Who should We condemn behind The London Bombing?

[ISSAC RU]

Is it the Terrorists?
Who is the true barbarian behind all of these horrible tragdies?
Who is the one plant this terrorism seed?
Who is the one invade other country thru a violent war?
How can those who is brutally killing the innocent lives of the
others condemn this tragdy?
Who has the right to give the meaning of '' Terrorism'' when they
are acting in such way?
The deaths of the innocent men and women in this tradgy should
be remembered, but this doesn't mean their lives are more important
than the others across the world.
If we must condemn , We must Condemn the true masterminded
terrorist behind all of these killings.

[Anjin-san]

Please. Stop. Now.

[ISSAC RU]

Why stop when we can openly and freely discuss some of the world hottest
issues that may effect our lives?

[Munnin]

Well a conservitive pundent was busy smearing liberals with the blood of the victims before the blood was cold so I guess I should be fine with it. But I am not; lets try to have a little class and wait until the bodies are burried before we start finger pointing, assigning blame, and all the other petty garbage standard to politics these days.

[Anjin-san]

Because I don't know if any of my friends have been killed, maimed or embedded with peices of train or bus. As munin said can we please wait before we start the big pointless political debates? Out of maybe a sense of respect perhaps?

[ISSAC RU]

Because I don't know if any of my friends have been killed, maimed or embedded with peices of train or bus. As munin said can we please wait before we start the big pointless political debates? Out of maybe a sense of respect perhaps?

Respect? How many innocent arabs are being killed everyday?
Who gave them the respect they deserve?

[Theodore]

Respect? How many innocent arabs are being killed everyday?
Who gave them the respect they deserve?

Don't get us (Western Civilization) started. History holds a stern lesson for those who well and truly pissed off Europeans (and their kin). (http://www.mandelinople.com/2005/07/lack-of-history-classes-part-2.html)

Here's the money quote:


While London never will, we do know all to well from experience that Baghdad or Tehran could very well end up another Tenochtitlan. Combine all the force of arms of the entire Islamic world into one large army and they would stand as such: no air force, no navy, no technology, no industry to back them, no trade to sustain them. The one commodity they have is far more a curse. That they need the dreaded infidel to extract, process and ship it is testament to their weakness. That we have an insatiable appetite is testament to our wealth and strength. Don't confuse the two.

[The great I AM]

I just knew you would come in on this. You are the most hateful example of a person on this forum. People are still dying in hospitals, I haven't heard back from some of the people whom I call friends yet, and here you are using this as a way to further your little war on the west. You are the lowest of the low.


Yesterdays goings on have nothing to do with you, and nothing to do with China, so please just leave it alone. You constantly criticise the war and america and (probably following this) Britain, and are basically saying that its our own fault, but to be honest, I don't care right now. I want to know that the people I hold dear to me are all safe. This is obviously something you have completley failed to understand just by beginning this thread. Why can't you show some humanity, which you claim is lacking everywhere else? Why can't you leave alone, even for a moment, when you criticise for not leaving alone?

This is still fresh in our minds. I was scared sitting on the bus going to work this morning just in case it all happened again. I won't use the during rush hour for probably a few weeks. What about you? Has this changed your life at all? No? Not even slightly? Right, now that thats sorted, **** off.

[T.Lee]

I condemn you, ISAAC RU.

[The great I AM]

I condemn you, ISAAC RU.

Yup, me too.

[louisvandalen]

Respect? How many innocent arabs are being killed everyday? Who gave them the respect they deserve?

The difference between you and normal people is that the later do sympathise with any victim of violence: Asian, EU, US, Arab or whatever.

Then again, your reaction doesn't really matter that much since you will give us the respect we deserve, eventually. It's just a matter of time before EU/US troops march the streets of Mecca to restore order in a "gone-wild" world.

And the lamb of God returned as a Lion........

L'union fait la force (Belgium)
Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité (France)
Je maintiendrai (The Netherlands)

[louisvandalen]

History holds a stern lesson for those who well and truly pissed off Europeans (and their kin). (http://www.mandelinople.com/2005/07/lack-of-history-classes-part-2.html)

Didn't read it before my last post. Hear hear!!!

[Gregory]

I just wanted to say Issac, I have been here for less than a week, and already I find you repulsive. I am the type of person who likes everyone, and even I find you disgusting. You give Middle Easterners a bad name. Its people like YOU that are the cause of all this. The people who try their hardest to start as much shit as they can because noone loves them at home. Do you LIKE doing this? Well here little prick. Go get a life, stop staying online 24/7 and trying to start little wars between people. Noone likes you, there isnt even a moderate opinion towards you, in a forum with 4,552 members and 3 times as many people who havent signed up, not ONE person has any feeling other than hate and pity towards you. You need to get a hint, go back into the hole you crawled out of and DIE. We all have family members in that part of the world, some are now hurt or gone forever. You want to act like a little bitch? Do it in your company when noone else is around. Do you think acting like this makes you cool? Do you think that we are all sitting here saying " Damn, That kid is freaking amazing, he is my role model?" NO. Truth is, your just some scared little kid, who wouldnt DARE to say this stuff to any of our faces because you know we would beat the living shit out of you.

You think that saying stuff about politics makes you look like a smart and rebellious kid? Well you dont know SHIT about politics, you dont know shit about ANYTHING. So listen kid, go back, do some research, and then come and talk to us, because you arent worth our time.

[Gregory]

Someone had to stop beating around the bush and say it, so I did. For any of you who were offended, sorry, and to issac, you are so lucky that I pity you, you have no idea.

[Gregory]

The difference between you and normal people is that the later do sympathise with any victim of violence: Asian, EU, US, Arab or whatever.

Then again, your reaction doesn't really matter that much since you will give us the respect we deserve, eventually. It's just a matter of time before EU/US troops march the streets of Mecca to restore order in a "gone-wild" world.

And the lamb of God returned as a Lion........

L'union fait la force (Belgium)
Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité (France)
Je maintiendrai (The Netherlands)

Talk as much shit as you want about him, but dont start talking like that about a country and its people. The majority of them are peace loving. In the koran it SPECIFICALLY says : Dont kill anyone, religion or creed doesnt matter. All life is the same to god. if you do you will pay for it later. The terrorist twisted this by saying (same as what the christians said during the crusades) "oh the mean dont kill other MUSLIMS!!!!" they specifically didnt read the "anyone" part

[Berugijin]

Didn't read it before my last post. Hear hear!!!

HEAR HEAR??

Wow.

I always liked to think that Europe was civil now, considering we've seen so much bloodshed on this continent already, but in reality, it's only been fifty years since the last time we shot eachother to hell.

I, for one, am not saying "hear hear" to the destructive capabilities of Europe.

[Akai Bushi]

My heart goes out to all my English brothers. You helped us during 9/11. I hope there is a way we can help you.
***
I can't believe someone has the nerve to basically say they were asking for it. The terrorist are to blame. No one, but terrorist. Only cowards fight in such away. Al Q. and all the other groups have no sense of honor or respect. Bombing civilians; women and children, on purpose no less. Before 9/11 we weren't occupying Iraq and Afganistan. By bombing civilians the terrorists were asking to be hunted down like the dogs that they are. There is no need to talk nice about murderers. Thousands or lives gone thousands more injured. New York, London, Madrid, whats next Tokyo or Roma. What do they expect us to do just sit here and take it? I'm sorry if I offended anyone who has lost a loved one in this tradgedy, but this uncivilized stuff pisses me off.

[JSchmidt]

but in reality, it's only been fifty years since the last time we shot eachother to hell.

Far less than that..ever heard of a place called Yugoslavia?

Jakob

[KhawMengLee]

Is it the Terrorists?
Who is the true barbarian behind all of these horrible tragdies?
Who is the one plant this terrorism seed?
Who is the one invade other country thru a violent war?
How can those who is brutally killing the innocent lives of the
others condemn this tragdy?
Who has the right to give the meaning of '' Terrorism'' when they
are acting in such way?
The deaths of the innocent men and women in this tradgy should
be remembered, but this doesn't mean their lives are more important
than the others across the world.
If we must condemn , We must Condemn the true masterminded
terrorist behind all of these killings.

Whatever our political viewpoints or assumptions are on this, lets stop right now, eh? People have been killed. Thank god my friends are safe...but lets not forget those who are lost.

Whatever your viewpoint is STOP RIGHT NOW! This includes those who want to sell the War on Terror issue or you ISSAC(for starting this totally tactless and ill timed thread).

Let the dead have their peace and a nation mourn!

If not for humanity's sake then for the respect for our fellow British kendoka.

[Paikea]

Don't get us (Western Civilization) started. History holds a stern lesson for those who well and truly pissed off Europeans (and their kin). (http://www.mandelinople.com/2005/07/lack-of-history-classes-part-2.html)
...You know Theodore, you and I sit on opposite sides on the political stuff but in this I have to agree and it's something that has been in my mind since Sept. 11, 2001. I absolutely do fear what we are capable of (specifically the US, but the points about Western Europe and by inference, Canada, are very well taken) when well-and-truly enraged as a nation or as a group of allies.

Collectively, we are capable of going quite mad and have the power to "solve" the problem with extreme prejudice (read: "God's own thunder"). We will feel bad about it later, but that will not stop the madness from happening in the first place - IF the triggering event is sufficiently heinous.

Please don't take that as some kind of macho "we're gonna get you" statement, as I do not advocate this as a course of action - only as a very real possibility with an unfortunately well-founded historical precedent.

[Lil' Kenshi]

Is it the Terrorists?
Who is the true barbarian behind all of these horrible tragdies?
Who is the one plant this terrorism seed?
Who is the one invade other country thru a violent war?
How can those who is brutally killing the innocent lives of the
others condemn this tragdy?
Who has the right to give the meaning of '' Terrorism'' when they
are acting in such way?
The deaths of the innocent men and women in this tradgy should
be remembered, but this doesn't mean their lives are more important
than the others across the world.
If we must condemn , We must Condemn the true masterminded
terrorist behind all of these killings.

Being the lefty that I am, I find what you say profound. But in all honesty, it's very insesitive.

[Theodore]

You know Theodore, you and I sit on opposite sides on the political stuff but in this I have to agree and it's something that has been in my mind since Sept. 11, 2001. I absolutely do fear what we are capable of (specifically the US, but the points about Western Europe and by inference, Canada, are very well taken) when well-and-truly enraged as a nation or as a group of allies.

