How long?

[Winter_Wolf]

Hi,
Just curious as to how long people waited before buying their own Shinai. The reason i'm asking is because i'm currently using one of our dojo's practice Shinai and I really worry bout accidentaly damaging it.
Thanks,
W.W.

[Confound]

It may be good to use the dojo's shinai for the first little while, just so that you can test out a few different kinds. It's the cheap way to sample the available types and choose which one you like best. Don't worry about damaging a shinai, it isn't easy to do if you're just practicing normally. Unless you're hitting things as hard as you can, and wielding that shinai like a caveman's club, there is nothing to worry about.

I bought my own immediately, but that was only because there were no shinai available that were the required length. Take your time, talk to a few people, try them all on for size, then pick one or two. It's not a crucial decision, shinai aren't overly expensive, when compared to bogu, keikogi or hakama.

c

[Paburo]

in our dojo, shinai is the only thing you have to buy right away to start practicing, since we don't have many dojo shinais.

like confound said, don't be afraid to buy your shinai now or use the dojos, cause you won't ruin it until much later when you start hitting metallic things at great speed.

one note if you want to buy though, if you are more than 18 yrs old be sure to get a 39 size. 38 is for girls.... (like naginata :D)

jk

[Winter_Wolf]

Hi,
Well, I'll probably buy just for the sake of having my own, and because a metal pole jumped out in front of my shinai yesterday evening and I really thought i'd damaged the shinai. Man, that metal pole was fast, I really didn't see it until it jumped out from behind some cardboard boxes! Looks like I practice outdoors from now on(rather than my basement, darn snow!)
Anyway, since i'll probably buy within the month (I hope) where did u guys get your shinai(s)? I thought about e-bogu, but i'm not sure on the size my shinai should be, how do I measure the one I've got? Oh! and i'm not sure bout how many we have (shinai's) so that's why I think i'm probably gonna buy, and my shinai will definitely be bamboo because of price concerns.
Thanks,
W.W.

[Confound]

O can it, Paburo. I use a 38, and I have sempais who use them too. You should choose your shinai based on your own size, not the size that you want people to see written on the tsuka!

A good shinai size should come up to your solar plexus when stood on its end. If that's a 39, a 40 or a 36, it doesn't matter. One inch doesn't give any advantage. It isn't the length of your shinai, or its weight, it's your skill with it that matters. Get your mind out of the gutter, Meng. You too, Ares.

c

[iwatekenshi]

Yes my wife uses a 39 so do a lot of other women here in Japan. As a matter of fact she just moved up last year in order to adjust her style. FYI Those size rules apply only to minors.

Also I was at the Mainichi Newspaper Ladies Tournament in Tokyo yesterday and I saw plenty of 39 being used. It was some good kendo!

[Ares2907]

Not guilty your honour (despite certain monty python skits immediately springing to mind).

You're being a bit hard on me, Confound. If I didn't know better I'd say you were looking for a rise.

[Neil Gendzwill]

Originally posted by Confound
A good shinai size should come up to your solar plexus when stood on its end. If that's a 39, a 40 or a 36, it doesn't matter.
As a matter of fact, it does matter. There are rules on maximum size and minimum weight for tournaments by age and sex - see http://www.kendo-sask.com/swordfaq.htm#_Toc422549477. You would do well to get the shinai that's the appropriate size.

For adult males, the size is 39. For adult women, the size is 38. Women can use a 39 but it must be very light. If you are under 18, the max size is 38, under 15 the max is 37. Girls might go smaller, everyone goes smaller if they are younger. 36 is usually appropriate for kids 10 or 12 years old unless they're exceptionally big. Little kids use 30, 32, 34 depending on how little.

For your first shinai, buy the cheapest complete (that has all the leather bits) they've got in the size that's appropriate. You won't appreciate the higher quality ones at your level, and you'll break it within a year anyways.

[Winter_Wolf]

Hi,
Oh, ok. Thanks a lot Neil. So that would put me at a size 38 I guess. Any ideas on where/how to buy?
thanks,
W.W.

