Noticed on KW's front page that a new online bogu store, ChibaBogu.com, will be opening soon. It says on the website that its flagship product is the machine-sewn Mine bogu. Is there a link between that one and the Mine made by Mitsuboshi?
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Noticed on KW's front page that a new online bogu store, ChibaBogu.com, will be opening soon. It says on the website that its flagship product is the machine-sewn Mine bogu. Is there a link between that one and the Mine made by Mitsuboshi?
possibly, I'd support evidence showing connections between Mitsuboshi and the new Chiba budogu company.(seeing as to how Mitsuboshi textile link is on their website) I suspect their quality should be quite good. Nevertheless, my favoriate will be "Moribudo". Do I hear a 2nd?
Hmm, well the 2004 Mitsuboshi Budougu catalog is chock full of rich-boy show-off goodies. Just lovely.
Mitsuboshi are the suppliers for Chiba Bogu. So it is the same bogu.
So desu ne.....thanks Alex!
The Mitsuboshi Mine bogu sold by Chiba Bogu is already being sold in the US by Eguchi as the Mitsuboshi Pitch bogu, Pitch being Eguchi's English translation of the Japanese word Mine. A bit puzzling of a translation, if you ask me.
Anyway, Chiba bogu's product explanation of the Mitsuboshi bogu is a lot better than Eguchi's, which reads like an advertisement for a witch potion. That is to say, a lot of promises without explanation.
The way that looks up close on eguchis website...i dont know about spending $2000 for it... I dont care how utilitarian it is designed to be...It really looks cheap...
I 2nd Cst-san's opinion! But I've also noticed the men and doh looks pretty nice, it's the kote and the tare(especially the tare, goodness!) that doesn't look too impressive.Quote:
Originally Posted by cst
Yes, it's a deterrent for rich-boy show-offs. I guess... 8 lines of embroidery on the tare is the minimum?Quote:
Originally Posted by Masahiro
8 lines on the tare? hai hai that is so like 3 years ago. hello? do you keep up with the fashion trend in kendo? let me keep you up to date. the newest crave now is to look for the decoration on the mae-obi, such as how many shades of blue make up the decoration on your mae-obi,(yeap the more the better!) and if you really want to show off you can even have the tare himo laced with gold stiching. now that's "over-kill"!Quote:
Originally Posted by Hai_hai
>>WARNING: the above messege is intended only for joking purpose, please do not attempt this in your life time! Seriously discretion is adviced!
Mitsuboshi makes excellent bogu.
This Chiba Bogu is located in Katsuura Chiba (1/2 miles away from 'budai' - Kokusai Budo Daigaku, International Budo University-.........) and they will only be dealing online.....(means longer shippment)
As I said many times, if you want cheap, metalic Iroc do from korea, thats fine...but if you want good quality japanese made bogu w/ reasonable price,
no one can compete against Eguchi if you are in USA....especially their perosnal service and superb after-care!
I bet this bogu shop will have very tough time against Eguchi eventhough they carry same line of bogu.
Hi everyone,
I tried e-mailing info@chibabogu.com.
Mr. Komoto replied very promptly with another e-mail account because for some strange reason, my yahoo server is asking him for authentication from his @chibabogu.com account in order for the e-mail to pass through.
I didn't even know yahoo-mail had such filtering function???
Anyone, help?
P.S. Their service and level of customization is excellent, btw.
`pitch` isn`t actually their translation of `mine`. They use the same word in japan as well, to describe a product within the mine range. It refers to the diagonal stitching, or so I`m told...
it must be excellent. $2000 for the 6mm machine stiched bogu... it MUST be excellent!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by DCPan
I have a set. I also have 2 sets of hand stitched bogu. The set of 'Mine' that I have is superior to my hand stitched sets in every way. I guess it is the materials that are used. To be honest, I was shocked at how machine made bogu could be so comfortable and resilient. I notice that even a lot of top level police like Eika, and Miyazaki also use it, so that must say something.
Funny…Quote:
Originally Posted by streetcleaner
Seriously, I was curious enough that I actually made an international call to Japan to discuss this further with Mr. Komoto. According to him, some members of the Japanese team actually wore the “Mine” while competing at Worlds.
The famous Ishida sensei also wears a Mine for regular practice and competition now, as well as several famous persona as Alex mentioned.
As discussed in Kendo Nippon, April 2004 issue, there’s a misperception that closer-stitching is “better”.
For example, I wear 1.0bu bogu right now. The way hand-stitching is done, the bogu exterior surface has these bumps that are raised by the stitching method. Now, imagine bubble wrap…wouldn’t you think there is a margin of diminishing return with “tighter” bumps?