Collectively, we are capable of going quite mad and have the power to "solve" the problem with extreme prejudice (read: "God's own thunder"). We will feel bad about it later, but that will not stop the madness from happening in the first place - IF the triggering event is sufficiently heinous.

Please don't take that as some kind of macho "we're gonna get you" statement, as I do not advocate this as a course of action - only as a very real possibility with an unfortunately well-founded historical precedent.

Perry, thanks for understanding my post. I was in no way advocating the indiscriminate destruction of those who are not responsible for these atrocities, I was pointing out that those who do continue to exist only by our sufferance and our lack of desire to deal with this situation the same way that the medieval church did with the Albigenses (http://www.medievalchurch.org.uk/h_cath_alb.html).

A more recent analogy is the Hiroshima/Nagasaki bombing. The Japanese LEADERS during WWII overplayed their hand and thought that by running up the American death count in Saipan, Iwo Jima, and especially Okinawa, that we would rather negotiate a peace on terms more favorable to Japan than unconditional surrender.

Because of the asymmetry of information (Allied leaders knew we had the A-bomb, the Japanese did not) their strategy failed and Truman did a cost benefit analysis and made the politically decision to drop the bomb. Everyone has an opinion about it and none of them are probably right, least of all mine. In the end, however, the war was ended by means that were so terrible that we shudder to think of them to this day.

Militant Islamacists must bear the lessons of history in mind is all that I am trying to say because if sufficiently provoked they could bring down upon more than themselves what you have termed "God's own thunder."

[Paikea]

...what you have termed "God's own thunder."Actually it was Martin Sheen playing Josiah Bartlett on TV, but it's great metaphor (or simile?). Either way, it scares the hell out of me.

[Berugijin]

Militant Islamacists must bear the lessons of history in mind is all that I am trying to say because if sufficiently provoked they could bring down upon more than themselves what you have termed "God's own thunder."

You know, these people blow themselves up right? Somehow I don't think they care what happens in the long run...

And for the leaders who don't blow themselves up, a nuke on Mecca for example would be like a wet dream for them: plenty more recruits.

[drizzt]

Is it the Terrorists?
Who is the true barbarian behind all of these horrible tragdies?
Who is the one plant this terrorism seed?
Who is the one invade other country thru a violent war?
How can those who is brutally killing the innocent lives of the
others condemn this tragdy?
Who has the right to give the meaning of '' Terrorism'' when they
are acting in such way?
The deaths of the innocent men and women in this tradgy should
be remembered, but this doesn't mean their lives are more important
than the others across the world.
If we must condemn , We must Condemn the true masterminded
terrorist behind all of these killings.

Issac, I hope for your sake im wrong and your right about there being no God.....otherwise, i look forward to the day you will burn in hell(and i dont care who does or doesnt like that statement).....

You just sank to the bottom of the tank here. you bellow the bottom feeders. When this was posted, people were dying in a hospital, many of whom never even SUPPORTED actions against any country or group, but you dare to insenuate they somehow got what they had coming?

Ive said it before, and ill say it again, GROW UP. Stop copying, pasting, and then butchering the most liberal, inflamatory horse **** you can find.

I dont beleive in war, but the INTENTIONAL slaughter of civilian populations is a war crime under Geneva, if i remember correctly. Either these people were simply common murderers, or war criminals. Unfortunatly people die, even civilians in war. But to hit only a civilian target intentionaly is murder.

To the friends, relatives, and even members who were hit by this henous incident, I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers.

[Theodore]

And for the leaders who don't blow themselves up, a nuke on Mecca for example would be like a wet dream for them: plenty more recruits.

Attrition of their ranks is probably occurring as we type. (http://fallbackbelmont.blogspot.com/2005/07/iraq-and-london.html)

[samurai999]

Not again..... :disapp: :disapp:

Tim

[ISSAC RU]

Get back to the topic people , Stop the personal attacks.
If you can't argue the points just go home and don't come here
at all. Prove your points are better or be quite.
Personal attacks means you are as immature as some
grade 6 bully in the school.


Huh? When AL Qualda Bombed London they are terrorist but when
they bombed Russians they are freedom fighters?
When chechnya terrorists bombed Russians and kill Russians
they are fighting for freedom and independence?
When Free-Tibet terrorists bombed Chinese they are fighting
for the Human rights?
Tell me , Does this make sense?
Those people died for nothing?
Only British people and American people can feel the pain?


How can a true democractic country invade others without
asking their own people? You call that democracy and justices?
Barbarian Logic

[JSchmidt]

Attrition of their ranks is probably occurring as we type. (http://fallbackbelmont.blogspot.com/2005/07/iraq-and-london.html)

That guy is misguided on many levels. How the hell would he sneak 500kgs of explosive into a packed tube train?...I was a couple of trains behind one of those that blew up and I could barely fit with my bogu bag.

At that stage of the IRA campaign, which he refers to, could be called 'the more civilised' part. Coded warnings were given, usually with enough time to evacuate the area. Maximum disruption, with minimal casualties.
Whoever was behind yesterdays attack just wanted maximum casualties and looking at it bomb for bomb, it was just as effective as the Madrid bombings.

Jakob

[Lloromannic]

Gregory:
ISSAC_RU is not middle eastern, he is a chinese living in Canada.

[rainmaker]

For those who are new in this forum, you don't need to concern about issac. He is not Chinese. He is not jewish, even though he has Jewish name. He is not even Canadian, not worthy. He is just some dumb ass who wants to get attention. He is just poor 16 years old get beaten by grade 6 bully..



Get back to the topic people , Stop the personal attacks.
If you can't argue the points just go home and don't come here
at all. Prove your points are better or be quite.
Personal attacks means you are as immature as some
grade 6 bully in the school.


Huh? When AL Qualda Bombed London they are terrorist but when
they bombed Russians they are freedom fighters?
When chechnya terrorists bombed Russians and kill Russians
they are fighting for freedom and independence?
When Free-Tibet terrorists bombed Chinese they are fighting
for the Human rights?
Tell me , Does this make sense?
Those people died for nothing?
Only British people and American people can feel the pain?


How can a true democractic country invade others without
asking their own people? You call that democracy and justices?
Barbarian Logic

[drizzt]

Get back to the topic people , Stop the personal attacks.
If you can't argue the points just go home and don't come here
at all. Prove your points are better or be quite.
Personal attacks means you are as immature as some
grade 6 bully in the school.



Isaac, you are one giant personal assault on everyone and everything. your posts have no merrit. i will not sit and debate with a troll spouting horse excremint on an internet forum. youve gone one step beyone decency. Berugijin, anjin-san, and several others(including myself) have managed to have quite heated arguments here, but we have learned to draw a fine line at decency in intelligence. You are a troll intent on insulting others. If i had my way you would be banned for this post.

[Andoru]

I'll bite.

Having an open discussion of what is the definition of "terrorism" is one thing, but implying, being the case in Isaac RU's post, that what has happened to London is justified, is another.

I don't care what kind of political ping-pong you'd like to play, the fact of the matter is that many people have died.

Wars had been waged since the beginning of ages. Many innocent lives had been lost. How does one value lives when there are people who so strongly believe in "an eye for an eye"? Sacrificing innocent lives for political end is never a moral justification. The hatred runs so deep and the carnage is never ending. Who is the real enemy here?

So for now, Isaac RU, I strongly suggest that you let it drop. There is mourning to be done here.

[ISSAC RU]

For those who are new in this forum, you don't need to concern about issac. He is not Chinese. He is not jewish, even though he has Jewish name. He is not even Canadian, not worthy. He is just some dumb ass who wants to get attention. He is just poor 16 years old get beaten by grade 6 bully..

Is this all you can do ?
Where is your big moral standing ground huh?
Ha , comeo on. Show me all you got ~
What a loser you are. If you don't agree with me show me some points !~
Because you done something wrong you just want to avoid and stop it ?
Is this your way of living on the planet?
Put yourself in a hole of misery and can't even debt properly with a 16 year old?
Its like we play a chess game and once you lose you just stand up mess the
chessboard and start yelling like a crazy nutball.
Oh , I am sorry mister. I didn't you are just that retarded.
--Dailing-----~~~~911
A: Hi doctor , there is a crazy nutball running around on the street.
D: He is a korean and kindda of retarteded with a last name of Ro?
A: Yep.
D: Thats him , Sorry for the bother. He escaped our hosiptal about
2 days ago. Thank you for reminding me , we will come up here and pick
him up shortly.


If you want to avoid this problem , go ahead.
This kind of attacks will continue go on in the future if you don't
face it today.

[ISSAC RU]

Isaac, you are one giant personal assault on everyone and everything. your posts have no merrit. i will not sit and debate with a troll spouting horse excremint on an internet forum. youve gone one step beyone decency. Berugijin, anjin-san, and several others(including myself) have managed to have quite heated arguments here, but we have learned to draw a fine line at decency in intelligence. You are a troll intent on insulting others. If i had my way you would be banned for this post.

Whats this?
When someone in Britain died we should be feel sorry for them ,but
when Iraqis died they are just being punished for terrorism?
British are people and Iraqis are not?
You can feel the pain and others around the world can not ?

[drizzt]

Is this all you can do ?
Where is your big moral standing ground huh?
Ha , comeo on. Show me all you got ~
What a loser you are. If you don't agree with me show me some points !~
Because you done something wrong you just want to avoid and stop it ?
Is this your way of living on the planet?
Put yourself in a hole of misery and can't even debt properly with a 16 year old?
Its like we play a chess game and once you lose you just stand up mess the
chessboard and start yelling like a crazy nutball.
Oh , I am sorry mister. I didn't you are just that retarded.
--Dailing-----~~~~911
A: Hi doctor , there is a crazy nutball running around on the street.
D: He is a korean and kindda of retarteded with a last name of Ro?
A: Yep.
D: Thats him , Sorry for the bother. He escaped our hosiptal about
2 days ago. Thank you for reminding me , we will come up here and pick
him up shortly.


If you want to avoid this problem , go ahead.
This kind of attacks will continue go on in the future if you don't
face it today.



Please translate, "I didn't you are just that retarded". Is comeo a new word? Im not the spelling Nazi here, but if your going to tell someone hes stupid, please make an effort at properly(even close works) typing the language.


Isaac, in all honesty, being made fun of you is less hurtful than being made fun of by a six year old. We would debate with you if you would do something besides quote CNN and tell us were all evil american dogs, wich btw, is the basis of EVERY ARGUMENT you make. Were american, were wrong, and your right.

Do two things and ill hold a debate with you all the time.

