge that membership would bring.

[senki-kendo-jos]

I reckon if enough people signed some sort of petition and sent it to Jacques Rogges or whoever it is now, they'd have to think about it... I mean, there are quite a few of us... and we're damned scary! UP THE KENSHI!!!!

[tyler]

I think kendo ought not to be represented in the olympics. I agree with most of the reasons stated thus far, about the changes which will happen with the olympics, whether you call it degradation or evolution. What is at stake and what can and likely will be lost is clear to me. What isn't clear, what i don't understand is what can be gained by joining the olympic movement.

So far I've gleaned this: the olympics are huge, a massive global movement with unparalleled (sp?) financial clout. We all like kendo, kendo is good, therefore the spread or propagation of kendo must also be good. So far i'm on board, but the question of how kendo should be spread is where things seem to get hazy. It seems to me the olympic argument is that, since the olympics has so much money behind it, attaching kendo to the olympic rocket will make it go the fastest and the highest (stronger, better, upwards, outtermost, toppermost or however the motto goes).

I'd like to suggest that a large-scale, fast and money-fueled propagation of kendo (as per the olympics - if you thought kill bill/last samurai brought the beginner tsunami just imagine if kendo joined) is ultimatly a harmful one.

There's no question that joining the olympic movement would bring a huge wad of cash. Government sponsorship, corporate sponsorship, grants - lots more people would be able to learn kendo. On the other hand, there will be the changes to facilitate new spectators, American name brand bogu made in third world countries, possibly electronic scoring - the list goes on.

And why? Its not as though there isn't already a global kendo body. We have the world kendo championships, there is already an international stage. Again it comes down to a question of growth. I would advocate a slower, more careful growth in line with the traditions of kendo as budo. There is already an over-emphasis on tournament kendo. The olympic route, as I see it, is about money and it would bring an unprecedented, myopic and alltogether too fast proliferation of a bastardized kendo.

I think the kind of growth which would follow the inclusion of kendo in the olympics would prove cancerous. I believe it would spread kendo too thin.

Lastly, sorry this is dragging on, I feel that we ought not to focus in our discussions on why its not currently possible for kendo to become an olympic sport. Several people have mentioned why its not going to happen anytime soon, and they're right. But the reasons are temporary one's. No women on the panel yet? There will be soon. Not in enough countries yet? They're working on it. Lets not talk about how its not going to happen before the next olympics and start talking about why it should never happen even when it can.

thanks for the discussion so far