Fitting of bougu

[Raígma]

Greetings,

I haven´t received my bougu yet but a friend of mine received one that is very similar to mine. Checking the gear I was wondering about a few things:

How tight do the kote have to suit your arm?
Am I supposed to tie them as strong as possible?
How much space can there be between the tip of my
fingers and the end of the kote?

Older members told my friend that his dou is a bit too tight
and that it will get painful this way. Both of us ordered at
www.ninecircles.co.uk but there was nothing to choose the size
of the dou. So is it important?
I was told that the end of the dou (lower part) should cover the
"belt" of the tare. Am I allowed to tie it deeper or do I have to
look that it touches the tsuki with the mune? Also how much space shall there be between the sides of the dou and
my waist?

I saw different methods of tieing the tare.
Do I have to lead the himo of the tare below all five tarecloths or
just the 3 in the center?

Now the most important. As I did he ordered a men padding.
His men suits very well but it doesn´t using the men padding.
Has aynone used a ninecricles men padding? It was also
difficult to attach it. Any suggestions? (It´s more or less
a pad with some elastic core which is meant to be bent to suit)
Where to place it?

Thanks for helping

[Neil Gendzwill]

Originally posted by Raígma
How tight do the kote have to suit your arm?
Am I supposed to tie them as strong as possible?

That's a matter of personal preference. They should always be loose enough that you can slip your hand in, meaning you should not have to loosen and retighten the strings every time you put them on. Some people (like me) prefer them fairly loose for maximum wrist flexibility. Others like them tighter.

How much space can there be between the tip of my
fingers and the end of the kote?

Your fingers shouldn't be jammed into the end and they shouldn't be squished together. If either of those occur, they're too tight. You should be able to comfortably hold the shinai. Remember that they fit differently with your fingers stretched out than curled around the tsuka - stretched out doesn't matter, check the fit when holding the tsuka. If there is extra space that is interfering with your ability to hold the tsuka, they may be too big. But be aware that new kote will always feel a little awkward at first until they break in, especially if you've never used kote at all before.

Older members told my friend that his dou is a bit too tight
and that it will get painful this way.

The doh should be wide enough that it slips over the belt of the tare easily. The common measurement for this is the distance across the back of the doh, which would be between 35-40 cm for most adults.

I was told that the end of the dou (lower part) should cover the "belt" of the tare. Am I allowed to tie it deeper or do I have to
look that it touches the tsuki with the mune?

When sitting in seiza, tie the doh so that the bottom part of it is at the bottom of the belt of the tare. If the doh is the right size vertically then the nodo (the part of the men that receives tsuki) should just touch or overlap the mune.

Also how much space shall there be between the sides of the dou and my waist?

Enough so that it moves freely, not so much that it swings around. A fingerwidth or so is good (while wearing the tare).

The best way to get a measurement for a doh is to find one among your dojomates that fits you (check with sensei), and then measure that one across the back. If you tell your supplier that measurement and how tall you are, they should be able to pick the right size.

Do I have to lead the himo of the tare below all five tarecloths or just the 3 in the center?

The himo just goes under the big one in the centre. Bring the himo behind your back, cross them and bring to the front. Pull them very tight. Lift the centre flap up to your waist and tie a bow knot with the himo halfway up the back side of the flap. Make sure it's good and tight. Now grab the flap and pull it down, the knot should slide down to the joint of the flap. Tuck any knot ends that stick out under the side flaps.

His men suits very well but it doesn´t using the men padding.

Most people don't use padding. However, as the men breaks in he may find that it stretches and there will be more room for the padding. A new men should be quite snug.

Finally, if you're really concerned about all these fit issues, you should be talking to your supplier. A good supplier should be willing to talk to you and also to exchange pieces which don't fit at no charge. If they have an inflexible ordering process and expect you to live with whatever they send you, switch suppliers.

[Raígma]

Thank you very much for these detailed answers.
I´m still aksing why it needs up to 4 weeks to get that paket from korea..
Anyway thanks.