A. speak in a semi-cohesive manner. Im not asking for a term paper, nor perfect spelling, but PLEASE try to organize your thoughts into more than random, chat room-ish crap. My posts are along way from perfect, but my point gets generaly across.
B. Come up with an original thought. I know you dont think we recognize it, but i hear the same crap your spewing on the news everynight. You dont even provide original research or evidence, you quote what the tv tells you.

Your asking us to take you seriously, but you launch rude, degrading attacks on people and subjects you have no personal knowledge of. This is not an AOL chatroom, it is an international message board full of mostly well edjucated people. Bring a subject up worht debating, grounded in FACT, and you will find your respect and debate. Otherwise please do us all a favor and bugger off.......

[ISSAC RU]

-1987 . In Gulf of Persia American Destroyer send out a cruise missle
attacked a plan carried with 300+ passengers , As Result , all of them died. American answers were : We are regretful that has happned , we thought
that was a military target.

-1999 . American F-117 Bombed Chinese embassy in Yugo. 2+ died and 30 others were injured. American asnwers : We mistakenly thought that was a
military target. We are regretful that has happened.

Those two are just some very recent things that has happened. Those two
are just simple cases. If you count how many people in the world died
direct / indirect because of American Foreign Policy since 1945, you will be surpised , but they ever said a sorry? No , all the answers are '' Regretful'' .
No , thank you.
Pain in our heart should be forgotten?

[drizzt]

Whats this?
When someone in Britain died we should be feel sorry for them ,but
when Iraqis died they are just being punished for terrorism?
British are people and Iraqis are not?
You can feel the pain and others around the world can not ?

I do feel pain every day for the inocents that are killed in conflicts around the world. Do you weep for all the children starving to death thanks to tribal warfare in africa? Do you weep for the mothers and fathers who have lost there sons and daughters, husbands and wives, in countless conflicts around the world. Do you weep for the starving children of Russia and the former eastern block countries, who barely have food because of severe depression? No Isaac, I think you feel no compassion for any of them. I think all you feel is a burning desire to cause trouble.

I do not enjoy the thought the US invaded Iraq. I dont not like the idea innocents have died because of it. I do however feel that an international threat that could have meant the death of BILLIONS, is a cause worth taking up. Wether you agree that at the point of invasion, saddam hussein had nuclear or biological weapons or not, he was a dangerous dictator with the blood of thousands of innocents on his hands.

There a question isaac. Do you feel pain for the Curds casualy slaughtered by Hussein with Bio weapons as they fought for freedom?

[drizzt]

-1987 . In Gulf of Persia American Destroyer send out a cruise missle
attacked a plan carried with 300+ passengers , As Result , all of them died. American answers were : We are regretful that has happned , we thought
that was a military target.

-1999 . American F-117 Bombed Chinese embassy in Yugo. 2+ died and 30 others were injured. American asnwers : We mistakenly thought that was a
military target. We are regretful that has happened.

Those two are just some very recent things that has happened. Those two
are just simple cases. If you count how many people in the world died
direct / indirect because of American Foreign Policy since 1945, you will be surpised , but they ever said a sorry? No , all the answers are '' Regretful'' .
No , thank you.
Pain in our heart should be forgotten?

How bought tienamen square(i beleive i spelled that wrong), or the attempted invasion of the sovereign state of South Korea with chinese aid?

No country is perfect. Not China, not Britain, Not the US, none of them. That does not give rouge terrorists the right to KILL civilian populations.

[ISSAC RU]

Please translate, "I didn't you are just that retarded". Is comeo a new word? Im not the spelling Nazi here, but if your going to tell someone hes stupid, please make an effort at properly(even close works) typing the language.


Isaac, in all honesty, being made fun of you is less hurtful than being made fun of by a six year old. We would debate with you if you would do something besides quote CNN and tell us were all evil american dogs, wich btw, is the basis of EVERY ARGUMENT you make. Were american, were wrong, and your right.

Do two things and ill hold a debate with you all the time.

A. speak in a semi-cohesive manner. Im not asking for a term paper, nor perfect spelling, but PLEASE try to organize your thoughts into more than random, chat room-ish crap. My posts are along way from perfect, but my point gets generaly across.
B. Come up with an original thought. I know you dont think we recognize it, but i hear the same crap your spewing on the news everynight. You dont even provide original research or evidence, you quote what the tv tells you.

Your asking us to take you seriously, but you launch rude, degrading attacks on people and subjects you have no personal knowledge of. This is not an AOL chatroom, it is an international message board full of mostly well edjucated people. Bring a subject up worht debating, grounded in FACT, and you will find your respect and debate. Otherwise please do us all a favor and bugger off.......

Rude attack? look over this thread , who started the rude comment.
I started a peaceful converstaion and someone in here must talk
"American ( If you don't agree with us , you are a hater you are a bastard and you should die ) '' to me . At least I m talking in a language you understand. Maybe my english is realy bad , so what?Do I care? Can you discuss something in Chinese with me ? No , so beat it .

[drizzt]

Rude attack? look over this thread , who started the rude comment.
I started a peaceful converstaion and someone in here must talk
"American ( If you don't agree with us , you are a hater you are a bastard and you should die ) '' to me . At least I m talking in a language you understand. Maybe my english is realy bad , so what?Do I care? Can you discuss something in Chinese with me ? No , so beat it .

Ha, I new you were playing games. you slipped up and almost had it going ther at the end. I dougbt very seriously you could hold a conversation in chinese either so......

Regardless, you took "rude attack" wrong. The rude attack i was referning to was this thread spewing cow EXCREMENT about people, essiantly blaming them for what happend. I was trying to be tactful, but maybe you understand a cruder term.

[Gregory]

-1987 . In Gulf of Persia American Destroyer send out a cruise missle
attacked a plan carried with 300+ passengers , As Result , all of them died. American answers were : We are regretful that has happned , we thought
that was a military target.

-1999 . American F-117 Bombed Chinese embassy in Yugo. 2+ died and 30 others were injured. American asnwers : We mistakenly thought that was a
military target. We are regretful that has happened.

Those two are just some very recent things that has happened. Those two
are just simple cases. If you count how many people in the world died
direct / indirect because of American Foreign Policy since 1945, you will be surpised , but they ever said a sorry? No , all the answers are '' Regretful'' .
No , thank you.
Pain in our heart should be forgotten?

Issac, like I said, you have NO idea about politics, copying and pasting info will not make you any less on a dumbass. Truth is, you need a LIFE. Get a girlfriend, one as twisted as you, and be happy. Thats your problem: you need a girl. Most people can cope without one, you need the attention. Maybe your mother didnt support you enough, maybe your father said that you were a disgrace. One way or another, you are damaged goods and should be dealt with as such.

In a way I pity you. To me you seem like you live a very sad life.
But at the same time, I despise you with a passion, and if you were on fire, I would help, but not to any extra extent.
Thats when you know your life is worthless. When noone will even help save your life. Your point of view, your ideas. When all of that is considered nothing to someone, thats when you need to take a second look at yourself.

I say this to you with no sarcasm of any sort and with a completely serious demeanor: change your ways, or die. Either become a better person, or go and die, because thats ALL you are good for.

[Akai Bushi]

The fact of the matter is no matter what we say or have an opinion on it really amounts to nothing. The US and UK will continue with the War on Terror.
So that is beside the point and this thread is a waste of finger strength.

This is my last post on this.

Now the real matter at hand. Making sure those 700 injured get well and the families of the dead are in some way consoled. God speed and God bless.

[ISSAC RU]

Issac, like I said, you have NO idea about politics, copying and pasting info will not make you any less on a dumbass. Truth is, you need a LIFE. Get a girlfriend, one as twisted as you, and be happy. Thats your problem: you need a girl. Most people can cope without one, you need the attention. Maybe your mother didnt support you enough, maybe your father said that you were a disgrace. One way or another, you are damaged goods and should be dealt with as such.

In a way I pity you. To me you seem like you live a very sad life.
But at the same time, I despise you with a passion, and if you were on fire, I would help, but not to any extra extent.
Thats when you know your life is worthless. When noone will even help save your life. Your point of view, your ideas. When all of that is considered nothing to someone, thats when you need to take a second look at yourself.

I say this to you with no sarcasm of any sort and with a completely serious demeanor: change your ways, or die. Either become a better person, or go and die, because thats ALL you are good for.

Say all the crap you like , I am a hater I am a twisted person..blah blah
blah..whatever you like.I am not even going to pity u a answer.
How old are you ? GFGFGFGFGF? is that all you think about? what a pity..
Ah , I can see my future enemy in here already...Hahah..


One day you will be regretful for what you said when you got killed by your own action.
Payday will come to you and your country.

[h2o]

Actually, Issac has ha point in the news coverage of terrorattacks in the west vs. other murders in foreign, non-western countries. I have too reacted on this on a number of occassions.
200 people dead in Africa?: Have a three minute report on the news.
30 people dead in London?: Cancel shows and speculate in what happened for a week.
But, that's about everything I share with Issac though :)

And, just to be extra flamesafe, I must say that I in no way "justify" murder on anyone, anywhere.

[Andoru]

Of course, news coverage has been biased in this regard since god knows when. However, that does not reflect that us individuals value lives differently.

[Berugijin]

Say all the crap you like , I am a hater I am a twisted person..blah blah
blah..whatever you like.I am not even going to pity u a answer.
How old are you ? GFGFGFGFGF? is that all you think about? what a pity..
Ah , I can see my future enemy in here already...Hahah..


One day you will be regretful for what you said when you got killed by your own action.
Payday will come to you and your country.

Terrorism is a knife that cuts both ways.

You can't beat the West because we have goverment-sponsored terrorism. And our goverments are rich. So damn rich. And the Americans have already proven that they don't need a valid excuse to invade a couple of countries.

If I were a Muslim, I'd be nice and STFU.

[mingshi]

One day you will be regretful for what you said when you got killed by your own action.
This sentence soooo reminds me of this:- (http://www.banksy.co.uk/pops/outdoors/images/monkey.jpg)

[louisvandalen]

I, for one, am not saying "hear hear" to the destructive capabilities of Europe.

Without them we wouldn't be free, wealthy and healthy.

Just to get it right (dropping a short comment that is not backed was a bit careless but the kid really stirred my stomach after again having to witness another blast between unaware commuters):

Primary statement: War=not nice!

I'll try to motivate my comment: In this case we have a rather huge problem, as long as countries promote hatred against others there is no safety, anywhere. If we disable the roots of fanatism it will turn out alright in the long run. Then again by saying this a proper alternative has to be offered (which is really the hard part) especially in the early days after conflict. But with all the money the EU and the US have to spent we have the posibility.

