Men form

**Cuzenu** · 10th March 2010, 01:12 PM

In a men strike, when exactly should the arm(s) straighten out? On the way back/up over the head, or on the swing forward after passing over the head? Are both arms straight and parallel to the ground?
The left arm should be fully extended with the shinai at an obtuse angle, correct?

I'm just asking because I don't have a chance to attend practice for a week but I want to practice a little at home. When I swing through my right arm tends to be straight as well as the left after the men swing.

The shinai also rocks in my hands a little when I bring it up in back, I try to focus on holding it more with the last 2-3 fingers, but should it be rocking? It might just be lack of strength in my wrist.

I know the best way to learn is in keiko with senior member critiques but I was hoping to work on the motions before the next one, which will only be my 2nd involved practice, I wanted the last hour of one over the weekend, so literally my 3rd.

If you have a image/video demo that would help.

Thanks for your help.

**Kaoru** · 10th March 2010, 01:40 PM

I thought you were at that one University? The one without a kendo dojo? Did you see my post in your other thread asking about it? I posted some info for you. So... What dojo are you currently practicing at?? I am confused now! If you are not really in a dojo(or even if you are.), you can't ask online how to do stuff, and you can't teach yourself. That will not work, since we cannot see you or correct your technique. Nor can you use a 2 dimensional video that can't watch you, correct you when you get it all wrong or talk to you and answer your questions. I just had to say that just in case, no offense meant!

But if you are in an AUSKF(All US Kendo Federation) dojo, then great! But which one? Just wondering...

I know where they all are in AZ. But don't know which one.

And, to further answer your question, if you are in an AUSKF dojo you really need to ask your sensei or sempai about this and have them watch you do it and help you fix things and have them show you how it ought to look. Just a couple things... Yes, both arms need to be straight at the finish of the cut. No, your cut should not end up parallel(meaning flat like this: ---- ) to the floor(You're striking men, remember?), and no the shinai shouldn't be rocking. To tell you more would be silly, because I can't teach you how to strike men online.

It would not be productive to your kendo. You won't even understand this bit very well anyway, for the most part, until you get a sempai/sensei to help you in person.

It'll take a while to figure out how to do men consistently and correctly much of the time. Rome wasn't built in a day, so don't expect yourself to get it all correct at once. It will all come together and make sense eventually. It's kind of like magic. It suddenly appears... And then a new bad habit shows up to fix.

hahaha! That's what makes kendo so challenging and fun!

Well, could you please unconfuse me about your kendo situation? Thanks!

Kaoru

**suneohair** · 10th March 2010, 03:05 PM

been meaning to ask quite the same question. after the instance of striking, would both your left and right arms be straight and parallel to the ground?

**Karaken** · 10th March 2010, 08:24 PM

Let's try this. Let's imagine you have a wet towel that is just about the length of shinai handle in your hands. Your mission is not to get wet but to spray maximum water on your opponent's head. The idea is maintaining soft arms during the upswing and gradually squeeze the towel on the way down and reach the maximum squeeze at the time of impact. Does it make sense to you? ( BTW, I totally agree with Kaoru, you'd have no idea if you have noone to watch over you if you are doing this totally wrong )

**batusai.** · 10th March 2010, 08:26 PM

@ suneohair - The right hand should be just about parallel to the ground, not necessarily perfect parallel, but almost as far as I can recall during our last training.

**Cuzenu** · 10th March 2010, 08:42 PM

Well, I live in St. Louis and just joined the dojo there, but I will e attending the UofA this coming fall, so I wondering anybody happened to be nearby. The nearest dojo is 3 hours away in Little Rock and I won't have a car so I'm not sure there is any way I will be able to attend any practices due to the distance.

**suneohair** · 10th March 2010, 08:59 PM

Originally Posted by batusai.

@ suneohair - The right hand should be just about parallel to the ground, not necessarily perfect parallel, but almost as far as I can recall during our last training.

im more concerned of how the left hand looks haha

**Big One** · 10th March 2010, 10:59 PM

The left hand should be straight out but not locking the elbow. After the strike, the two arms should be in the same position as the strike and you suriage through the opponent. Your arms and hands should be able to push the opponent a side. However, here is the million dollard answer:

Ask your Sensei.

**Shinsengumi77** · 11th March 2010, 12:40 AM

Even if you have joined a dojo, it's not recommended to start practicing at home unless your Sensei says you can. You said it's only been after one practice right? If you try now, you'll likely develop some pretty bad habits.

**Neil Gendzwill** · 11th March 2010, 12:57 AM

I can give you every detail by text description and I guarantee you will still get it wrong right now. Wait for your next class.

**Kaoru** · 11th March 2010, 04:22 AM

Originally Posted by batusai.

@ suneohair - The right hand should be just about parallel to the ground, not necessarily perfect parallel, but almost as far as I can recall during our last training.

If your right hand was exactly parallel to the ground, you would be striking too low, so you are right about it not being exactly parallel. The arms-both arms, will be at slightly different angles to the ground. The right will be less parallel and more of a slight angle because it's the hand on top when you are hitting men, which is at head level or higher, depending on the height of the person you are hitting. If it is yourself in doing suburi, you ought to be cutting at your own head height. The left arm will be more parallel to the ground than the right, because it is the bottom hand. But then, it is always MUCH better to actually see this in action in the dojo!

Talking about it here is rather difficult... We can't see each other for it all to completely make good sense. And, as someone already said, we each have different opinions on this, so we could get into a nice tangle over this. There are too many little details involved in learning to strike men correctly.

Kaoru

**Kaoru** · 11th March 2010, 04:30 AM

Originally Posted by Cuzenu

Well, I live in St. Louis and just joined the dojo there, but I will e attending the UofA this coming fall, so I wondering anybody happened to be nearby. The nearest dojo is 3 hours away in Little Rock and I won't have a car so I'm not sure there is any way I will be able to attend any practices due to the distance.

Ahhhh... Well, that makes sense now! Thank you very much. I hope you are enjoying it!

Well, please go to the thread you put up in the dojo section. I put contact info there for you. If you don't read it, you will never get anywhere in getting something going at the University. And, if you don't read it, I'll be really miffed because I spent the time trying to help you out, and get you info on who ran the club and where the guy is now, and his current contact info. Go look please. I think it may help you. You could at least call the guy and see what he has to say.

As far as I found, nobody is near you except the Little Rock dojo. I did try.

Kaoru

**Neil Gendzwill** · 11th March 2010, 04:32 AM

Originally Posted by Kaoru

If your right hand was exactly parallel to the ground, you would be striking too low, so you are right about it not being exactly parallel.

Actually for most people, right arm parallel to the ground (right hand exactly shoulder height) results in a cut that is a little too high, if they are facing someone of their own height. Right hand a little below the shoulder, left hand about sternum height is the rule of thumb we use. Of course you have to adjust depending on the height of your opponent.

**Kaoru** · 11th March 2010, 05:39 AM

Originally Posted by Neil Gendzwill

Actually for most people, right arm parallel to the ground (right hand exactly shoulder height) results in a cut that is a little too high, if they are facing someone of their own height. Right hand a little below the shoulder, left hand about sternum height is the rule of thumb we use. Of course you have to adjust depending on the height of your opponent.

Ok, I just tried this out. I see exactly what you mean. Thanks!

I must have been thinking the shinai would flatten out or something strange like that, but no idea why, since that's ridiculous. Well, I have a horrible cold right now, so it must be making my mind a puddle or something.

I was told the right hand should be where the heart is. That's the same thing you just said, isn't it? Just want to clarify. Thanks!

Kaoru