miyamoto's technique

[umoa]

is there a school that teaches his two sword technique? and is it allowed in competitions?

[Legio]

The technique is called Nito-ryu and it can be used in shiai (competition) but it is usually taught to higher ranking/level kenshis (at least 3rd or 4th dan if I'm not mistaken). I haven't heard of anyone teaching this style as soon as one takes Kendo. It is also difficult to find senseis here in North America which teaches this technique. Here in Toronto, the only sensei I know which uses this style is Matthew Raymond sensei at the University of Toronto Kendo Club and I think he learned Nito in Osaka. Search the threads, I think this question has come up before.

[rainmaker]

Even though, Miyamoto Musashi developed Nito-ryu technique, he never used this in his actual life threatening competition, (60 competition and won all of them). Even in the actual Kendo shiai, I have never seen Nito-ryu student win any competition..... It is very cool and catch everyone's eye. I have seen this guy with Nito get his ass kicked by another female kendoka.. She kicked his butt within 1 min....

[Kote-Men]

There is a common misconception that two swords are better than one.

Nito uses two swords, shoto and daito *spelling?*. Anyway shoto is the shorter of the two and cannot be used to strike an opponent. I have rarely seen nito played and even more rarely, win.

Nito is not somthing you can learn first, do kendo for a considerably long time before trying to learn nito.

Musashi invented nito but never used it.

I believe that nito isn't taught in the United States.

[Kote-Men]

you can see some nito on this site.

Downloads- you can see Toda Sensei's nito-ryu

[Hyaku]

is there a school that teaches his two sword technique? and is it allowed in competitions?

Yes there is. No, we don't do competition only embu.

[Hyaku]

To add a little: There seems to be an ever increasing connection being made with "Nito Kendo" and Musashi. This is clear misrepresention. His philosophy bears no relationship to the concept of Kendo. The whole thing, stance, grip, cutting action, stopping action, use of the muscles bears little resemblance to kendo. On the contrary one has to spend hour upon hour trying to separate the two, not incorperate them together

Few people will ever be in a position to find out how effective nito is. Although it is done for demonstrations it is not generaly taught in an open dojo. No misconception about what is better. Just an integral part of a weapons system. Even harder is the use of a short weapon with one hand.

How can you possibly do competition and mix the two? Using Musashi's technique with each bout one person would be admitted to hospital. No armour, strong thrusts up and under the chin. Sweeping cuts into the neck and cuts to the head that stop less than an inch from the floor. The whole concept is rediculous.

What I would advise that relates to both any Nito either Kendo or Kenjutsu is: You can spend around thirty years, perhaps your whole life time developing a strong kensen with one weapon. Then someone comes along and gives you two weapons? It's a new start. Most of us humans stick to one.

We can only hope to brush with the ability and power this man had but can surely try and practice his philosophy.

[Zaphiel]

(at least 3rd or 4th dan if I'm not mistaken).

5th dan....and this will take you a while!
and not every nitoka get' kicked in his/her backside......real good nitokas kick most of the other butts.

[taganahan]

you can't serve two masters at the same time....

~taganahan

[mystic_kendoka]

im sure there is some MCdojo out there tht teaches nito the moment u come in...

[Twobitmage]

Actually there's a koryu that teaches (hyoho) nitten ichi ryu.

Its a kenjutsu style based roughly on what was taught to musashi's head students/adopted children, and was passed down through the years. Of course though, like all koryu it's very hard to find a legit school outside japan. And with a style like this it's even HARDER to find

[Musha]

As I think Hyaku said there are two types of Two sword styles.

Nito ryu: Said to develop from Horseback fighting batou jutsu and art of taiko drumming. The Shouto is used to keep centre, and protect open arias that are more profound in Nito kendo. You use a normal Shinai with shorter tsuka and 1/4 size shinai for Shouto. It is widely used in competitions and there seems to be few rules and defined techniques. I guess some high ranking Kendo-ka find it passed down from other sensei or kendo-ka and use the kendo elements to perfect there techniques.

There is one very good Japanese language book called:
二刀流技と理論 nito waza to riron, Nito techniques and theory.

And a video by the mentioned Canadian Nito fencer.

Niten ichi ryu:

Is the school formed by Miyamoto musashi. It is a Koryu old style kenjyutsu? using slim light weight bokken to help long suburi practice for long periods. I have heard that the art mostly consists of one sword techniques and two later on in the kata.

I tried for afew months and found I could control the two shinai to some extent. Though after seeing and talking to one Sensei, Gavin Thriepland I found I needed to be much better to use them proficiently. And also put alot more effort in to one sword kendo first. One problem learning an art on your own is. When you actually see or train under some one who knows what they are doing you know you are usually wrong .

[Twobitmage]

you are right that there are 2 branches of nitten, but both are kenjutsu

nito ryu is the kendo version of the original style(s)

[Nanbanjin]

is there a school that teaches his two sword technique? and is it allowed in competitions?

There is one in Japan...

http://www.hakudoh.com/musasi/

Even if you don't understand Japanese it might be worth looking around at some of the images.

If you speak Japanese and are interested in Nitoh, the following thread from Ichinikai is a must see.

二刀流の破り方

The thread has 185 posts!

[Hyaku]

you are right that there are 2 branches of nitten, but both are kenjutsu

nito ryu is the kendo version of the original style(s)

No you are wrong. There is only one recognized line although in the past students have gone off to form their own groups. There are no branches, just students. Nippon Budokan can supply you with this clear fact.

Nito Kendo is NOT a Kendo version of the Niten (Not Nitten) Ichiryu. I walked through my last Kendo/Iaido shodan shiken sixteen years ago before concentrating more on Kobudo/Battojutsu. I continue to teach Kendo but for my own practice wished to do something more realistic. As I have mentioned before it would be almost impossible to bastardize the techniques of the ryu without turning it into something that in no way resembled the original.

I am now one of the senior representatives of the ryu here in Japan. In this I feel bound to support the position of Soke with simple facts rather than something I read on the net. We really wish to distance ourselves as far away as possible from any purported connection. Anyone stepping over this line and using the name of the ryu to promote their own thing is stepping into a legal situation.

I should also add that Soke is also a ninety year old Kendo teacher. Never once have I seen him pick up two shinai.

My front page spells it out. The concept and ideal of Kendo is not the same as Niten Ichiryu. Even the ZNKR knows that!