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  • #46
    For those of you who can pick up a copy of this week's edition (May 16) of The New Yorker, I would highly recommend reading Peter Boyer's piece on Pope Benedict and the ongoing struggle between the progressive and conservative wings of the Catholic church. Puts many of the topics mentioned above in context.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by tattooedasshole
      Since god didn't write the book ( its was written 200 yrears after christ died, by a roman council).......
      Not one of the people who wrote the bible had ever met jesus. The only man who wrote a book, who had met jesus, was barnabus, and his books were burnt for heracy. Perhaps you should do some research.
      And if you think that god wrote the bible, you need serious help. Even the bible tells you it was written by man.
      Try reading the bible some time, you'll see what I'm talking about.
      The bible is full of good moral lessons, but can not be taken 100% litteraly.
      oookay...just a question..why was the books burnt for heracy?(wuts heracy?..forgive me but I can't find my dictionary...bro probably took it~)wouldn't the books be a more valid resource?just wondering~~
      Yeah..well..no time for research tho..kendo training and school doesn't allow time for that!

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      • #48
        I am a Catholic, and proud to be one. The church may have teachings that seem unfair or just don't suit people, but recently I asked myself, is religion about what I want or what God wants? It's clearly about what God wants. Even if God disagrees with what the church teaches, we'll never know, and I figure he'll find it impressive if we stick to a certain set of beliefs. As far as abortion and contraception goes, if you want to know specifics on why the church is against those, talk to a knowledgeable priest. And on the AIDS issue, contraception could stop that, but education, testing, and abstinance would do better. Priest celibacy and women as priests are also things you should ask a good priest about. But in the end, nobody knows exactly what's right, so we should all just try to be generally good people.

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        • #49
          I don't know what the real definition of Nazi is, but for me it was always think that your nation is best, and that you discriminate other people only because they are not your nationality.

          You see, everyone can be a "Nazi", regardless of any german heritage.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by CezarJ
            I don't know what the real definition of Nazi is, but for me it was always think that your nation is best, and that you discriminate other people only because they are not your nationality.

            You see, everyone can be a "Nazi", regardless of any german heritage.
            In specific terms a Nazi is a member of the National Socialist Geman Workers Party ( created in 1919 ). In broader terms a Nazi is a Fascist. A Fascist is a person who follows the belief in a government marked by the centralization of power under a dictator , stringent socio economic controls and usually a country rife with rasism and nationalism....you asked

            cheers Michael

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            • #51
              Originally posted by gsx1100s
              In specific terms a Nazi is a member of the National Socialist Geman Workers Party ( created in 1919 ). In broader terms a Nazi is a Fascist. A Fascist is a person who follows the belief in a government marked by the centralization of power under a dictator , stringent socio economic controls and usually a country rife with rasism and nationalism....you asked

              cheers Michael
              ...however, in specific terms, a Fascist is nothing but a member of the Fascist Party in Italy.

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              • #52
                In my humble view religion is neither about what you want nor about what some god wants. A good religion is not suppose to say do... don't. It's supposed to provide an understanding of the environment (universe if one wants) we live in an to provide concepts and ideas on how to find your way in life in a manner which is in harmony with that environment and yourself as you are a part of it. it supposed to show ways of finding and rebuilding strength from your own inner sources as well as from the environment.
                And exactly that is what neither christian nor the jewish (in fact what they do is cultivate intolerance at its most despisable; they constantly rant about how they were treated badly in the past, and now look what they do to the palestinians (who were there in the first place). you cannot just pull out an old book and say here it says this is our land. because then any nation could do pull out something from history) religions do. Which in my view makes then probably the two weakest "traditional" religions in existance. Further catholicism was never intended as an actual helpful religion , rather than as an instrument for controlling the lesser educated (an thus quicker to mystical help resorting) population by through clerical institution. Similarly was inquisition never so much intended as a means to exorcise, but as a convenient way for studying the effects forced mental and physical reconfigurations have on the human personality and character.

                On the side: just the unbelievable ignorance of israel and some other countries in calling the palestinians terrorists. They nothing more than a people which is fighting for a place to stay, which they deserve like anybody else (and which they had acquired and cultivated before the jews in the first place). The palestinians do not get tons of money and modern weaponry from countries like the U.S (who are too self centered to realize that they are the biggest polluter and useless burner of valuable resources in the world, and have degraded to being the decadent tool of a selfish jewish society). The palestinians have nothing and they fighting for their life the the methods they have available. Anybody who has some understanding of warfare clearly sees that this is they only choice for the palestinians to fight this war against a brutal oppressor. Israel kills children on a daily basis and calls them terrorists even whn provably they were not. But when the palestinians kill israelian children or ppl thats really mean.

