Kata shiai

[Genya]

I didn´t know where to put this, so I placed it here.
What do you think about this: Would kata shiai be possible? Kendokas do some kata and judges decide which was better.

[nodachi]

Major problem I foresee is that we are all taught kata differently. Yes, I know that the elements of it all are the same, but certain parts are different. For example, many sensei have taught me to keep the arms/bokutou parallel to the ground after you cut dou in nanahonme. Then here sensei tell me that you should cut and end somewhat diagonally towards the ground as the cut would realistically end up going. These were all high ranking sensei, but then one guy will pull you over to the side and say, do it his way when with him, but do it how your main sensei tells you the rest of the time, all the while telling this he is snickering and smiling. So here is just one example, there are many others.

We all understand certain elements from kata, but the bits and pieces change depending on who is teaching. It would be interesting to sort out where all these changes came from, but that would be quite a difficult research task.

So the major problem I see is people immediately being at a disadvantage if the judges were taught differently than the participants. I don't think it would work.

[JSchmidt]

Eh?..it already exists in many places.

Jakob

[Genya]

Eh?..it already exists in many places.

Jakob

Ok, I didn´t know this exists cause I´ve never heard about it.

After some thinking I agree that maybe it wouldn´t work. Senseis from Japan have told me different ways to do katas than our Finnish senseis. In international competitions differece between competitors would be probably huge.

[ScottUK]

Yeah - called iai.

[Paburo]

i've seen a couple kendo kata shiai. it's something possible. i'd even say more,i think it's easier to judge than kendo shiai.

[Budo Angel]

Sadly agree with Jakob from experience - one sensei (or group) will teach you one way, and different sensei/group judges you... kendo is more guilty of not recognising the nuances/differences from different sensei. Iai in that respect takes a wider perspective because different styles/sensei. Just be true to what you're taught.

ps. And don't attempt to come out with "but Japanese sensei taught me this..." if you're with the Finnish sensei, do as they say on the spot, and vice versa. Sad but true.

pps. and judging kata shiai is always going to be contentious...but hopefully the best people win.

[Charlie]

I myself would not be interested in taking part in such a shiai. I see kata as non-competitive. My same opinion goes for iai. Mad props if that's your stick, you know, I'm not knocking it, but it is not mine.

[tantadi]

People get graded on their kata performance, so why not compete in it as well..I'd might consider doing it if I had a good and stable kata partner.

[Neil Gendzwill]

The sensei tell you differing small details, but that's not a huge part of what they are evaluating in shinsa, nor would it be in such a proposed competition.

[sainueng]

Loser: uchidachi
Winner: shidachi

[ScottUK]

In shiai, there would be TWO shidachi & TWO uchidachi. Not predetermined at all...

[tantadi]

The sensei tell you differing small details, but that's not a huge part of what they are evaluating in shinsa, nor would it be in such a proposed competition.

Well I don't know what is the actual offical thinking, but I do know of people who have failed their grading, at least so they say, because of mistakes done in kata. I also question the practise of having some people repeat their kata, unless it has a decisive role.

If kata was to become competitive, I think it would soon become a performance art, as you can see in some karate styles; beautiful people trying to show off their atletisism and actor abilities.

[ScottUK]

If kata was to become competitive, I think it would soon become a performance art, as you can see in some karate styles; beautiful people trying to show off their atletisism and actor abilities.

I have competed regularly in iaido shiai. I am not showing off or acting. You generalise too much.

[Charlie]

I think tantadi is referring to the "wave weapons around to the theme of Mortal Kmobat while doing backflips" school of "karate" competition. Which would probably never effect kendo, iai, kendo kata competition.

Unless I misunderstood. So, what's your entrance music, Scott? It's "Eye of the Tiger," isn't it?