Etiquette for purchasing items

**Okamou** · 8th October 2009, 05:27 AM

Hello, I was wondering what the etiquette is for purchasing items to be used in the dojo, such as iaito or hakama. I have the opportunity to purchase an iaito cheaper than the ones my sensei want me to get, as well as it being better. I feel like this is often the case and I don't know if he is unaware that I know what the msrp is on many things or if he just doesn't know the proper prices himself. So would it be improper etiquette to purchase my own goods when necessary (because I can get them cheaper), or should I support my dojo by getting the items he has offered? The tuition is enough I feel like I need a break from the monetary drainage.

**Neil Gendzwill** · 8th October 2009, 06:00 AM

You should discuss the purchase with your sensei, first. Your idea of "better" might be different than his. Especially with iaito, the sensei will want to make sure that the equipment is safe for use in his dojo.

**stealth_monkey** · 8th October 2009, 11:39 AM

As Neil said, you should ask your sensei first. Stuff like hakama and gi aren't too big a deal, but an unsafe iaito can kill somebody. However, if your sensei states you should purchase the more expensive item he suggests, you're at least entitled to an explanation why. There are unfortunately sensei out there that have realised there's big markup to be made in making members buy in-house. I'm not saying this is the case, far from it, but the reasons why he suggests a different brand will help your knowledge in the future when appraising blades

**Tort-Speed** · 8th October 2009, 12:19 PM

'Good you asked, as can get appropriate advice here - over-enthusiastic and economizing me having gone off to buy various things inappropriate for the particular circumstances/lessons. Plus, not consulting my Senseis gave a bad impression (headstrong, unwilling to listen); worse, they likely felt I didn't value their knowledge. Naive and stupid (now, mainly the latter!).

**Okamou** · 8th October 2009, 02:37 PM

Thanks for all the advise. I believe that I know what would make a safe iaito, and me and him have already gone over the requirements for one. I believe I will just buy one on my own based on that knowledge. If it offends him he will forget it soon enough, I am not cheap, but I will not pay out the yin yang for an inferior product. Thanks again for the suggestions.

**stealth_monkey** · 8th October 2009, 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by Okamou

Thanks for all the advise. I believe that I know what would make a safe iaito, and me and him have already gone over the requirements for one. I believe I will just buy one on my own based on that knowledge. If it offends him he will forget it soon enough, I am not cheap, but I will not pay out the yin yang for an inferior product. Thanks again for the suggestions.

Either that or your sensei determines the iaito is not of a high enough quality for you to use it and tells you to keep using a bokken until you get a better one. To be blunt, if this is your attitude going into iaido, this is not the last time you're going to have a major clash. An assumption that you know enough about swords to not even require your sensei's input suggests that you know enough about sword arts to not require your sensei's instruction.

**bullet08** · 8th October 2009, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by Okamou

Thanks for all the advise. I believe that I know what would make a safe iaito, and me and him have already gone over the requirements for one. I believe I will just buy one on my own based on that knowledge. If it offends him he will forget it soon enough, I am not cheap, but I will not pay out the yin yang for an inferior product. Thanks again for the suggestions.

why bother asking in the forum with this if you already made up your mind?

pete

**MikeW** · 8th October 2009, 09:35 PM

Originally Posted by Okamou

If it offends him he will forget it soon enough.

All I can say at this point is that with that attitude I am glad you are not practicing in our dojo.

**ShinKenshi** · 8th October 2009, 09:57 PM

Originally Posted by Okamou

Thanks for all the advise. I believe that I know what would make a safe iaito, and me and him have already gone over the requirements for one. I believe I will just buy one on my own based on that knowledge.

Why did you even bother asking if you've already made up your mind?

Originally Posted by Okamou

If it offends him he will forget it soon enough,

You can't be serious. Understand that shrugging off the possibility of offending your sensei is something you don't want to do, because he will remember.

Originally Posted by Okamou

I am not cheap, but I will not pay out the yin yang for an inferior product.