It's still to early for Iraq but if you look at the events in Yugoslavia: Big bombs brought peace. The UN troops down there with minor firepower took a real beating for years while the killing of thousands continued. The EU/US then came to a basic agreement in Dayton. This was not a very nice solution for large groups of people since they had to be relocated to other areas defined by the Dayton agreements. I guess you could call this ethnic cleansing (thats considered a crime against humanity, but we did it anyway). Ofcourse the Serbs oposed but where forced back by NATO bombs. The "wartime governements" where replaced and slowly peace returned. Everyone can travel down there freely and safely now. The same thing is happening in Iraq, a looneytoon governement is being replaced by a much less radical entity. After any conflict the economical situation will improve greatly (since it hits rock bottom at the beginning) providing jobs, food and stability (the foundations of peace). Governemental instititutions like the police and military are reorganised providing a much better system preventing totalitarian powers. And yes, also in the former Yugoslavia there are still a lot of people pissed especially with the US since they pulled the short end. But the anti-US demonstrations we did see in the past in Belgrade are history. The ones that still reject events are diminishing fast. All sides are starting to realise that some wars shouldn't be fought, to bad they took the hardway to find out. Especially not when civies are the main target (like in a civil war or like now, again, in London). This can not be tolerated.

There is no way we can beat terror without adressing the countries where this starts.

3 times is enough.

I really don't see another solution. Discussion is definatly not going to work since there is no one to talk to. If I would offer a safehouse to bombs, detonaters, money or suicidekillers what would you do to me. Wouldn't I be found guilty? If I allow you, or worse support you, in recruiting any of the mentioned before I'm more guilty as the brainwashed idiot pushing the button.

Then again with so many "rouge" countries this approach will be a rather destructive one to begin with. Maybe it is a better idear to just sit and wait for Al Qaeda and whomever are behind them to get their hands on a nuke. With the financial support of a country this is definatly going to happen. Sooner or later. For the record: http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2005-06-26-iran_x.htm?csp=34 And to add to the threath: http://edition.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/06/30/iran.president/ . We ARE at the edge of dawn.

I am not saying that it will be impossible for some scumbag terrorist to get a nuke without the support of a country but man these things are expensive and hard to fabricate. It will reduce the chances greatly, adding to my and your personal safety. Not to forget the ones we love and our surroundings that could be turned into a nuclear wasteland..

How do you think this problem can be resolved otherwise? I'm really curious since I am neither keen on sacrificing the lives of the people I care for. But if necessary: rather in batlle as unexpected sitting in a trolleybus with my family.

I'm not talking an eye for an eye here. It's a million thoughts for 3 eyes. Let's hope they opt for the easy way out this time. But it doesn't look like it.

Peace

But not unconditionaly.......

p.s. For the anti-US/EU lot: I do think the western democracy is the best it gets in average. Not flawless but at least it provides shelter for EVERYONE. We can work, study, love and live in relative freedom and peace no matter what color or religion you might have. Radicals are locked behind bars and re-educated. No matter if they are Arian supremists or wacko Mullah's. There is no tolerance towards the ones that separate and harm others. But even if they do, they will never be treated without decent respect, tortured or worse. (though necessary violence is tolerated depending on the situation) Close to heaven. (mind you, the US still has some issues to resolve on that level, like capital punishment). To me any country that doesn't embrace peace, freedom and equality as the foundation of it's existance can be considered rouge. And the later 3 are not to be there on a local level only. This is my world. This is your world. Let's brush away the remaining pieces of yesterdays life.

[louisvandalen]

In the koran it SPECIFICALLY says : Dont kill anyone, religion or creed doesnt matter. All life is the same to god. if you do you will pay for it later. The terrorist twisted this by saying (same as what the christians said during the crusades) "oh the mean dont kill other MUSLIMS!!!!" they specifically didnt read the "anyone" part

I wasn't really refering to religion and don't care much about written words. Actions I can judge, interpretations not. Since many of the Al Qaeda terrorists have been identified as Saudies Mecca seemed like a good start. For a brief second. Looking at the recent events in Iran we might as well start with Teheran. Please read my previous post on why.

[louisvandalen]

You can't beat the West because we have goverment-sponsored terrorism. And our goverments are rich. So damn rich. And the Americans have already proven that they don't need a valid excuse to invade a couple of countries.

If I were a Muslim, I'd be nice and STFU.

I hope your not bragging about our destructive capabilities here? ;)

Best regards,

Louis

[Hisham]

If I were a Muslim, I'd be nice and STFU.

You're getting into his game and i won't comment on this but don't mistake it as me SingTFU or being nice because i'm a muslim, first and foremost, innocents have died, lets be respectfull and in due time we'll debate/flame whatever.

[Gregory]

Say all the crap you like , I am a hater I am a twisted person..blah blah
blah..whatever you like.I am not even going to pity u a answer.
How old are you ? GFGFGFGFGF? is that all you think about? what a pity..
Ah , I can see my future enemy in here already...Hahah..


One day you will be regretful for what you said when you got killed by your own action.
Payday will come to you and your country.


Firstly, you just did give me a response, so that part of your message wasn't thought out, now was it? and it is "An answer" not "a" answer. Learn some grammar.

Here are your answers:

1) I am 16; birthday June 2 1989
2) I have NO idea what "GFGFGFGFGF?" means. It has a question mark but isnt a sentence. Please fix that up
3) No that isnt what I think about, I also think about Girlfriends, women, ladys, girls, chick, hot people. The list goes on and on.


Bush is completely alien to me. His supporters to me seem amazingly distant in every way. I never said that we wouldn't pay for the stuff we are doing, did I? I dont remember saying I did.

LEARN ABOUT POLITICS BEFORE YOU TALK ABOUT IT. PLEASE

And also. You give all this talk about death and guns, have you ever shot a REAL gun? Have you ever killed anything other than your cousin the cockaroach?.

All you do is be a media whore, you, like most of the others in the world, just listen too fox, or cnn, nbc news and just go around talking about what they said.

You hate our president right? WHY? Give me reasons besides "he stearted a war" and 'he is Stooopid"

Do research before you speak, and if I scare you enough to be considered your enemy, thats your problem, go see a psychologist, not freudian. Ill help you if you want.

[drizzt]

We all know what game isaac is playing now. hes aleady slipped up and forced his hand:).

What berugijin(please tell me how to pronounce that man) said is probably excellent advice, just a tad tacky. Personaly if i were a radical muslim right now, i would step back and learn to play nice. were not demanding you give up your religion(if you notice, the americans who are on a "holy crusade" supposedly, are respecting muslim culture and have not stopped muslim worship in any country they have been involved in.), but we do demand you stop attacking US, British, Spanish, and every other country hurt by terrorism's citizenry. What these people fail to realise is that diplomacy would go a LONG way. Did you notice after we paid the least bit of respect to North Koreas leader, he suddenly decided he might be willing to play nice? its amazing what saying things like "we would be honored if presidnet XXXXX, or thank you president XXX" or whatever polite tital, can do for a diplomatice situation. If these people would try to communicate there message in something but explosives and death, the entire western world might just listen.......


But no there all going to be loony toons(kinda like what isaac is trying to play at).

isaac i notice you still havent answered me. do you feel compassion for all the people i listed in that post? Are you realy concernd about what happens to the suffering of the world? Or are you so centered in on the media you dont know whats happening in the world? I think the later rather than the former is the case......

[Musashi898]

Im so sick of hearing about the london bombing, sorry for offending anyone, but look the Governement had this coming for a long time, NO im not justifying that these terrorists were right, but Tony Blair joined with president bush, his daddy didn't finish off the job so junior is doing it, and our PM joined him, it is no concern of Britain to interfere with other Countries problems. and come on if Blair was so concerned with people's well fair u have alot more trouble in other countries i.e. Zimbabwe to sort out the reason is simple Oil and Allying with the most powerful country America, God i really hate politics so corrupt

[Gregory]

We all know what game isaac is playing now. hes aleady slipped up and forced his hand:).

What berugijin(please tell me how to pronounce that man) said is probably excellent advice, just a tad tacky. Personaly if i were a radical muslim right now, i would step back and learn to play nice. were not demanding you give up your religion(if you notice, the americans who are on a "holy crusade" supposedly, are respecting muslim culture and have not stopped muslim worship in any country they have been involved in.), but we do demand you stop attacking US, British, Spanish, and every other country hurt by terrorism's citizenry. What these people fail to realise is that diplomacy would go a LONG way. Did you notice after we paid the least bit of respect to North Koreas leader, he suddenly decided he might be willing to play nice? its amazing what saying things like "we would be honored if presidnet XXXXX, or thank you president XXX" or whatever polite tital, can do for a diplomatice situation. If these people would try to communicate there message in something but explosives and death, the entire western world might just listen.......


But no there all going to be loony toons(kinda like what isaac is trying to play at).

isaac i notice you still havent answered me. do you feel compassion for all the people i listed in that post? Are you realy concernd about what happens to the suffering of the world? Or are you so centered in on the media you dont know whats happening in the world? I think the later rather than the former is the case......

I agree with you, issac just spews the stuff he hears from others here.

He cant think for himself

[KhawMengLee]

Personaly if i were a radical muslim right now, i would step back and learn to play nice. were not demanding you give up your religion(if you notice, the americans who are on a "holy crusade" supposedly, are respecting muslim culture and have not stopped muslim worship in any country they have been involved in.), but we do demand you stop attacking US, British, Spanish, and every other country hurt by terrorism's citizenry. What these people fail to realise is that diplomacy would go a LONG way. Did you notice after we paid the least bit of respect to North Koreas leader, he suddenly decided he might be willing to play nice? its amazing what saying things like "we would be honored if presidnet XXXXX, or thank you president XXX" or whatever polite tital, can do for a diplomatice situation. If these people would try to communicate there message in something but explosives and death, the entire western world might just listen........

I think the problem here is the lack of diplomacy on the part of the US. The British are always a lot more resourceful in conflicts because they take the time to study their opponents rather than just running in and shooting in all directions screaming "HOOOAAH!".

Take the post 9-11 speeches from Bush. "If you are not with us! You are against us!"

You call, invading a country, destroying its infrastructure, occupying it and then saying "oh, we don't stop them worshipping islam" respect?!?!? The war in Iraq was a rushed unplanned mess.

Respect is understanding the culture firsthand before going into their country. Respect is knowing first hand that US male troops must not search female iraqis. Respect is knowing that the Koran cannot be thrown on the floor when you are searching people and then stepped on.