[Neil Gendzwill]

Doesn't your dojo sell them? If not, local knife shops often carry them but they don't have a clue about sizes usually - you want one that is 44" long overall. If you want to do mail order, e-bogu is OK. Shipping costs might kill you on a single shinai, especially if you go overseas (kendoshop etc).

[Winter_Wolf]

Hi,
Neil, our dojo is the upstairs room of the Waynesboro YMCA so i'm not sure bout how many shinai would be on hand or anything, i'll definitely find out tonight an then post an update. thanks very much for the help by the way!
thanks,
W.W.

[Paburo]

Originally posted by Confound
O can it, Paburo. I use a 38, and I have sempais who use them too. You should choose your shinai based on your own size, not the size that you want people to see written on the tsuka!

A good shinai size should come up to your solar plexus when stood on its end. If that's a 39, a 40 or a 36, it doesn't matter. One inch doesn't give any advantage. It isn't the length of your shinai, or its weight, it's your skill with it that matters. Get your mind out of the gutter, Meng. You too, Ares.

c

i wanted to be the first to reply to this ignorant post, but Neil-san went in first.

in old kenjutsu days, katana was carefully tailored to fit the user. the blade should be short and light enough to be comfortably swung, but also long and heavy enough to be able to deliver deadly sharp cuts.

lenght and weight in shinai also do matter a lot in kendo. if there weren´t any regulations, kenshi would probably use larger and/or lighter shinais to score more points in shiai (since cutting and killing isn't really an issue now, most kenshi would go for a lighter/faster shinai with longer reach).

i could use a 38, and i had sometimes, it feels light and i'm faster with it, but what would be the point in keep training with it if on tournaments i will be asked to use a 39?

[Confound]

I'm assuming we're all down with the length and weight restrictions. I was responding strictly to the '38 is for women' comment.

c

[Neil Gendzwill]

Originally posted by Paburo

i could use a 38, and i had sometimes, it feels light and i'm faster with it, but what would be the point in keep training with it if on tournaments i will be asked to use a 39?
You can use a 38 if you want, as long as it weighs over 510 g. The regulations are *max* length and *min* weight.

Within your dojo you can of course do what you like. My sensei sometimes uses a 38 cut down to 35 length. It's his own personal training to force himself to use strong seme.

[mingshi]

mmm... Interesting.

Maybe when I am Hachidan I would use a Shoto only.

Hehehe ;)

[Paburo]

Originally posted by Neil Gendzwill

You can use a 38 if you want, as long as it weighs over 510 g. The regulations are *max* length and *min* weight.


true. but that would be a disadvantage lenght/reach-wise, if they are gonna weight about the same anyway. i think that's why some women use 39 shinai.... more range, no?

(besides 39 is perfect for my height (184cms - 6'))

[Old Warrior]

This another stupid newbie inquiry. Since cost wasn't an overriding issue I bought a couple of shinai from different companies when I began. One was a 39 and the other a 38. The 38 actually feels heavier and stiffer. Is what you like strictly a matter of how it feels or is the shinai's acceptability also a matter of your personal Kendo style.

In European Epee fencing I used to be very particular in selecting my epee blades and went through dozens at the store before I found one I would buy. I looked for balance point, flexibility and natural bend. Eventually, any blade bcame ok as long as it wasn't outrageously heavy or stiff. I found as my fencing got better it didn't matter what blade I was holding. I wonder if the choice of shiai is similar.

[amatsuda]

Old Warrior: It all comes down to personal preference...As you become more advanced, you tend to pick shinai that meets your style and tastes...

[Balance]
Some people like their shinai tip heavy. Some like the balance towards the middle..especially if the shinai will be used for shiai.

[Shinai Style]
For instance, some people like the Dobari Style [thick near the handle and thinner towards the tip] while others like the Chokuto style [thinner..and straight all the way through]. Others like the Koban Style [oval shaped tsuka]

Personally, I like to use Dobari...I have a hard time using the chokuto style shinai...