[Sinta]

There there you're not the only one. My delivery says I have to wait 3 weeks for it to be delivered from Japan, but I think it might take longer. Most likely because they have to make sure of the quality of their product and that it will really suit you. Depends if you have it custom made and stuff.

I know there are some people who have to wait 3 months for their bogu... *-_-*

[Neil Gendzwill]

If your bogu is being delivered by surface (sea-mail) then it can take 1-2 months depending on where you are just for delivery. For example, shipments from Koei in Japan to us in Canada typically take one month from the shipping date, maybe 6 weeks if over the Christmas season.

If your bogu is an unusual (non-stock) size or is custom made then of course there will be some delay while it is being constructed and shipped from the factory.

You also have to allow some time even if it is in stock for the order to be put together, boxed up and shipped out.

[Raígma]

I´m not that rich to buy a custom made bougu.
Ninecircles (UK) didn´t have in stock what I wanted, or better spoken needed because I´m so skinny, so they
had to order it from kendoshop in korea (ninecircles is a subsidiary company of kendoshop, at least it seems so).

I guess they will first deliver the bougu to England and then they will pack it with the rest of the stuff I want and then they will send it to germany. That will take 4 days longer again.
Aww... but what are 4 days more or less when you waited a month?

I´m looking forward getting that bougu since a year now.
I think I´ll be ueberhappy when it arrives.

By the way, what do you think of the Gi and Hakama from ninecircles which are made in china? They are extremely cheap, do you think I have to expect that they are of bad quality?
(Right now I have a Polyester/Cotton Hakama and a Cotton Gi).

Thanks for answers and opinions.

[emitbrownne]

I have bought a couple of single layer blue cotton Gi's from Ninecircles and found that they was of far better quality than I expected. The colour is dark and does not run. I normally handwash my Gi for fear of the colour fading, but these seem to keep the colour even in the washing machine.
I'd buy my Gi from Ninecircles again.
I have also bought a Black Hakama (the ones advertised in the Iaido section) which has had no problems keeping the pleats and the stitching is very sturdy.

I'll expect my cheque in the post Quentin :D

[alexpollijr]

If the Keikogi and Hakama of Nine Circles is the same one from kendoshop, they'll provide a big, big bang for your buck. Especially the Keikogi. The Rayon/Polyester hakama is very good for everyday practice , but doesn't look as neat as a thick cotton one.

[Raígma]

YEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!
Blue hands, painful wrist, totally exhausted, strange feeling, confident. ^-^
I have a bogu... wheeee!!!
Next time with men. =)

Actually they gave me a men which is a bit too big because my
head is "thin" and because they knew that they´d have to send
pads with it. I have to enforce my chin to suit it perfectly but
though it suits all right. Maybe I´ll just use a few pads more. ^-^
Fukiomi was hard to execute with bougu. Hm...
Ninecircles has good quality, the Hakama and the Gi are
great, though I doubt that the Hakama is made of cootton.

And tomorrow I´ll go for the wordl.... J/k

May your Ki be with you all of you kendokas out there.

[Sinta]

Originally posted by Raígma
YEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!
Blue hands, painful wrist, totally exhausted, strange feeling, confident. ^-^
I have a bogu... wheeee!!!
Next time with men. =)

And tomorrow I´ll go for the wordl.... J/k

May your Ki be with you all of you kendokas out there.

Congrats hun ^_^ Am happy for you. It's something totally new, when you do kendo with the bogu. Enjoy it and sweat it out.

How come everyone starts their first experience with a bogu without the men? On my first day with bogu I had to use the men. *feels like she was thrown into the fire* Ah well.

Happy for ya Raígma :) Don't give up. Many quit after they got their bogu, just make sure you're not one of them.

[kendomushi]

We always start day one of bogu wearing everything. I've only seen it done a piece at a time with young kids here.

[alexpollijr]

Same here. It's all or nothing.

[Raígma]

I won´t quit and next time I´m going to practice with men.
Wheeee Jigeiko.