I'll say that the US forces today are getting this now. They use female troops to search women and are a lot more aware of the culture. But this is a little to late into 2 years of occupation.
************************************************** ***
God i hate saying this(especially after London) but you think these terrorists give a damn what your moral viewpoint is? Take the Iraqi wedding party at the start of the year that the US bombed. They claimed it was a terrorist training group, even though right after the news teams there clearly showed it wasn't. Now how do you think the survivors feel? Do you think he'd have any qualms about dropping a bomb in time square NY?

I hate playing the devil's advocate but this situation is not black and white. It is not good and evil. It takes a lot to drive someone to kill. It takes a heck of a lot to take someone to blow themselves up. This isn't some irrational psycho...its hatred that has been borned through something more than ideology...If you think that having better bombs and bigger guns will stop these killers, think again. You've been bombing Iraq all year long and the insurgents are still going strong...

I agree. Respect and Diplomacy goes a long way. Bush should learn to use it...Afghanistan = Yes. Iraq = well, Bush basically did a better job recruiting for Al Qaida than Bin Laden could ever hope to do.

ps. seriously, tho' this argument is ill timed. Let Britain mourn a bit before pointing fingers.

[Gregory]

Here is the sad part:

If you want to stop all terrorism, you wipe out EVERYONE and everything that is evenslightly linked to the terrorist. If you just kill them, their children will want to kill you. So you have to kill them. You kill the children, their friends will want to kill you. You kill them. You kill them and their family will want to kill you. It cant be stopped. There will ALWAYS be that one person.

[KhawMengLee]

Im so sick of hearing about the london bombing, sorry for offending anyone, but look the Governement had this coming for a long time, NO im not justifying that these terrorists were right, but Tony Blair joined with president bush, his daddy didn't finish off the job so junior is doing it, and our PM joined him, it is no concern of Britain to interfere with other Countries problems. and come on if Blair was so concerned with people's well fair u have alot more trouble in other countries i.e. Zimbabwe to sort out the reason is simple Oil and Allying with the most powerful country America, God i really hate politics so corrupt

Isn't Blair the only PM who refuses to walk 500m from Downing St to Parliament?

[KhawMengLee]

Here is the sad part:

If you want to stop all terrorism, you wipe out EVERYONE and everything that is evenslightly linked to the terrorist. If you just kill them, their children will want to kill you. So you have to kill them. You kill the children, their friends will want to kill you. You kill them. You kill them and their family will want to kill you. It cant be stopped. There will ALWAYS be that one person.

Jesus! that sounds like the vendetta straight out of the Godfather! Don Corleone's mother begging the local Don in Sicily not to kill her son after he killed her husband. And the young child Don Corleone fleeing to America after they gun down his mother. Then he returns a big bad ass mafia boss and stabs the old Don to death.

[The great I AM]

Im so sick of hearing about the london bombing, sorry for offending anyone, but look the Governement had this coming for a long time, NO im not justifying that these terrorists were right, but Tony Blair joined with president bush, his daddy didn't finish off the job so junior is doing it, and our PM joined him, it is no concern of Britain to interfere with other Countries problems. and come on if Blair was so concerned with people's well fair u have alot more trouble in other countries i.e. Zimbabwe to sort out the reason is simple Oil and Allying with the most powerful country America, God i really hate politics so corrupt

Well I do beg your sodding pardon, we'll do our very best not to get the shit blown out of us in the future. And they didn't bomb the government, they bombed us, the people of london. Not one of the 4 bombs was anywhere near the houses of parliement, the mayor's office or buckingham palace. Neither did they attempt to go for Blair at Gleneagles. I didn't vote for Blair and I am against the war in Iraq, but they still tried to blow us all up on our way to work.

Thank you very much.

[Andoru]

Indeed. Terrorism does not discriminate does it? They absolutely have no qualms blowing up their supporters. No wonder they're not popular at all.

Anyway, Sydney, you're next. Be prepared.

[Andou]

Indeed. Terrorism does not discriminate does it? They absolutely have no qualms blowing up their supporters. No wonder they're not popular at all.

Anyway, Sydney, you're next. Be prepared.

Quite the ominous warning. I'm suprised that the US hasn't been hit once more. But...stay safe everyone.

[Gregory]

Indeed. Terrorism does not discriminate does it? They absolutely have no qualms blowing up their supporters. No wonder they're not popular at all.

Anyway, Sydney, you're next. Be prepared.

yes, In fact, one of the less talked about things is that one of the bombs were in an arab neighberhood

[drizzt]

Quite the ominous warning. I'm suprised that the US hasn't been hit once more. But...stay safe everyone.

yea, but im afraid he right on the money. that or Paris or one of the major US cities. Illd like to see me attack south of the masondixon line though. there will be open season on anyone suspected of terrorism(way to many rednecks around here....)

[litige]

LEARN ABOUT POLITICS BEFORE YOU TALK ABOUT IT. PLEASE



I'm gonna repeat myself.
STOP TALKING ETHICS BEFORE YOU TALK ABOUT IT. PEHLEASE.

I'm always dispointed when I hear some bad news like this anytime. I'm with every British now, so as I'm with Iraqis, Spanish, Americans, Yugos, Tibetains, Afghans, etc.... I'm really sorry that my country is part of a vicious circle has every country in the world is. I really don't like any of the killings I heard about or know about. A lot of them are not justified.
I don't know what kind of argument your waiting for ISAAC. But this is not a political debate. It's morality at it's highest, and I don't think at your age you would comprehend stuff that would be said (same goes for greg, you speak in a very violent manner. Is your violence justified? if you think so, then ISAAC's "one" is too. If it is then justified, why would you have anything to say?).

[Musashi898]

Im sorry but that is my opinion, yes i feel sorry for those who died and im sure the peope of London are devastated, but it was going to happen sonner or later, Terrorist i get your point do not discriminate but from their point of view not just the Government but the whole of Britain is a target, but Tony Blair led us into that trap, we are devastated about 50 people dieing, go to Iraq how many have died of car bombers, sucide bombers etc, thousands upon thousands, but i do feel sorry for londoners.

[Satan]

Why stop when we can openly and freely discuss some of the world hottest
issues that may effect our lives?

It seems we have an appointment.

[Infinity]

Im sorry but that is my opinion, yes i feel sorry for those who died and im sure the peope of London are devastated, but it was going to happen sonner or later, Terrorist i get your point do not discriminate but from their point of view not just the Government but the whole of Britain is a target, but Tony Blair led us into that trap, we are devastated about 50 people dieing, go to Iraq how many have died of car bombers, sucide bombers etc, thousands upon thousands, but i do feel sorry for londoners.

come on guys. no one can use logic to explain terrorism.
it is illogical by definition.
it doesnt matter what the leaders of our nations do there will always be people out there who hate us and want us dead and we will never understand why.
people kill people and it is a sad fact of human nature.
we should be devestated by the deaths of the people in london, bali, madrid, iraq, afganistan, usa and every other country that has suffered from act of terrorism.
if everyone was so devestated (and not desensitised) there would be much less hate and killing.

[KhawMengLee]

come on guys. no one can use logic to explain terrorism.
it is illogical by definition.
it doesnt matter what the leaders of our nations do there will always be people out there who hate us and want us dead and we will never understand why.
people kill people and it is a sad fact of human nature.
we should be devestated by the deaths of the people in london, bali, madrid, iraq, afganistan, usa and every other country that has suffered from act of terrorism.
if everyone was so devestated (and not desensitised) there would be much less hate and killing.

No. The scary part of the issue is that the attacks can be explained with logic. What makes it so scary is that if you actually think about it, you'd realize that this was a long time coming.

Hate is not a random emotion. Everything has a cause and effect.

[JSchmidt]

Hate is not a random emotion. Everything has a cause and effect.

Are you saying that there's reasonable logic behind terror attacks?

Be careful how you answer...

Jakob

[The great I AM]

Im sorry but that is my opinion, yes i feel sorry for those who died and im sure the peope of London are devastated, but it was going to happen sonner or later, Terrorist i get your point do not discriminate but from their point of view not just the Government but the whole of Britain is a target, but Tony Blair led us into that trap, we are devastated about 50 people dieing, go to Iraq how many have died of car bombers, sucide bombers etc, thousands upon thousands, but i do feel sorry for londoners.

That is all well and good, but I'm sure you could have said that in the first place without saying "I'm sick of hearing about London" not even 2 days after it had happened. Would you be saying the same thing if it was your home town that had been targetted and you were now wary of using public transport I wonder?

As for the stuff in Iraq with the car bombers and the suicide bombers, I personally would not mind if there was more of it on the news, as we as whole should see what we are being held responsible for, but also remember that although the british troops may have done some pretty rotten things and killed innocents along the way ( a very sad bi-product of war) the suicide bombers and car bombers and what have you are the people that live in those places, not the occupying troops. The mojority of the bloodshed now is from these people,　not the armed forces from overseas that are still there. Does that mean that the suicide bombers colleagues are now going to take revenge on each other for the continued needless killings? Like the police forces picking up their pay packets, or the women and children queing to buy bread and vegetables? No, they won't. The response will be that the west has driven them to it (think about it, driven to kill their OWN people by others?! Does this honeslty make sense?) and they will then blame us for that as well. I belive that we as a country are responsible up to a point, but you can't bring suicide bombings in iraq into this conversation without losing the point of your arguement.

[The great I AM]

Dear All,

I don't know how many people even care about this, but I am so incensed by this oiks posts that I am starting a "Lets ignore the stupid little twat campaign" Starting now, with me. I7m gonna start a thread with this on it as well. I don't really care if you do or not, but I would like people really to know just how much this guy has gotten to me!

Enjoy, and ignore away!

And finally now, because I will never see the reply, to ISSAC RU, you are the biggest **** I have ever had the misfortune of coming across, and I hope you get "Cum across" very soon when you end up in prison.

[Berugijin]

And finally now, because I will never see the reply, to ISSAC RU, you are the biggest **** I have ever had the misfortune of coming across, and I hope you get "Cum across" very soon when you end up in prison.

Yes, because prison rape doesn't even begin to compare to the horrors of trolling on an internet message board... :rolleyes:

[The great I AM]

Yes, because prison rape doesn't even begin to compare to the horrors of trolling on an internet message board... :rolleyes:

Just stick on the ignore list! It'll give you a nice warm glow inside!

[KhawMengLee]

Are you saying that there's reasonable logic behind terror attacks?

Be careful how you answer...

