Right shoulder pain

[Confound]

Lately my right shoulder has been killing me, but only during kendou, not iaidou, and not when doing anything else. Recently I have hanged my kamae, before it was too low, now the left hand is directly in front of the navel, and this has meant the right hand is a bit higher as well. Also, I've changed to bearing most of the shinai's weight with my left hand, rather than the right. This should be correct, and if anything were to hurt, it would be the left arm, right? But my right shoulder has been screaming.

I know it's hard to comment without seeing, but my senseis have said that there shouldn't be anything wrong... It's certainly annoying. Feels likeI got in the wrong end of an argument with a freight train, what with the knee aching and the stupid shoulder...

c

[Phlebas]

The same thing happened to my right shoulder recently, and it turned out to be bursitis. I think it was triggered by some vigorous physical labour I was doing recently, where my hands were over my head a lot, but historically it's my LEFT shoulder that used to be painful. Anyway, I'm forced to do Kendo only once a week until it gets better (frowns mightily). I hope this physiotherapy pays off and lets me practice more often... SOON!

My advice is to get it checked out. If it is bursitis and you don't treat it, you can lose range-of-motion in the long run and build up lots of nasty scar tissue. A few months of curtailed practice and physio excercises could save your Kendo. Dont delay! See a professional. In the meantime, ice your shoulder after practice and whenever it's sore. That really helps me.

Good luck!

[Confound]

Pheblas,

Firstly, that sounds dreadful.

Secondly, I don't think this pain could be bursitis, because it only affects me during kendou, not during iai, or while carrying heavy loads, or doing other physical activity.

c

[Phlebas]

Interesting. My bursitis only hurts AFTER practice, and sometimes (albeit rarely) when I'm doing nothing at all, but never when I'm actually doing something that uses the shoulder joint.

I'm glad to hear that you doubt it's bursitis... it's not deadly or extremely painful, but it's very, very inconvenient! : (( I hate to miss practice.

[Raiza]

While you're putting off seeing a doctor, follow the following advice for your shoulder. I applied for the JET program a few years back and the medical insurance offered at the time was for urgent care only, so I'm assuming that's the reason why you haven't gone yet.


Originally posted by JSchmidt
For virtually any kind of injury, R.I.C.E is the best you can do.
Rest
Ice
Compression
Elevation.

All will help to reduce the inflammation (and pain) and speed up recovery
Hot and Cold should only be used once the inflammation is gone, otherwise you are just encouraging it to spread. It is useful in the re-hab process, though.


Where exactly in your shoulder does it hurt? What moves in kendo aggravate the pain? Your case doesn't sound like bursitis at all, Confound. It sounds like something I know near and dear, but I'll need more information.

Among other things, bursitis is associated with disorders like gout and rheumatoid arthritis, not by changing a kamae posture, presumably for a short time in your case. Here's some information on bursitis.
http://www.merck.com/pubs/mmanual/section5/chapter59/59c.htm

In the meantime, do the stuff JSchmidt advised and RELAX those shoulders during kendo.

[Stan]

Confound,

I too have had trouble with my right shoulder. In my case it was the ac joint. That is where the clavical meets the collarbone (sorry if my anatomy is wrong). These two bones get irritated from the motions of kendo. I did some physical therapy but in addition I used ice and a stretching. One stretch that was particularly helpful was: I placed the hand of the problem arm behind me (resting on the lower back) and with a towel flung over my opposite shoulder I grasped it with both hand (one on the small of my back and the other in front near my chest. Then with the good arm pull the hand behind you up towards your upper back. If it hurts ease off a bit. You might find that ice with this type of stretch helps. I hope my explanation of the stretch is ok. One other suggestion, if your lat is tight it may be putting pressure on you shoulder muscles. Grasp a door jam and pull on it to stretch your lats. I hope this helps.

[Hai_hai]

Originally posted by Confound
... Feels likeI got in the wrong end of an argument with a freight train, what with the knee aching and the stupid shoulder...

I almost drowned in the river you just cried.

What may help is weight resistance training that focus on deltoid development. Although that usually helps, you may have a more serious problem which an orthopaedic surgeon could find out what's going on.

[kendomushi]

If R.I.C.E doesn't fix it in short order, go to a doctor. Delay can result in much worse trouble if it is bursitis or an injury. Much better to lose a bit of practice time than have permanent ROM loss.
Does it bother you doing suburi, or just in actual keiko?

[Flashman]

Lots of information here (http://www.thestretchinghandbook.com/archives/rotator-cuff-injury.htm) on rotator cuff injuries. The AC joint is supported by muscles and the upward movement of the shinai seems to exacerbate any weakness that there might be in this area.

Good luck, and see a doctor if it doesn't get better.

[itazura]

Here is a site with lots of good info. Not a substitute for a doctor naturally.

Nicholas Institute of Sports Medicine and Athletic Trauma

http://www.nismat.org/

[Confound]

I would hardly calling it crying a river, Hai_hai, it's a statement. There's no request for pity, no elaborate, lengthy description of pain, just a neatly turned phrase intended to elicit a chuckle from all concerned.

c

[Hai_hai]

Confound-chan,
Ok, no river of tears but that was the smallest violin playing in the background.

[Confound]

Call me -chan again, and I'll make you pay for it, even if I have to hunt you down in real space. There are only three people in the world who have the right to use -chan after my name. I hate it.

The remark was intended to elicit a laugh because of its cleverness, not pity. Did you even see that it my previous post, or did you only see another chance to up your post count and see your name on the thread page? You're tempting me to join Ares' killfile club.

c

[Inouye02]

confound chan ,,haha i like that ...you are more then welcome to hunt me down , sometimes at kurukuru dojo on mondays , venice on wednesdays, and kawai sensei's dojo on friday, ( jci gardena ) his invite he offered to you is still open should you ever care to respond to him..just think all the SCI guys you hate could be there to keiko with you also at any of these dojo's ..up to the challenge ?

[Hai_hai]

Confound-sama,
Sumimasen. I was just using "chan" as a sweet term of endearment, which you of course know. I'm only being sarcastic when I talk about a river of tears. Please accept my apologies.

Domo.


P.S. Confound-chan, have a nice day.

[Ares2907]

Hope the shoulder is nothing too serious. As much as I am dubious of Japanese medicine, I'd still recommend seeing a physio or other specialist if available.
As for 'a weight regime' helping, I'd have to say that's one of the most dangerous and ignorant statements (if not intentionally malicious) I've heard in some time.
Oh, and you know that feeding the trolls only encourages them to breed *shudder*