Learning Japanese...

[stephanie dee]

Hey!

I'm trying to teach myself Japanese (i've got one of those tape thingys). Is there an easier way to learn it? Does anywhere do classes? I can't afford to go to Japan just yet, so as i am saving I am wanting to learn...

HELP!!!

[Mugu]

Hey!

I'm trying to teach myself Japanese (i've got one of those tape thingys). Is there an easier way to learn it? Does anywhere do classes? I can't afford to go to Japan just yet, so as i am saving I am wanting to learn...

HELP!!!

I taught myself all the "alphabets" before high school. Start with Hiragana, then Katakana. I was lucky, my high school offered Japanese so I took it for 2 years and my college also offered it also and I took it for another year. The alphabets are extremely easy to learn. But when it comes to Kanji, I had an advantage of being Chinese because kanji are just Chinese characters, lol But when comes to the speaking part, I'm still... "umm what did you just say?" :p At least you can read a bit right? heh Have fun! :)

I also have a recommendation of memorizing the alphabets... once you picked up all the basic alphabets, try listening to Japanese songs and sing along if you have the lyrics. I found it pretty darn helpful memorizing them and reading them faster.

Edit: just type in Hiragana and katakana in google you'll find them and go from there. I don't like learning phases before I know the alphabets, I also think knowing the basic alphabets help you pick up the phases better.

[SEEK]

I just bought the practicebooks of "Japanese for busy people I ". And really, the hiriganapart is so easy to learn. These books have a very easy way to teach you speak and read daily japanese. I bought my study books secondhand by google. Give it a try. If you're determined to learn, it's really not that hard. Success!

[nodachi]

That is an excellent series to learn from. I highly recommend them as well. In addition to studying from a book, make sure you have the answer key to all exercises so you can make sure you are memorizing and studying things correctly. Watch lots of Japanese television to help you to recognize grammar patterns that you have learned and increase your vocabulary without actually realizing it. Anime and normal japanese tv dramas so you don't just get cartoon voices but practice with real voices. And try and find a Japanese grocery store or some place where a lot of Japanese go and post a flyer asking to set up a language exchange. You do stuff or go to cafes and places like that where you can talk in English for half the visit, and then in Japanese for the other half. It's like free language lessons for the both of you.

[aquilonian]

Hey!

I'm trying to teach myself Japanese (i've got one of those tape thingys). Is there an easier way to learn it? Does anywhere do classes? I can't afford to go to Japan just yet, so as i am saving I am wanting to learn...

HELP!!!

japan would be more enjoyable if you could actually understand what is being said. I would recommend you learn to speak and understand first then make your trip. I myself tried for three years to learn, I figured out how japanese worked but I could not understand in a flash. all the while I kept trying different materials with different aproches. when I found one that worked it only took me one year to learn to speak and listen.
the following course that I put togheter served not only me but two other people (one was a woman, cause they say they learn differently) so it worked for different tastes not just my own. however they are not fluent they can't read or write anything, they just couldn't keep the characters memorized in their minds.
first you have to understand that a language can be approached from various angles, it can be approached as a dead arcane language that is to be studied and memorized, analized and translated. so the words, grammar rules, and prashes all come from your memory. what it meas for you is continual work and drudgery (that is why most college students fail to learn a language when they take it as a class). the best approach is to see it as a skill a means for communication, in other words simply something to be used. this is how children manage to learn (a 3yo can't memorize any grammar to save his life).
I understand you are in the uk so the same books might not be available to you. try to get one that offers you sentenses with minimal grammar, like asking a question in japanese in wich you have to answer promply, example sore wa nan desu ka? A: kore wa hon desu. grammar books are bad, by explaining the working of a language in your mother tongue it takes away time from learning, and it gets you out of the minset of aquiring the skill in using the language instead.
knowing how a language works doesnt help you much, you need the skill of using the language. for example when driving and you see danger ahead, what matters is that your foot is on the brake, knowing how the brake system on the car works won't help you much. therefore the skill of driving and not the knowledge are more important in this case.
following is a simple lists of tools to use: book- BASIC JAPANESE COURSE by NAGANUMA NAOE (naganuma is the last name), this book accomplishes the above mentioned, however it was published in 1950 there is no isbn # on it.
book- beginners japanese by joanne redmond claypoole isbn# 0-7818-0234-2 this book will teach you your grammar (because I am sure you want to know) and is the simplest one, quite a bit of japanese was learned in this book to my surprise, considering it teaches much grammar.
anime- get anime without too much foul language and slang. gundam wing is good, for girls fushigi yugi might do. the way to watch it is to watch an episode without the subtitles (just the japanese dialogue), then watch it again with the subtitles and see wich words you missed. this part of your learning course comes after you have learned a few words in japanese, just a few not many. in the videos where the subtitles cannot be turned off you will have to cover them with something.
Computer- the games slime forest and knuckles in kanjiland, will help you learn the writting system of japan, they are fun and sometimes addicting. what is best is that they are both free, all you have to do is download them, just search for them in google lets say.
that will do the trick, when you use all these you will find out that you are picking up japanese on your own, just by using a dictionary. some people also use japanese music to help them. but the people I thaught (well the authors of these works did). correction the people that I presented with this approach including myself preffered their own music.
Well I am sure I gave you more than you wanted to know by now, I hope this helps.