Jakob

2 areas:

1) The terrorist's mindset. Hate is a driving factor but as I said, hate is not something random. I mean hell, I hate Singaporeans and Singaporeans hate us Malaysians. But this is just the typical wish wash hate of rivals. eg. English and the French.

Where you hate a man/race/country enough to kill. That is something else...heck, take an example like this. During the Iran/Iraq conflict, the US, Britain and France gladly supplied Saddam with Chemical weapons. And condoned his use of them(tactically sound because Iraq was on the verge of being overrun).

Now I'm an Iranian whose brother/father/sister/etc has been killed in the gas attacks. Do you think I'd be happy with the US supplying arms to Iraq.

Take it a step further with an Iraqi civilian in Mosul. I watched a live broadcast of a US gunship firing on unarmed civilians. The arab reporter was killed outright. The Iraqis were dancing and cheering around the wreck of Bradley Fighting vehicle. The gunship then opened up on them.

At first the army said it was trying to destroy the vehicle because it might fall into insurgent hands. Then they said its munitions were dangerous to the civilians around. And finally, they said they were being fired upon and just returned fire. But on the video you only hear one source of gunfire and that was from the 50 cal canon on the gunship. How do you think the civilians/insurgents/terrorists feel about the US after that? To them, incidents like this justify their actions.

What I'm trying to say here is that the mindset of the attackers can be understood very easily. Its not just some random blind rage. There is a reason behind it.

2) Second, the objective of the terrorist's are to bring attention/victory by destrupting your lives. They can't fight your military...hell no. And in the bigger picture its no point to them. Kill a soldier...another one comes along. Soldiers are meant to fight and die. When a soldier dies we feel sad but still its their job. When a civilian dies suddenly its "our lives" on the line. Its us the everyday people, who see war as miles away, that are suddenly in the front line.

You need to understand this because its no good thinking "OMG! its madness, irrational etc!" because all this does is add to the panic. You got to understand 'why' they do this. One of the first things I said after the bombing was get back on track and don't let them distrupt your lives. If you understand then you can avoid giving them what they want from these attacks.

************************************************** ********
I definately don't agree with these acts of terrorism. But then again, they have no military muscle. When you are attacked by a nation with superior a navy, airforce and army. How do you fight then? Fighting the armed forces would be suicide. I fight your ground troops you send a bomb by plane.
There is a logic behind why they attack civilians. Albeit being dispicable to us, to them its survival. How else are they going to hurt their enemies?

As they say, war is the sum of all evil.

[JSchmidt]

Erhh, it's all very well talking about Iranian and Iraqis, but they got *nothing* to do with the major terror attacks the last few years. 9/11 was mainly Saudi Arabians, Bali was mainly locals, Madrid mainly Algerians and sofar, the UK is pointing towards British subjects. These guys are not fighting any wars or anything remotely like it...There is no justification for these attacks. None.

Jakob

[KhawMengLee]

Erhh, it's all very well talking about Iranian and Iraqis, but they got *nothing* to do with the major terror attacks the last few years. 9/11 was mainly Saudi Arabians, Bali was mainly locals, Madrid mainly Algerians and sofar, the UK is pointing towards British subjects. These guys are not fighting any wars or anything remotely like it...There is no justification for these attacks. None.

Jakob

Jakob. On our side there is none. But on the bombers end they have their own justification for it. If its Al Qaida influenced...then we need to understand what these buggers are thinking and we either put a bullet in the perps head or we change that ideology and get the Al Qaida foothold out of the UK.

If its something else, like Tim McVeigh, as in homeland terror. Then that's scary on a bigger scale because that means that the person is a psychotic...now that's irrational and even more scarrier bacause he's killing with no real justification behind.

I mean I can understand a militant. But if its a nutter...well how do you rationalise that? He may have done it because he hates the collour of the bloody seats on the tube.

[Mugu]

Jakob. On our side there is none. But on the bombers end they have their own justification for it. If its Al Qaida influenced...then we need to understand what these buggers are thinking and we either put a bullet in the perps head or we change that ideology and get the Al Qaida foothold out of the UK.

If its something else, like Tim McVeigh, as in homeland terror. Then that's scary on a bigger scale because that means that the person is a psychotic...now that's irrational and even more scarrier bacause he's killing with no real justification behind.

I mean I can understand a militant. But if its a nutter...well how do you rationalise that? He may have done it because he hates the collour of the bloody seats on the tube.

I totally agree with you KhawMengLee that we're adding fuel to the fire, but the thing is those "terrorists" told their men it's a Jihad, and some of them think that is just enough justifications just to kill westerners as much as the westerners crusaded against them. Though, I agree Jihad is not the only reason they go after us, but we just keep giving them reasons to kill us (all the stuff you said about a gunship shooting at civilians). Though, to me those civilians shouldn't be there the first place, normal civilians don't dance around after someone was killed, they should have been running and screaming. In a way, they were asking for it. How I see those "civilians" and probably the troops saw those "civilisans" were like Viet Con, you can't tell the differences until they dance around after your troops were killed. This is just as complicated as the Vietnam war; Viet Con vs US troops. You just can't tell the differences. Now, do you still call those "civilians" being killed? In some of our eyes, maybe. But to the arabs, they were civilians and they were heros being killed because they danced around us troops' dead bodies, it's just another good reason to kill the westerners. In another word, they find an excuse to kill us anyway...

[JSchmidt]

I mean I can understand a militant. But if its a nutter...well how do you rationalise that? He may have done it because he hates the collour of the bloody seats on the tube.

Your first mistake is to call the people who commits these attacks "Militants". You are just by doing that, justifying their attacks (seen from their POV). They are just as much nutters as Tim McVeigh or the Soho/Brixton bomber. There is no difference and there is no justification and you cannot rationalize their attacks. That you even attempt to do so, disgusts me.

Jakob

[KhawMengLee]

Though, to me those civilians shouldn't be there the first place, normal civilians don't dance around after someone was killed, they should have been running and screaming. In a way, they were asking for it. How I see those "civilians" and probably the troops saw those "civilisans" were like Viet Con, you can't tell the differences until they dance around after your troops were killed. This is just as complicated as the Vietnam war; Viet Con vs US troops. You just can't tell the differences. Now, do you still call those "civilians" being killed? In some of our eyes, maybe. But to the arabs, they were civilians and they were heros being killed because they danced around us troops' dead bodies, it's just another good reason to kill the westerners. In another word, they find an excuse to kill us anyway...

Those civilians don't want the US in their country. Sorta like those civilians who dragged the corpses of the Security contractors killed in Fallujah around the streets then strung them up in the bridge. In the west we think they are bastards for cheering when we loose one of our boys. To those guys, they say we shouldn't be there...

Iraq was a big mess. First the Americans were seen as liberators, then they became occupiers. Bad planning, big mess.

Take this scene from the first few months after Saddam was beaten. There were a bunch of protestors(peaceful) asking the US to get out. The Sgt in Charge of the picket said to one of the protestors asking him to get out.

"The reason you can protest is because we gave you the freedom to do so!"

"We want you out. American go out!"

"Look, if you don't get lost we're going to take you away."

"What?"

"We will take you away."

************************************************** *******
I personally think they should have supported a faction within first. Let them start the ball rolling and then support later with troops. Going in as an outside force will always make you a target and no matter how much good you do...one missed bomb and one dead iraqi innocent will kill your image totally.

[KhawMengLee]

Your first mistake is to call the people who commits these attacks "Militants". You are just by doing that, justifying their attacks (seen from their POV). They are just as much nutters as Tim McVeigh or the Soho/Brixton bomber. There is no difference and there is no justification and you cannot rationalize their attacks. That you even attempt to do so, disgusts me.

Jakob

Why did they attack London then? New York? Madrid? Bali?

Why not Hong Kong or Malaysia or Shang Hai?

There must be a rational behind it. If rationalizing murder and killing disgusts you then you might as well petition to have the entire criminal psyche dept. of you police disbanded. Heck I don't like the bombings any more than you do. I got family in London and I sure as hell was worried for the 24 hours I couldn't reach them.

If you can understand the problem's origins, you can avoid it or prevent it. Rather than try and deal with it only when it becomes a problem.

[JSchmidt]

If rationalizing murder and killing disgusts you then you might as well petition to have the entire criminal psyche dept. of you police disbanded.
Wtf does that have to do with it and you have still completly and utterly failed to explained why the Iranians and Iraqis got anything to do with it.

Heck I don't like the bombings any more than you do. I got family in London and I sure as hell was worried for the 24 hours I couldn't reach them.


Why worried?..if they had died, you already had a rational explanation for it.

Jakob

[KhawMengLee]

Wtf does that have to do with it and you have still completly and utterly failed to explained why the Iranians and Iraqis got anything to do with it.

Iran/Iraq and Al Qaida. I based my comments on the immidiate link the Authorities gave between the bombing and AlQaida. Right now the happenings in the mid east is a direct rallying point and recruitment drive for the group.

Take the Crusades. The Church says Christians are being murdered in Jerusalem and 30,000 people march off to kill muslims. Al Qaida says the same thing and from all around the world ignorant/impressionable muslims go off to kill westerners.

The link between the mid east and the bombings at home. Well, if the perps were AlQaida influenced or members. The link between Iran/Iraq is pretty plain and simple...Al Qaida using the incidents and tragedies in Iraq to influence their operatives in London.

Why worried?..if they had died, you already had a rational explanation for it.

Now that's just being spiteful and immature.

[JSchmidt]

Now that's just being spiteful and immature.

No, it's putting your attacks on the UK and the USA on this board into perspective. They havent even pulled all the bodies out of the tunnel and you are busy 'rationalizing' the attacks.
I was just around the corner when the bus on Tavistock Square blew and I can assure you that no amount 'rationalizing' can justify this...try as you may.

[KhawMengLee]

No, it's putting your attacks on the UK and the USA on this board into perspective. They havent even pulled all the bodies out of the tunnel and you are busy 'rationalizing' the attacks.
I was just around the corner when the bus on Tavistock Square blew and I can assure you that no amount 'rationalizing' can justify this...try as you may.

Hey, I didn't start with this whole rationalizing business. Read my first post on this bloody thread for god's sakes. The only difference is I played the devil's advocate. And since bloody when have I attacked the UK?!??! Mate, did I say you guys deserved it?WTF?!

For the last time. I am not agreeing with the terrorists. And there is no way in hell I would justify it. All I said is you feel what you feel and they(the terrorists) feel what they feel.