[Sinta]

Originally posted by Raígma
I won´t quit and next time I´m going to practice with men.
Wheeee Jigeiko.

LOL I had my first jigeiko last week :) I was so looking forward to it, but after training in the full bogu, doing drills and stuff, when we got to the jigeiko i was worn out ^_^ Hopefully this time I'll be able to give it my all. Drills take out a lot out of you.

[Fraz]

Yep. All the best people just get thrown in at the deep end...;)

[Chusan]

@Raigma conc. Do:
if your do is too tight you can fix this easily. Put something between the do-flaps ( a piece of wood or just anything that has the proper length, I have a fitting shortened shinai-stave for that) so that it will have the correct width. Now keep the do wet. Put it in a plastic-bag or wrap it in clothes and keep the thing wet. Do this for about 48 hours and the do will have re-shaped into the new width.
This works with both bamboo- and plastic- do. (You may find that within my www-site, too. In German language).

[titus]

I just got a Koei doh from Bogubag, but it was too wide. The quality is very nice though, very happy.

I'm thin and tall, so I'm sending it back and getting a narrower one, but the problem is that the mune is not high enough. This will probably be even worse with the new one, because it is supposed to be an inch shorter vertically. Any suggestions? I heard somewhere that stroud has different heights available for their dohs, but I don't think that's correct. Any ideas?

[JSchmidt]

Erh..just how tall are you?...and is the height of the mune really that important?

Jakob

[Chusan]

Originally posted by titus
I just got a Koei doh from Bogubag, but it was too wide. The quality is very nice though, very happy.

I'm thin and tall, so I'm sending it back and getting a narrower one, but the problem is that the mune is not high enough.Any ideas?
Surely.
Just read my post above. It`s no problem to make a Do fitting. What is fine for making it wider is true for making it narrower, too.
Just take a Do which has the sufficient height for Mune. If it`s too narrow, see above, if it`s too wide - make it narrower.
Just the same procedure: keep the Do wet for one or two days and bring it into the fitting you like. You may use some ducked tape or anything you like for fixing the narrower width.
BTW: though every Kendo-supplier sells fitting equpiment, you`re usually supposed to make some minor fixings youselves. Such as fixing the Himo of Gi, fixing the width of Do, attaching the Himo of your Bougu etc.

[hamish]

If its a fibre do, I've heard of people using a hairdryer to warm it up, then fixing it at the right width with cut down shinai staves and rope. Leave it for a while and you have a custom fitting do!

[Hai_hai]

So, when you give your height and weight measurements to a bogu store, they know what equipment will fit you regardless of body shape (overweight, muscular, skinny)

[Neil Gendzwill]

Originally posted by Hai_hai
So, when you give your height and weight measurements to a bogu store, they know what equipment will fit you regardless of body shape (overweight, muscular, skinny)

No, they don't. That's why you need to give them the proper doh measurement, which is the distance across the back. The best way to do that is to measure a doh that you like the fit of. Barring that, get a friend to measure your width at the waist and add a couple of cm (more if you like a loose fit).

[Hai_hai]

Has anyone ever heard of a dou breaking or splitting beyond repair? Like if you fell on the ground.

[Anarei]

Never heard of that happening... one thing i notice about do, they're the most durable piece among all the other pieces of bogu... the men, kote and tare all show signs of wear but the do is one tough cookie! sure they get scratched but the scratches arent that noticable really.

Been wearing bogu 4 abt 3 months now, but not 100% used to it yet... :p How long u guys needed 2 feel completely comfy in bogu?

[KATSUJIN]

anarei? u from singapore too???

[Karaken]

Originally posted by Hai_hai
Has anyone ever heard of a dou breaking or splitting beyond repair? Like if you fell on the ground.

My do is not broken but after 6 years of use, Laquer of the right side ( yes, where people beat me ) cracked open in two places.
Any advice on how to fix them? Should I fix them? What happens if I don't?

Center - Chudan - Center

[Hai_hai]

Lacquer cracked? You can't just spot repair one area of a lacquered surface, especially if you have a roiro finish.