[Kingofmyrrh]

I would say myself that the methods that aquilonian suggests are fine for basic conversational Japanese, but to express more difficult concepts you will have to take the plunge and learn some grammar. If you just want to get by, then I'm all for aquilonian's methods, but if you're looking at things with a more long-term view, and want to avoid getting into habits that, while sufficient for communication, are not exactly stylish, then prepare yourself for some drudgery!

[Nokori 3byo]

Many valid points made in the above postings. Perhaps I can add my two cents. To speak Japanese at an adult level (as opposed to infatile or caveman level) you must study grammar, and in particular, key phrases ("I intend to...", "have you ever...", etc.). To this end, learning the basic conjugation patterns of verbs, their stem forms and plain and polite forms, is the Rosetta Stone of basic Japanese. Once you've got hiragana and basic particle usage out of the way, drill yourself relentlessly for about two weeks to recognize patterns in verb conjugation (how to form the plain past and non-past from verb stems, their relationship to the polite forms and so on). Then, you'll be ready to tackle some basic phrases. These, matched with the first 1000 words of vocab, will send you on your way.

We"re talking about a good 100 hours time commitment, here. But you'll only get the daily practice you need by moving to Japan, which I recommend you do.

[Infinity]

I study with Kumon via correspondence.

Every month I am sent worksheets and many other study resources.

Everyday I complete a book of worksheets - around 30mins of study.

I then send off my completed worksheets and they are sent back marked and feedback is given.

After 7 months I can write many sentences in hiragana and understand a little of what is said in Japanese during training.

More importantly I can say nice things to my Japanese sempai and sensei.

It is my belief that in learning any language one must also study the culture. Language and culture are intrinsically linked and learning both can make lessons easier to understand.

Good luck with it!

[Pan-Chan]

Are you near any universities?

Sometimes universities offer Japanese courses over the summer; the one by my home offers a course and it is open to everyone.

Anyways, just a thought.

Good luck with your learning, it's a really fun language even though it's a bit tough at first.

Gonbate.

[Yaiba]

Hi Stephanie,

What everyone has said so far is very good advice. My suggestion is that you should first learn to recognise and pronounce Hiragana and Katakana characters with confidence using your study material. I think this is most important as a beginner because it will serve as a foundation for your future studies in more complex areas. Once you are fairly confident with this, try to familiarise yourself with basic phrases and grammatical structures. Repetition is the key. Listen carefully to how it is spoken on the tape and read it out aloud (this is where Hiragana/Katakana recognition and pronunciation comes in handy!).

Unfortunately, the adult brain can only take in so much and trying to memorise complex structures and phrases (and Kanji characters for that matter) may be somewhat futile, especially when you live outside of Japan and don't use it enough. This leads me to my next point...

...you'll only get the daily practice you need by moving to Japan, which I recommend you do.
Yes, I absolutely agree. To make learning Japanese more productive, you have to immerse yourself with the appropriate surroundings, which is spending a considerable amount of time in Japan, preferably at a language school. It becomes a matter of survival and this will definitely make you learn Japanese a lot quicker. One thing to keep in mind though is that you should try to study your Japanese in Tokyo (ie Kanto region) as other regions have different dialects (ie non-standard Japanese) that may use completely different words for the same meaning. I mean, Yorkshire is very different to other parts of England, right? :wink:

Anyway, the important thing to remember is that this will take time and a lot of hard work but don't let it dishearten you. Everyone has the same problem (eg I'm studying Korean at the moment using self-teaching materials and it requires a lot of patience). When you can converse with someone from a different country in their tongue though, it'll feel great and it'll be all worth it. Best of luck!

[Charuzu]

http://www.rpg-dev.net/projects.php?action=view&id=199

Is called Knuckles in China land. BEST, and most fun Japanese learning game.

PS - I have no idea when the added in that hat... In my version their is no hat.

[The great I AM]

Having learnt japanese for about 4 years, the best advice I can offer, is speak to as many japanese as possible (in Nihongo da yo!). You will pick far more than just learning in classes or from books, and things that you would never be taught in class (for instance I have a reasonably good understanding of kansai-ben thanks to my osaka friends, or informal chatty japanese because of the wide spread of people that I try to talk to). This will be a brilliant supplement to whatever you do in class and will really help you out. Trust me!