************************************************** ********

You're right. No amount of rationalization can justify this. That's because rationalization gives us a reason, not an excuse. Please the the difference between the two.

I am giving a reason. And there is no excuse for the actions of the terrorists.

[Gregory]

I'm gonna repeat myself.
STOP TALKING ETHICS BEFORE YOU TALK ABOUT IT. PEHLEASE.

I'm always dispointed when I hear some bad news like this anytime. I'm with every British now, so as I'm with Iraqis, Spanish, Americans, Yugos, Tibetains, Afghans, etc.... I'm really sorry that my country is part of a vicious circle has every country in the world is. I really don't like any of the killings I heard about or know about. A lot of them are not justified.
I don't know what kind of argument your waiting for ISAAC. But this is not a political debate. It's morality at it's highest, and I don't think at your age you would comprehend stuff that would be said (same goes for greg, you speak in a very violent manner. Is your violence justified? if you think so, then ISAAC's "one" is too. If it is then justified, why would you have anything to say?).


I REALLY feel my violence is justified, if you want to know why, pm me, I am not going to say it here

[Mugu]

"The reason you can protest is because we gave you the freedom to do so!"

"We want you out. American go out!"

"Look, if you don't get lost we're going to take you away."

"What?"

"We will take you away."


Look, I don't and a lot of Americans don't agree with Bush, but what can we do? We got a guy with a rich daddy as president. We're stuck with him for a few more years. The war should never have started, but now it's already started, I don't think we should leave. This is how I see the war no matter how much the Iraqis want us to go. If you take your dog and shit on my lawn, I want you to clean it up. This is how I see this whole Iraq war. I'm one of those people who usually just goes, "Fine! We'll leave. Do whatever the hell you want." Then can you imagine what's gonna be happen to that country? It's not an excuse the US uses, but it's a fact. And some Iraqis do want the US to stay because they either think the same as me, or they really want the US to help them to build a new country. Though, I wanna see what happens if the US leaves now, and then what those Iraqis say and bitch about later that the US didn't help clean up.

Btw, mutilate and drag a corpse around isn't a good way to protest, if I was there, I'll just shoot them also. Because they have no respect even for a dead person, they don't deserve respect at all.

[KhawMengLee]

Look Jakob, I apologize.

Its the worst possible time for this sort of debate and I wasn't thinking when I wanted fight this one out. Sorry for the comments and the angry words.

Could we pull back and just let it be.

[Stealth]

1) The terrorist's mindset. Hate is a driving factor

This is where most make the first mistake: It's not hate but FAITH that makes a suicidekiller to flick the switch.

Without a prospect on several virgins and a place next to Allah people wouldn't get into the sh*t that just happened.

[JSchmidt]

Fair enough.

Jakob

[Mohammad]

ISSAC, I am ashamed of you.

God told me he was disappointed to have created something so dispicable. He is contemplating suicide.

[Commander]

I know what i'd like to do with ISSAC

[KendokaJim]

So ISSAC RU is telling all of us to sotp insulting him for having an opinion... seems to me that the terrorists are attacking innoncents for having an opinion that differs from their own. Sucks to be on the receiving end (on a much, much, smaller, incomparable scale), eh ISSAC? My condolences to all the Londoners here.

[James]

This is very soon after tragic events and I think some wires are getting crossed here.

It is not my place to speak on behalf of anyone, but It seems obvious to me that Meng is not 'justifying' attacks but saying that there is cause and effect (which should be self-evident).
The media (any country's media / religious leaders) like to talk about these acts in terms of 'EVIL' and 'TERROR' side-stepping attempts to analyse the causes. It is easy to talk like this, but it is naive.
The results may seem random mayhem, but a failure to try to understand, or a willingness to ignore the causes of atrocities, does not solve anything.
--
Here's an example of cause and effect:

First some Violence/Evil/Terror

EFFECT: "Rosa had her bre*sts cut off. Then they cut into her chest and took out her heart. The men had their arms broken, their test*cles cut off and their eyes poked out. They were killed by slitting their throats and pulling the tongue out through the slit."

Not what you want in your village, right?
An eyewitness record of a raid in Jintega province Nicaragua.

Were they 'Evil Terrorists?'
Well if you were having your breasts cut off probably.

or Good Guys?
Yes to the President of the 'Free World' who funded the 'Contra Freedom Fighters'
(despite Congress having passed a set of laws making it a crime to give aid to the Contras).

IF it was outlawed where did Reagan get the money?
In spite of a weapons embargo, Reagan authorised illegal arms sales to Iran, a country he had himself declared to be a "terrorist state."

CAUSE: Why did he do this? To attempt 'Regime Change' of another country (from Communism in this case).
--
Believe me this isn't an anti-American rant, it is just that US foreign policy leaves such a trail of easy examples.
We could as easily join the countless debates on what changed the highly-ordered Japanese army to embark on a month-long frenzy of rape, torture and mutilation once they reached Nanking. Or why British 12yr old boys carry Cricket bats and Rawandan 12 year old boys carry AK47s.

Historically it seems humans can quickly be goaded to commit atrocities, whether they are doing it, for religious, political, ideological or basic psychological reasoning, like revenge.
It is easy to say the perpetrators are doing this without logic because they are Evil; however to them there is a justification through a sense of in/justice or by whatever brainwashing or fanaticism they have been inculcated with.
Say you are going to your daughter's wedding and the entire wedding party is slaughtered.
What do you do? forgive and forget ? or get all Uma Thurman on the bomber's ass ?
Okay what if that bomber was a military plane of a foreign country?
Does it make it better that it wasn't a terrorist but a 'legitimate' army who later apologised for the 'mistake' ?
To the father of the corpse, that was possibly and act of 'evil'.

Although there is nothing new about wanting to strike terror into one's enemies, modern terrorism is born of the media, and the ability to get million plus viewing figures for your cause. One group's 'Terrorism' is another's 'Shock and Awe Tactics'.

Saying there is no logic to terrorism, is not logical. The vicitms can be random but it is orchestrated for very specific effects, usually in direct response to the foreign policy of the target. Is terrorism really escalating for no reason? If it is random acts of hatred, then why doesn't Switzerland get bombed and when was the last bloody Buddhist uprising?

In London, remember, we have lived through years of terrorism before 911, this has waxed and waned through changes in foreign policy, military intervention, negotiation. There may be little chance of stopping an isolated terrorist cell with a secret target; but there is hope of analysing and tackling the causes.

I am more than saddened that these events are back in London. Let us hope our leaders everywhere don't squander the long-term progress we have made for short-term political goals.

[Wes Nazo]

All cultures are beautiful and we cannot judge. ;)

[Alex]

KW extends our heartfelt commiserations to all in London.

[Kaoru]

Is it the Terrorists?
Who is the true barbarian behind all of these horrible tragdies?
Who is the one plant this terrorism seed?
Who is the one invade other country thru a violent war?
How can those who is brutally killing the innocent lives of the
others condemn this tragdy?
Who has the right to give the meaning of '' Terrorism'' when they
are acting in such way?
The deaths of the innocent men and women in this tradgy should
be remembered, but this doesn't mean their lives are more important
than the others across the world.
If we must condemn , We must Condemn the true masterminded
terrorist behind all of these killings.

Issac, I am so disgusted with you, that I casn't think of anything to say to you, other than "Shut Up." Nothing that I can say can express what I think of you. (And none of it is nice, unfortunately.) This was so tactless and unkind, it's not even funny.

How can you be so unfeeling and so mean? If the only thing you know how to do is say nasty things, why should you be allowed to stay on this forum? I think there needs to be a stronger moderator presence, and stronger rules for what can be posted. This post and thread is just beyond nasty.

Anyway, I think you are terrible Issac, for posting such horrid thoughts. You should be ashamed of yourself. You should be profusely apologising to everyone here for your callous words. What happened in London is a horrible tragedy. Your words are beyond cruel.

Kaoru

[Alex]

This is the Flames section, Kaoru. If you don't like it, don't come here. The reason why we set this section up is to keep rubbish out of the serious forums, and that is why we don't keep a strong presence here. As far as I can see, ISAAC has expressed an unpopular and grossly inappropriate opinion, but should he be banned for that in this section?

[Gregory]

yes he should, one day he will piss off the wrong person.

I know I am new here and have no right to give my 2 cents but this guy is a prick and should be dealt with as such. One way or another he will get what he deserves.

[drizzt]

This is the Flames section, Kaoru. If you don't like it, don't come here. The reason why we set this section up is to keep rubbish out of the serious forums, and that is why we don't keep a strong presence here. As far as I can see, ISAAC has expressed an unpopular and grossly inappropriate opinion, but should he be banned for that in this section?

I think a temporary ban might be apropriate. Malicious trolling(not the stupid stuff that "God" "jesus""satan" and all the others do....thats done in jest,his is done to be nasty.) should come with at least a temp ban.

[piggy]

i would let it slide if this was his first post but unfortunately, he always posts such negativity regardless of the feedback that he gets from other members. in my oppinion, i think he does it because he feels that he needs the attention so desperately that he needs to say horrid and terrible things so that we will give him the attention he wants. so yes, i think a temporary ban would be appropiate in this case.



This is the Flames section, Kaoru. If you don't like it, don't come here. The reason why we set this section up is to keep rubbish out of the serious forums, and that is why we don't keep a strong presence here. As far as I can see, ISAAC has expressed an unpopular and grossly inappropriate opinion, but should he be banned for that in this section?

[Kaoru]

This is the Flames section, Kaoru. If you don't like it, don't come here. The reason why we set this section up is to keep rubbish out of the serious forums, and that is why we don't keep a strong presence here. As far as I can see, ISAAC has expressed an unpopular and grossly inappropriate opinion, but should he be banned for that in this section?

Hi Alex-san,

I know this is the Flames section, and I do know what it is for. This is not about what I do or don't like. This is about the fact that Isaac has been VERY hurtful and unkind in regard to the London attacks. Also, Isaac never has anything nice to say about anything, and he says mean things that are totally uncalled for and unprovoked, to people all the time. I haven't complained about him yet because I kept hoping that he'd turn into a nice person after settling in here, but he has not. This was the last straw for me. He should not be rewarded for saying nasty things. He is rewarded when we put up with him and allow him to continue.

The Flames section is not, IMHO, to be used to abuse people or, to say things that are very hurtful to others. This post, IMHO, was out of line. London was just bombed. Why should he be allowed to say what he did when people have just been traumatised by this attack? Many here live and/or work in London, or have friends and family there, and are very affected by it. I do not like to see people needlessly hurt by insensitive comments by a kid who appears to support the people behind the bombing when a serious attack has just occurred. This is wrong.

