Women and Shiai

[MartialArtsGirl]

Ok, so I was talking to a dojo mate and he was saying that, most likely, given the same sensei, same starting times, same number of classes, etc... that a man would probably beat a woman in shiai, (even if the woman's technique was better) because of some kind of mental attitude that a guy has that is different than girl. That is to say, that a woman does not have the combat/fighting oriented mental attitude that a man does.

It kinda ticked me off ,(and discouraged me a little) even if there's truth in it. But I'm not sure there is. (Or rather, if it exists, it's purely cultural- and taught). What does everyone else think, is a woman somehow at a disadvantage because of her way of thinking? Is a woman somehow less (mentally) combat oriented and thus needs to overcome this to do well in shiais?

[hyuna]

I think that more aggressive and competitive people have an advantage in shiai over more compassionate/nurturing and collaborative people.

Stereotypically, people associate the former with men and the latter with women, but, of course, it is just a stereotype.

[nodachi]

There are plenty of women who can mop the floor with me in shiai. Our federation has quite a few really really good female kendoka. If there is anything that makes women weaker in kendo, I would think it is the cultural/social issues that have made them more 'girly' (for lack of a better term) than men. Pardon me for also using that culturally taught concept of being 'girly', but I think that society filters most people to particular hobbies/sports/etc and so that is why women seem to have it harder in kendo, because Kendo behavior is not very feminine.

[Abramo]

Bull.
Shit.

[Shmur]

My first ever kendo tournament I got my ass handed to me by a girl.

With everything else (and I mean everything else) being equal, I can kind of see their point based on pure physicality, but everything else is rarely equal.

[Shinsengumi77]

I don't think it's that big a difference, but aggression is a secondary sex-characteristic in men. But honestly, I don't think men have an advantage over women if they have the same experiences. It depends on the individual, not their gender.

[atgm]

It's crap. Stereotypes.

[Idyllic]

Given the same sensei, same starting times and the same number of classes men are still stronger and have more stamina than women.

[atgm]

Given the same sensei, same starting times and the same number of classes men are still stronger and have more stamina than women.

Strength doesn't have much to do with it; it's not like you're being graded on how hard you whack the other person's head, wrist, or ribs.

You could also say that given the same age, men are more likely to be overweight than women, so their inherent stamina boost is for naught.

Or that women are more likely to judge rationally and take proper action in a heated moment.

Or that women are lighter and more agile.

Or that women are more dextrous.

Yes, there are advantages that men get due to evolution, but yes, there are disadvantages as well... and women get their own set of advantages and disadvantages. In the end, it doesn't really matter.

[ben]

Nature v nurture is an endless debate. I believe that men have some advantages in terms of strength and size and tend to be more aggressive than women. Perhaps higher levels (on average) of testosterone in men than women would account for this, as well as evolution, acculturation, etc, etc, etc.

However... the women who choose kendo and pursue it for some time are probably not "average" women, hence the "all things being equal" argument doesn't really hold.

b

[ArcticBlizzard]

He's completely right. We all know that men are hunters and woman are collectors. It's nice to see woman doing kendo but they will never be able to compete with men. We're far superior in nearly everything we do (accept household choirs of course, although we probably would be better if we set our mind to it, but we don't).

On a more serious note,

is a woman somehow at a disadvantage because of her way of thinking? Is a woman somehow less (mentally) combat oriented and thus needs to overcome this to do well in shiais?

I think this totally depends on the person. I'm a guy and totally not battle oriented, I'm working on it though. For me it's always been about enjoying myself, I do take it seriously but winning just isn't my goal when I do competitions.
I know girls who don't hold back and give everything, they go all out. I also know girls who just quit all the time and give up. They don't give up because they're girls, they give up for a totally different reason(not injury related). They just aren't the diehards/go getters the rest of us are.

[b8amack]

Shiai aren't separated by gender in shiai where you practice? Because if so, what does it matter, MAG?

[dwez]

That guys a sexist pig, you go grrl. Just look at Barbie, she's a doctor and a vet nowadays, OK you still get Princess barbie but the latest one does fencing and stuff. Men - tsk!

[MikeW]

In my experience women that wish to be, can be, just as good as a male in kendo given the same circumstances.

[hugo]

One of my sensei is female and half my height.
Yet I believe I have gotten a point against her once in three years.

And just to derail the topic, aggression (like most emotions) really won't help
you in Kendo.

If you watch high level tournaments, women don't pummel each other as much as the men do. They tend to hold good kamae and search for openings, pressing forward.

You know, correctly.