[Veren]

I'm currently working through Pimsleur's Speak and Understand Japanese, which I recommend highly. It's been very good and I'm surprised at how well I'm retaining things. I find it a great resource because I can pop a CD in while I'm commuting and get a lesson done during my commute (where I would normally just be listening to the radio).

Pimsleur is good for listening and understanding spoken Japanese, but as others have mentioned, you really need to learn Hiragana and Katakana as well. I've been using the Let's Learn Hiragana/Katakana by Mitamura, and again, I recommend these workbooks.

Another resource: http://www.thejapanesepage.com . Excellent resource.

Travelling to Japan would definitely be the best teacher, though, especially if you already know some basic Japanese. I have heard that the Japanese are thrilled to see foreigners taking an interest in their culture and language, and are usually very accomodating.

A few more tips:
- Avoid romanji like the plague. Learn Hiragana and Katakana and depend upon that. Besides, a lot of the best books on learning Japanese utilize the kana. Romanji is a terrible crutch and eventually, you'll have to learn the kana and kanji anyways, so you'll be learning things twice. Bleah.
- Use whatever knowledge you pick up every day. Got some free time? Practice speaking Japanese during that time. If you've got friends also learning, talk to them. Got pets? Talk to them in Japanese (they aren't going to understand it any better than English... :) ) Basically, exploit every opportunity to use what you've learned.
- Be careful with anime. A lot of the speech in anime is very artificial-- it's designed this way-- so take care with it. You can use it for word recognition and for correct pronounciations, but you'll need another source for grammatical structures, etc. Also, be aware that, depending upon the translations, the words you see in the subtitles aren't the words being spoken in Japanese.
- If you're dream is to live in Japan for a while, there is a teaching program for English native speakers called JET which runs one-year contracts for people to go over to Japan and help teach English in Japanese schools. You will need any college degree, but JET pretty much pays your way and gets you set up in Japan. For more information, here's the link: http://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/jet/ It might be a bit of a while before you're able to go, but it's definitely a good way to experience Japan if you are very interested in learning more about the country.

[Kingofmyrrh]

Trust the cactus. He speaks sense. (What is the name of the cactus? [Not you gibbo]. I can remember that he runs away at the slightest excuse and also uses '10000 needles' but I can't remember his name).
Solid advice from Veren as well, especially with regards to the anime. Gotta be careful not to come out sounding like you've got a screw loose, which is all too likely if you rely too heavily on anime. Best of luck!

[nodachi]

If you are planning on using the Pimsleur CDs, be sure to buy them off of eBay. If you buy them new for yourself, you will pay double. But they are good. I've used them too.

[Fonsz]

Here in Holland, the Japanese Embassy has been offering Japanese Language Courses. I had finished two years and I can ask where the toilet is and who I am. It was great fun because we went also on fieldtrips to a Sushibar and other Japanese Restaurants. At he end of the course there were congratulations from the Ambassador himself. You received a diploma and the staff of the embassy was testing your Japanese. And of course there was Japanese food again.

I always wish that I could learn it better and I'm thinking of getting a course in Japan if I ever get there.
I would like to go to this one for example but has anyone here experience with them?
http://www.kjls.or.jp/

[Kaoru]

Hey!

I'm trying to teach myself Japanese (i've got one of those tape thingys). Is there an easier way to learn it? Does anywhere do classes? I can't afford to go to Japan just yet, so as i am saving I am wanting to learn...

HELP!!!

Hi!

Please see the thread I started on Japanese language learning websites for learning Japanese here:

http://www.e-budo.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=15

I also started one on Japanese language study books in this forum. Both were made stickies, so you can easily find them.

And, while you're at it, check the archives in this forum for even more Japanese language information. :)

Hope this helps!

Oh yeah... Stay away from romaji(Romanised Japanese). Start right off, with learning Hiragana and katakana first and then, add the kanji. It is just best to immerse yourself in the actual language.

Kaoru

[mingshi]

What is the name of the cactus?
That's Jumbo Cactaur you are talking about - from FF8 I think.

...Did I just speak Densha Otoko-hen..??

[stephanie dee]

Hey!

Thank you all for your great advise! I have the Pimsleur learning tapes, they are good! Thank you all loads for your help!! I didn't know that there were different types!!!

[pimp1911]

stephanie dee. If you need a penpal let me know. I am learning as well. I am taking a 10 week intro class now. 8 weeks down 2 to go.

[The great I AM]

That's Jumbo Cactaur you are talking about - from FF8 I think.

...Did I just speak Densha Otoko-hen..??

Or the Cactuar Guardians from the desert in FFX. And you just spoke OTAKU!