There is a line that has been crossed, though this is the Flames section, IMHO, when Isaac posted this thread and his "opinion."

I am sorry if I have offended you, but there really is a point where something just should not be posted or tolerated.

Please accept my apology for my opinion, but I stand by what I say. Others have suggested a temporary ban. That sounds plenty fair and appropriate to me. E-budo has such a ban, and I think that fair in this case. And, if he can't clean up his act, then I'd just ban him permanently. There just is no reason for him to be so rude to everyone in nearly every post he makes.

Again, I am sorry if I offended you. That was not my intention. *bow*

Kaoru

[Kaoru]

I think a temporary ban might be apropriate. Malicious trolling(not the stupid stuff that "God" "jesus""satan" and all the others do....thats done in jest,his is done to be nasty.) should come with at least a temp ban.

I agree with you. There really is a difference between malicious and just stupid trolling. I can't tolerate the nasty sort of trolling. The other, I can deal with.
I hate it when people are out to hurt others and that sort of thing.

Kaoru

[KevinF]

Kaoru,

I was frankly disgusted by Isaac Ru's post here as well. However, it's not the first time. In fact, I'm not sure which one of his post has annoyed me the most. I'm not sure which is worse, his insensitivity to the recent bombings in London or his gross ignorance regardnig world history and the history of his own country (P.R.C.).

Ticking people off is his m.o. and this is more of the same. For a time, I believed that he was a guy who does judo or some other martial art and just wanted all the kendo-ka to waste time on his threads and over the past few months, I have grown into acceptance regarding his age, his youthful ignorance and his need for attention. (By the way, Issac, these aren't insults - these are subjective truth which are proven every time you sit in front of a keyboard). After all, Issac is the guy who wants to raze a religious site in a foreign country and wants to join the Chinese army in hopes of being able to put a stop to all the Tibetan terrorist bombers that prey on the benevolent peace that envelopes all that is China.

He shouldn't be banned from the forum. He should be spanked by his parents. Somehow, IMHO, they have failed to produce a good human.

[Gregory]

If he doesnt get banned, and is allowed to misuse the flame forum, others will too. If he isnt stopped it just sets a little spot for others

[Mohammad]

I being a prophet, believe that we need to PERMENATLY ban him. A temporary ban means he will come back and do it again.

[drizzt]

I being a prophet, believe that we need to PERMENATLY ban him. A temporary ban means he will come back and do it again.

no a temp ban might encourage him to behave and become a contirbuting member of the KWF society. i wouldnt have a problem with his views if he wasnt an insensitive annoying little prat.

[Gregory]

What can he contribute?
In his time here he hasnt contributed anything uselful. Do a search on his posts if you dont believe me

[drizzt]

What can he contribute?
In his time here he hasnt contributed anything uselful. Do a search on his posts if you dont believe me

beleive me ive seen alot of his stuff. If he realises ther are consequences to his assanine-ness, maybe he'll chill out. I'll give anyone another chance, but they need to use it properly

[h2o]

Banning him would be the stupidest thing to do.
1) It's technically hard. Most people are behind a dynamic IP, and banning a whole range might make other, non-irritating people, not being able to view the forum. If you ban the user he will probably just sign up under a different name. Repeat into absurdity.
2) It's really a form of censorship which I myself find disgusting. He has some weird believes by most peoples standards, yes, and he is being totally insensitive, yes, but he is actually allowed to have them. If he was violating some kind of law, then go ahead, but if not let him be and don't reply to his posts.
If his views are considered bad, then why not ban everyone who wrote bad things about God, or France, or ...

The best way to deal with an insensitive troll is to just ignore him. Trolls feed on attention.

And, as has already been noted by the KW-staff: If you don't like flames, then don't visit the flames forum.

[Gregory]

you know anyone that is dead because of the london bombings?

[h2o]

you know anyone that is dead because of the london bombings?
Can you please explain why that would be relevant?

[Berugijin]

Can you please explain why that would be relevant?

Backyard-syndrome. (Nobody wants a nuclear power plant in their backyard.)

If it's close to home people tend to care more. Thirty people just got killed in Iraq, I see no Iraq sympathy threads.

[litige]

I REALLY feel my violence is justified, if you want to know why, pm me, I am not going to say it here

No, please do tell openly, so people might contribute.

[Sepiraph]

Is it the Terrorists?
Who is the true barbarian behind all of these horrible tragdies?
Who is the one plant this terrorism seed?

The terrorists, in this case, are the one who planted the bombs.
The barbarian behind 'all of these horrible tragedies' are human beings.
The one who planted the seed of terrorism is known as hate.

Who is the one invade other country thru a violent war?
How can those who is brutally killing the innocent lives of the
others condemn this tragdy?
Who has the right to give the meaning of '' Terrorism'' when they
are acting in such way?

There are countless wars, no one single war has started this and no one single war will end this.
Killing of civilians and innocent lives should always be condenmed, irregardless of whom and when.
Everyone and anyone has the right to give the meaning of terrorism when innocent people are murdered for personal/political/religious reasons.

The deaths of the innocent men and women in this tradgy should
be remembered, but this doesn't mean their lives are more important
than the others across the world.
If we must condemn , We must Condemn the true masterminded
terrorist behind all of these killings.

All lives are precious, but attention is usually pay to those tragedies that hit closer to home. It is a human trait, for surely you'd mourn for your mother but not necessarily as much for a stranger from a different country.
There is no 'true' masterminded terrorist, ultimately terrorists are human beings, just often mis-guided in how they should carry out their ideals to help for a cause.

I believe I'm the only one who answered your questions, I hope you'll find what you seek.

[Mugu]

Backyard-syndrome. (Nobody wants a nuclear power plant in their backyard.)

If it's close to home people tend to care more. Thirty people just got killed in Iraq, I see no Iraq sympathy threads.

Let's just say we know things closer to home better. I can't say anything for the Iraqis because I am not there, I know how I feel right now because of where I live. Therefore, I don't know how the Iraqis feel and I can't say anything for them (yes, they feel angry and pissed off, but that's pretty much I know). Not that we don't have sympathy for them, I don't wanna say anything wrong then accuse of being ignorant later.

[Hyaku]

Isaac Ryu or whatever your name is, where ever you come from:

Have you ever been to London? Last time I checked there were around 12% of British actually living there. Mosty visitors and foreign nationals. But so saying they all live together in multicultural harmony.

Like you these terrorists did not do their homework. If this was aimed at the British community it was a mistake. All it has done is stir up conflict with people from other countries. I am not saying I agree with what has happened in Iraq. Bearing in mind the possibity of the present events happening I thought it was a bad idea going in there in first place.

But if some crazy muslim faction, even someone who's family has been killed wants retribution, this is a pathetic attempt.

[ISSAC RU]

Pfft ~

Some 40 British died and you see it everyday on the media.
If that were Iraqis most of you in here won't even care. Why?
They died because of terrorism too. American+British Terrorism.
You will say most British People don't support the War in Iraq , but
you chose Blair right? If you people really hate this PM who started
a nonsense war with the Americans. you guys should not vote for him
at all. I bet the gas in your car is from Iraq too. In a way you supported
this war like all the Americans.

Over 10,000 Iraqis have died since the American Invasion. Who give a
half flag salute to those? You people would go day after day about
War on Terror..Blah..Blah....Who is the real terrorist who started all this?
If the we should take look at the root of terrorism. We could date
back to the age of early 20 century. You guys planted this seed , now
you are just getting what you did.
Oil doesn't come free.

[Gregory]

Issac, I thought I told you this already. Why do I need to keep repeating myself?
Learn about politics before you talk politics.

You never answered my reason as to why you hate the current administration. (NOONE ELSE ANSWER) After you give your half baked answers Ill give you mine

Now until you answer this and do some research

Shut the hell up

[Hyaku]

You sound a bit demented and are ranting. You didnt read what I said. I don't live in the UK voted for no one and I said I did not agree with Iraq.

If you are going to post that talk revenge dating back to the middle ages your a troll or your talking like a terrorist. You said moocow visted your club in a previous post. Are you in The USA? I think your ip should be checked and you should watched (better still medicated). I'ts all a sad, sick state of affairs that needs to be resolved, not made worst.

Is this a Kendo forum? Where's your Kendo spirit? Seems you have not learned much up now.

I had a Professor from UEA that teaches Islam visit last year. Thank God/ Allah he does "not" share your feelings

Don't bother answering. Like the others you just went on my ignore list

[ISSAC RU]

Ha Prove me that I am wrong.Prove me now! or else you should STFU.
I am just gonna repeat this over and over again like
you americans do.

What? YOu don't want to hear about the current situation in
Iraq? Iraqis are dying and obviously you don't care because
it didn't happen to you right? Why should people around the world
care about some british people died? Why should we care about
some americans died in some trash towers? You ask people across
the world to care about you but you don't pay the same respect back
but instead you go around and hit their faces.

Tell me Why you Americans invade Iraq? WHY WHY WHY WHY ~
It proves to the world your country is based on a barbaric system
which embrases the deaths of the others.

[ISSAC RU]

Is this a Kendo forum? Where's your Kendo spirit? Seems you have not learned much up now.



Kendo and this are different. Kendo is Kendo. American Terrorism is American Terrorism . Lets not get these two mixed up.

[Mugu]

Tell me Why you Americans invade Iraq? WHY WHY WHY WHY ~

You should ask Bush, not the American people... okay, maybe the right-winged republicans... and maybe you should read some of the news or come to one of the towns and see how many signs are up to demonstrate about it...

It proves to the world your country is based on a barbaric system
which embrases the deaths of the others.

And yours not? You know you can't just say yes, you know you have people you don't like much in your country also

[Walras]

I wouldn't argue with this guy Mugu. His idiocy will prevail, regardless of our attempts at rationale arguments ^^

[Mugu]

Kendo and this are different. Kendo is Kendo. American Terrorism is American Terrorism . Lets not get these two mixed up.

I agree, but I hope you can use less offensive wordings maybe this discussion would have turned out nicer even though it is hot topic... I understand that you're angry, you can vent all you want... some of us listen and have a peaceful discussion. But come right out saying "YOU BASTARDS! YOU KILL MY PEOPLE!" is NOT a discussion, it's called an accusation. Why can't you be peaceful and being angry all the time ain't good for you... try some heavy metal to calm you down...

[Mugu]

I wouldn't argue with this guy Mugen. His idiocy will prevail, regardless of our attempts at rationale arguments ^^