                Further how can a country like the U.S. in which the knowledge about and understanding of the outside world is close to non-existant claim to be the rightful leader of the world? A country that stacks up two billions US$ in dept a day, and whose economy would collapse the they the europeans and chinese would stop pumping money into it, a country that alone burns two thirds of the worlds resources for its own selfish purposes, and is even not willing to support environmental protocols; a country claiming there economy is more important thant the environmental state of the eart. How can such a country taken seriously?

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                • #53
                  Let me add. That the U.S always claim that they ended WWII and that they despise nationalsocialism, etc. But had you also studied the time before the U.S entered the war in detail you would found that the U.S. were very much interested in and for the third reich and there was a clear intention to enter the war rather on the side of the germans. The only reason they did not is that Churchil pulled smart political string thus imposing pressure on the U.S to enter the war on the side of the (to be called) allies.

                  Also let me point out that I am by no means a right extremist or nazi or anywhere close. But fact is america is wrong and israel is wrong period and a big lot of ppl are suffering because of it.

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                  • #54
                    Bluhawq, I fully agree with you. The bible is a good read and certainly not a bad book.there are many useful concepts touched upon. However as a foundation for a religion the size of christianity its a really quite thin (thin in content not size). which is reflected quite well in today society in think.
                    Last edited by Oukaranman; 25th May 2005, 05:17 PM. Reason: Carification

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by bluhawq
                      oookay...just a question..why was the books burnt for heracy?(wuts heracy?..forgive me but I can't find my dictionary...bro probably took it~)wouldn't the books be a more valid resource?just wondering~~
                      Yeah..well..no time for research tho..kendo training and school doesn't allow time for that!
                      Heresy (my spelling sux) is something that goes directly against the church.

                      Heresy:
                      An opinion or a doctrine at variance with established religious beliefs, especially dissension from or denial of Roman Catholic dogma by a professed believer or baptized church member

                      Barnabus went contrary to alot of what church doctrine says. Eg. Jesus has brothers and sister. The church didn't like this, so his books (most of them at any rate) were burnt.

                      On a side note, anyone who thinks a couple stayed together, in that period of history, without having more children, is kidding themselves. It's kinda like a flagrantly white jesus, born in a place and time where every one would have been black.

                      As per a "more" valid point of view......I think it is, but obviously there's alot of people who will disagree. As none of us was alive, it's kind of a moot point.

                      I try and take all perspectives, from as many religions as i can find info on, and make up my own mind. You should be able to immerse yourself in all ways, while becoming more, and more in accord with your own.

                      A little about barnabus http://www.catholic-forum.com/saints/saintb12.htm

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                      • #56
                        So that is what heracy means eh?..erm..just wondering..if Barnabus actually met Jesus..wouldn't he know better if Jesus had siblings or not?

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by bluhawq
                          So that is what heracy means eh?..erm..just wondering..if Barnabus actually met Jesus..wouldn't he know better if Jesus had siblings or not?
                          Yes he would, but that doesn't mean that the church will change its position. If they had agreed with him, the book of barnabus would be in the bible (like it's supposed to be). But as the bible was put together by a roman council, it doesn't exactly reflect what chirstians of the time believed (at least thats my perspective).

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                          • #58
                            actualy the bible is relativly amibiguos on the point of christs family. we realy dont see any of them after he leaves home until his death.

                            i would like to make a correctionon an early assertation. The bible was not written by a roman council. Most of it is letters of correspondance between paul of tarsus and varius churches. the origins of the gospels were also pre-cananization texts.

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by drizzt
                              actualy the bible is relativly amibiguos on the point of christs family. we realy dont see any of them after he leaves home until his death.

                              i would like to make a correctionon an early assertation. The bible was not written by a roman council. Most of it is letters of correspondance between paul of tarsus and varius churches. the origins of the gospels were also pre-cananization texts.
                              Not written by, but "organized" by. And changed when things didn't meet their needs. Eg.The father son and holy ghost make 3, yet, you shall have no other god but me (singular). Changed because they belived it would be easier for people to understand a ploytheistic point of view.

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                              • #60
                                actualy the father son and the holy host are not gods....... they are three parts, but one God. they refer to God the father, The son, who is christ, and the holy spirit, wich is kinda difficult to explain. it does not promote christ to god status


                                and yes, much of wht we see in modern bibles has been modified(or had been), by the early catholic church. now its evn worse because newer, more "progressive" groups like the southern baptist convention have started rewriting things to make absolutley no sense whatsoever.

                                the best translations are taken directly from greek and hebrew texts.

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