Also, as the stitching gets tighter, the bogu gets STIFFER…frankly, I’d go for 1.2bu and 1.5bu…but as it was a gift, my mom was pretty insistent on getting me the “best”…and no way I’m complaining about that, though I did try to convince her to save money and “just” get me a 1.5bu…for my credit. :rolleyes:
Good bogu should be soft and flexible (for molding to your body contour) as cloth WITH high point-pressure resistance…that’s true good bogu…with flexibility to spread the impact…think old steel car vs. new car with regenerating bumpers….
Similar misconceptions involve the ashi on the komune of the doh. There’s a misperception that sanbon-ashi (3-leg embroidery) is “better” than nihon-ashi (2-leg embroidery) because it cost more. It cost MORE because of more labor…that’s different from better. You should pick a komune consistent with your TORSO length…if you have long torso, you’d want sanbon-ashi…if you have short torso, you’d want ippon-ashi…simple.
Now, something more on topic, Chiba Bogu’s service.
Mr. Komoto speaks perfect English.
He allowed me to pick EVERYTHING. I picked the width and length of the men-futon, with their recommendation of course.
I was able to pick the material of the grill (dura-aluminum, titanium, or IBB).
I was able to pick the ago embroidery pattern, the ago trim color and style (green flower, brown flower, blue indigo plain), color of kazari (cord embroidery) and color of thread used to stitch kazari on, the thread color used to stitch the “tenchi” (the top and bottom base of the men ring).
I was also able to ask them to adjust the men-ring width so my glasses can be worn underneath. They are going to tightly stitch the men-ring near the mono-mi, so I don’t have to wear an over-sized men like the one I have currently.
It was simply custom to the end! They even offered to match it to my previous 3mm set exactly stylistically, if I send them digital pictures. I had another design in mind, so I didn’t take it up…but WOW!!!!
To top it off, I got all this with a huge sticker price difference from another place that didn’t offer any of this customization, yet cost more (I calculated everything, including shipping and handling cost).
Truly, I have NEVER had a more pleasant shopping experience…and I do shop around!
I look forward to getting my new MINE men.
Basically, you picked a rich-boy show-off bogu.Quote:
Originally Posted by DCPan
LOL!Quote:
Originally Posted by Hai_hai
Actually, I picked all indigo trim...so, it'll be plain as can be, with "batten" X-Kasari instead of an embroidery pattern. Mr. Komoto called it the "work horse design".
Besides, Hai Hai, you wouldn't feel so poor if you had more KOKORO.
:rolleyes:
hi DC Pan,
i really enjoyed reading your post. it was very informative ^^
i am about to purchase bogu and was thinking to get the s-17 set from koei.
i chose this set, because
* it's supported with sorbothane on the men and kote (i expect this to absorb shock very good ^^)
* cost is distributed as it's often recommended (as much money on men and kote, less on do and tare)
* has deerskin palms on kote (nowhere else, so no rich-girl-show-off bogu :D)
* and 4.5mm stiching seems appropriate to me
it costs about 500USD, the utter most i would like to spend on bogu.
since the question of whether close stiching is good has recently turned out to be negated i am even more convinced to buy this set.
do you think sorbothane padding pays it's price?
what do you think in general about this set?
thank you all for comments in advance
and sorry for hijacking the thread ^^
That all depends. With tighter bumps, there's more bumbs to absorb the impact.Quote:
For example, I wear 1.0bu bogu right now. The way hand-stitching is done, the bogu exterior surface has these bumps that are raised by the stitching method. Now, imagine bubble wrap…wouldn’t you think there is a margin of diminishing return with “tighter” bumps?
In any case, this is an interesting thread, especially as I'm planning to buy a new men within the next couple of months. (And yes, it will be a rich-boy show-off men)
Jakob
Hey, no problem :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by moetl
Honestly, I've not had the chance to use bogu with sorbothane inserts stitched into the futon like the KOEI sets. So, I don't have an opinion on that.
I am currently using an external sorbothane men pad underneath my men though. It seems to work great.
But the pressure per area of the contact changes the dynamic of the strike.Quote:
Originally Posted by JSchmidt
Also, you could be sacrificing flexibility of bogu for it.
There's no one right answer for this, btw.
After all, the MINE bogu is designed to be at that stitch width with different layers of materials.
So, I don't want people to think that one stitch width is definitely better than another.
The craftsman and materials used will change how the whole thing turns out.
With some materials, you'd probably want close stitching to achieve a certain effect.
I'll let people know what I think when I've actually had a chance to wear it!
Well, there probably is a right answer, but it would take a lot of experiementing, something I can't afford :).Quote:
But the pressure per area of the contact changes the dynamic of the strike.
Also, you could be sacrificing flexibility of bogu for it.
There's no one right answer for this, btw.