Going over certain specifications with your sensei is one thing but knowing completely what makes a good iaito is on a different level. In all honesty, swallow your pride, clam up for now, and go with what your sensei recommends.

Originally Posted by Okamou

Thanks again for the suggestions.

And thank you for asking despite appearing to have made up your mind long before you asked.

**atgm** · 8th October 2009, 02:40 PM

You believe you know what would be a safe iaito... but what's your past experience?

You went over the requirements, but was that with the understanding that you would get one he knew was okay?

You will not pay out the yin yang for an inferior product, but how do you know his is "inferior" and that the cost isn't justified?

He's your sensei, but you have an attitude of "if it offends him, he will forget it soon enough"? Really?

**Mr. T.** · 8th October 2009, 06:09 PM

My sempai got my first iai gear. He went for the economy package (I was a college student at the time). After a while and a few years of experince I found my gear on my own, some times it went wrong. Mostly because I thought I knew what to buy, but in reality didn't. I learned the hard way (I'm a stubborn idiot, what can I say

). When help is offerd, you should probably take it, if not, get some help.

Originally Posted by Okamou

Hello, I was wondering what the etiquette is for purchasing items to be used in the dojo, such as iaito or hakama. I have the opportunity to purchase an iaito cheaper than the ones my sensei want me to get, as well as it being better.

So you have no experience in iai, but you think you know what is better quality. On who's knowledge are you basing you opinion on? I hope it isn't yours, because you have none when it comes to iai.

Originally Posted by Okamou

I feel like this is often the case and I don't know if he is unaware that I know what the msrp is on many things or if he just doesn't know the proper prices himself.

Not sure what you are insinuating here. Have you found the same goods your sensei is offering, but a lot cheaper (does your price include taxes, transport costs, etc.)?

Originally Posted by Okamou

So would it be improper etiquette to purchase my own goods when necessary (because I can get them cheaper), or should I support my dojo by getting the items he has offered?

Most of the time, the awnsers are yes and yes. But if it cost to much, talk to your sensei. Iai should be something you can afford and you shouldn't get you broke.

Originally Posted by Okamou

The tuition is enough I feel like I need a break from the monetary drainage.

How much are you paying for classes per month?

**Bucho** · 9th October 2009, 10:26 AM

Just out of curiosity, is there a link for the sword you're interested in?

**Okamou** · 9th October 2009, 11:39 AM

Wow, lots of asses here..
Instead of asking I see some of you have assumed much so I will explain more.
My sensei is far more experienced in Iaido than me, I have only been training for months, he has been training for years, but when it comes to swords I do believe I know more than he does (if you do not believe this I can give you plenty of examples but please be courteous).

Second, the sword he showed me was a fairly decent beginner iaito. However I went to the site of the company that made the iaito and found it for 100 dollars less than what he showed me, for the same sword. I am not an idiot, and I dont mind buying a 300 dollar beginner iaito, but not when the makers of the blade charge 200 for it. This is why I became suspect and why I asked here to get some mature advise. I respect my sensei, but this is all too fishy.

Lastly, I always have my mind made up, I wanted to see if this was a common issue with other students before I took action. Thanks again for those of you who did provide valuable input.

**Kendoka** · 9th October 2009, 01:15 PM

Originally Posted by Okamou

Wow, lots of asses here..
Instead of asking I see some of you have assumed much so I will explain more.
My sensei is far more experienced in Iaido than me, I have only been training for months, he has been training for years, but when it comes to swords I do believe I know more than he does (if you do not believe this I can give you plenty of examples but please be courteous).

Second, the sword he showed me was a fairly decent beginner iaito. However I went to the site of the company that made the iaito and found it for 100 dollars less than what he showed me, for the same sword. I am not an idiot, and I dont mind buying a 300 dollar beginner iaito, but not when the makers of the blade charge 200 for it. This is why I became suspect and why I asked here to get some mature advise. I respect my sensei, but this is all too fishy.

Lastly, I always have my mind made up, I wanted to see if this was a common issue with other students before I took action. Thanks again for those of you who did provide valuable input.

Who is the maker?