[Physical Characteristics]
Some people choose their shinai based on physical characteristics...I have fairly small hands...I cannot use shinai with tsuka that are larger in circumference...Therefore, I prefer to use E-Bogu's Musha and Hyoei shinai because they feel more comfortable and the tsuka is smaller in diameter. Unfortunately, I cannot use their Issho shinai because the tsuka is too thick..

In the beginning, these factors don't really mean much because you are only focusing on learning the basics and getting your body acclimated to the rigors of kendo practice.

However, as you get more advanced you will want to find the shinai that works for you and you feel most comfortable with. What may work for others may not work for you...

For instance, I received one of Ota Sensei's shinai (Tokyo Metr. Police Dept. Ret.) and this shinai is THICK all the way from the tsuka to the tip and weighs about 550 grams..!! I have such a hard time practicing with this shinai yet Ota Sensei was swinging this shinai around like it was a toothpick...I realized that I am not ready to use this type of shinai yet, so I do suburi with it everyday.


amatsuda
http://mywebpage.netscape.com/sjkendo

[Winter_Wolf]

Hi,
Old Warrior, if I didn't know better (and I don't) i'd say you're trying to get me mad by insulting me:eek: . anyway, just got in from practice and i'm loving kendo even more every time! Gonna wait on buying a shinai, but thanks to all who contributed, i'll store your suggestions for future use!
thanks,
W.W.

[Old Warrior]

"Old Warrior, if I didn't know better (and I don't) i'd say you're trying to get me mad by insulting me"

And how have I offended thee?

[iwatekenshi]

Correct me if I'm wrong and sorry to butt in but Old Warrior is referring to himself as another newbie.

Yes I think usually as you get better you find some preference to a certain type of shinai. I'm more general. Whatever feels comfortable.

[Winter_Wolf]

Hi,

stupid newbie
maybe i'm misreading but are u calling my question stupid(in which case i'm offended), or saying something else all together(in which case I appologize for the mistake)? No big deal either way.
thanks,
W.W.

[Winter_Wolf]

or are u calling yourself stupid, in which case i'm coming over and giving u a big fuzzy hug;) **cue carebear music** ...

lol, j/k

[Winter_Wolf]

also, everytime I post I increase my post count!!!
mwahahahaha, fear the dreaded long winded wolf!

[Ostrak]

Old Warrior is a newbie (no offense OW, I'm even more new than you) and is calling his question a stupid newbie question. I realize you now want to give him a "big fuzzy hug" to resolve this...but can you please turn off the carebear music? Please!?

[Old Warrior]

I'll take the hug - I need every one I can get. At Tuesday's class one of the higher students (which is everyone, since I'm at the end of the line) said to me "I don't know how you do this at your age". Now, I have added another reason to train harder - just to beat his tail and then proclaim it must be an accident.

[sminki]

Good for you old warrior. Give them hell. People who say "I don't know how you do this at your age" don't really understand kendo/kumdo. (Although I'm sure they mean it in a semi-complimentary way.)

[Old Warrior]

The chap who made the comment was in his late 30's and actually meant "my body is killing me, yours must be hurting even more".

The reality is that I have been fencing (be it European) at least once a week for 15+ years. Because of the "on guard position" and the awkward torque on the back knee to advance, European fencing is much more destructive on the body. I actaully feel much better since starting Kumdo, because the posture is erect with a nice natural bend on the spine. And, the only time the knees take a beating is when we do that thing where you raise the shinai high, break at the knees going all the way down and back up again (all the time maintaining good posture and the on guard blade position). We do that one after certain designated exercises are completed. Of course, I got a pass to avoid all "seiza?" sitting - my knees won't take that at all.

[Winter_Wolf]

Hi,
oh, well then, I appologize profusely Old Warrior, i'm newbie(er?) w/ only 2 wks. of training under my belt so my questions are all stupid inqueries. I think the reason I misunderstood your post was that it didn't end in a question mark and i'm like a punctuation freak, guess it's the writer coming out in me.
Again, I apologize profusely for my mistake.
thanks,
W.W.

[Winter_Wolf]

grrrrr. I mispelled apologize didn't I......
To much school, thats the problem....

[Tako-kun]

Winter Wolf
Too much school. Muhahahah :)