We've got a couple of people in our dojo, who have just ordered from Hakkado..I'm looking forward to seeing them...I'm sort of leaning that way in the moment. What's the production time on your bogu from Chiba?
Cheers,
Jakob
No kidding!Quote:
Originally Posted by JSchmidt
However, my suggestion is that not everyone wants the same thing anyway.
Some people think bogu should be this way while others think they should be that way...etc.
Similarly, optimum stitching width may different, depending on whether you are stitching mosen, sorbothane, etc....
How did you do that? Do you have someone who speaks Japanese facilitating the order?Quote:
Originally Posted by JSchmidt
I was originally leaning toward the A-1 Tokuren Men from Kanagawa Hakkodo. But the ease of getting info from Chibabogu and the other vendor won me over.
I didn't even see the A-1 Tokuren Men listed on their website from Kendo Nippon.
I'll get a production time estimate soon...I thought it was something like 30 or 60 days...
I have sorbothane in my kote and men. I'm not sure which set they're from. When I purchased my bogu, essentially I said, "Sensei, here's how much I can spend. What's the best combination I can get?" and he got it. I know I have 4mm kote and a 5mm men. In the four years I've had the set, I can't remember ever experiencing pain when struck properly on the kote buton, where the sorbothane is. Across the knuckles or across the joint proper still hurts of course. Occasionally, I get my bell rung when people strike men, particularly if they strike deep. You can definitely tell the difference when they strike past the sorbothane. On the other hand, I'm fairly tall, so people don't strike over the top of my men very often.Quote:
Originally Posted by moetl
The only downside of my kote is that the kote buton is *very* stiff. That isn't much of a concern though, because they fit well and that part of my arm doesn't bend anyway.
Yes. We had a rep from Hakkado come over 3 years ago (Who actually joined our practice a couple of times) and since then our Japanese sempai has taken care of the orders. I bought their #7000 hakama and keiko-gi and even after 3 years, it barely shows any sign of wear.Quote:
How did you do that? Do you have someone who speaks Japanese facilitating the order?
It's only recently, however, that we've started ordering bogu through them.
Jakob
Kent Enfield, thank you very much for your reply! was it a set from koei?
further comments welcome ^^
Sorry, yes it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by moetl
I just downloaded their catalog. It's all expensive. Looks good. Perforated kote palms, interesting idea.
Hello, Jacob. Is there a Japanese website for Hakkado? I would like to check out their products.Quote:
Originally Posted by JSchmidt
Yes, nice catalogue and nice looking bogus but hmmm......over 200.000 yen for 6mm machine stitched bogu!!?? I'm sure it must be very good since already many good kendo senseis and sempais guarantee the quality but bit hard to change the general perception of what good bogu has been -you know all that 1 bu and 1.2 bu handstitched.
Kanagawa HakkodoQuote:
Originally Posted by Genshi
Does anyone know if there's a way to contact the company on-line(an e-mail address or such)?
I would like to get in touch with them to ask them about their A-1 men and kote but can't call them on the phone cause I don't speak any Japanese.
Apparently, the website www.kumdotv.com carries the full line of Samshin's bogu.
There's no mark up in price either, from what I see(I have Samshin's printed catalogue).
On the home page, there's a submenu for shopping mall. Click, and on the left side menu, fifth from the top, it says bogu sets in Korean.
DCPan:
I was just wanting a follow-up on your Mitsuboshi Mine Bogu. How is the quality, and do you feel it was worth the money paid? What was the subtotal for the entire set including shipping?
Hi,Quote:
Originally Posted by hammock
I have not received it yet, though they should be shipping it soon.
I did not get a complete set. I only got the men.
As for the subtotal, the quotes will vary depending on your physical size and the options you choose (i.e. I chose IBB-Titanium Grille).
More will follow....
I must admit te Chiba gear looks good, but pretty pricey!
David - I look forward to your review.
Mind telling me how much the men is? My email is broken_shinai@yahoo.com.au
Arigato gozaimasu!
Just to counter the Mitsuboshi loving, thought I`d throw in a word about the Hakkodo A-1. Received mine a couple of weeks ago, and was incredibly impressed. Super light, but doesn`t hurt to get hit at all, even with people who use super-heavy shinai. Stylish too. The `wings` are super soft, which means that rich boy show-offs will be able to make it into any shape they want. Highly reccomended. Bought some A-1 kote as well, I was so pleased with it.
btw, Hakkodo have a pair of kote in their catalogue for 493000yen! That`s about 2400 pounds just for a pair of kote! They`re waiting for haihai to drop in...
take a picture of that bad boy :D
wooo~~
those A-1's look nice.
Are the Kote's deer leather? In the head, are they foam or hair?
How did you go about ordering from this company?
From the pics, doesn't look like there is much leather on the trim, looks more like cloth. For some reason, i like that more :puzzled: