Kumdo vs. Kendo

[Kozushi]

I trained hard in Kumdo in Korea for a year (every morning from 6-7:15 am). It is EXACTLY the same as Kendo here in Canada except for two things:
1. They use Korean names for the target areas during keiko
2. They require aspiring shodans to learn the Bon-gook-gum-bup ancient solo Katana sword Kata that dates from the Shilla dynasty (1st millennium A.D.) and which was recorded in several printed books in the 18th Century.

By the way, everyone I knew in Korea who did Kumdo recognized that it is of course a Japanese-created sport, but they are all very cognizant of the role Korea played in introducing sword-smithing to Japan; so they feel (and I think they have a right to feel) that their nation had a role to play in the foundation of Kendo.
Kendo is CRAZY popular in Korea! You wouldn't expect it to be, with the expense of the equipment and all (although the price of new Bogu is coming down quite fast over there). Kendo is the 2nd most popular martial art over there!!! Taekwondo is first of course. Judo and Hapkido hover around the 3rd and 4th positions.
In casual conversations amongst the Kendo guys I hung out with, they called each other 'Samurai'. They wouldn't have done this if they thought that Kendo is primarily a Korean martial art.
By the way, the Japanese came from Korea during the 1st millennium A.D. anyways. They are all one family.

[airbag22]

Good post, I've definitely been noticing an anti-kumdo/korean trend going on in some peoples posts and its nice to have things put into a bit of perspective

[Nazo]

I trained hard in Kumdo in Korea for a year (every morning from 6-7:15 am). It is EXACTLY the same as Kendo here in Canada except for two things:
1. They use Korean names for the target areas during keiko
2. They require aspiring shodans to learn the Bon-gook-gum-bup ancient solo Katana sword Kata that dates from the Shilla dynasty (1st millennium A.D.) and which was recorded in several printed books in the 18th Century.

By the way, everyone I knew in Korea who did Kumdo recognized that it is of course a Japanese-created sport, but they are all very cognizant of the role Korea played in introducing sword-smithing to Japan; so they feel (and I think they have a right to feel) that their nation had a role to play in the foundation of Kendo.
Kendo is CRAZY popular in Korea! You wouldn't expect it to be, with the expense of the equipment and all (although the price of new Bogu is coming down quite fast over there). Kendo is the 2nd most popular martial art over there!!! Taekwondo is first of course. Judo and Hapkido hover around the 3rd and 4th positions.
In casual conversations amongst the Kendo guys I hung out with, they called each other 'Samurai'. They wouldn't have done this if they thought that Kendo is primarily a Korean martial art.
By the way, the Japanese came from Korea during the 1st millennium A.D. anyways. They are all one family.

nice post, although your title for your thread is quite misleading(...well for me it is). I agree on somethings you've said especially korea playing a role in the development of kendo, however the japanese did not originate or come from korea....., besides koreans are of mongolian descent, the japanese are of chinese descent.

[Taek]

Yes, that was a nice thread. I'm korean and played Kumdo before but I still learnt so many new things about Kumdo from this Kozushi San's thread. I'm currently playing kendo but one thing I realised from playing both forms....regardless which one we play, we are all trying to achieve the same thing at the end.

[taiwnezboi]

nice post, although your title for your thread is quite misleading(...well for me it is). I agree on somethings you've said especially korea playing a role in the development of kendo, however the japanese did not originate or come from korea....., besides koreans are of mongolian descent, the japanese are of chinese descent.

I thought Koreans and Japanese were both from China?

[KHuang]

I think they should change to kumdo-world.com.

[Kozushi]

The Japanese came fron Korea, not China. However, they mixed with the native Ainu people, even when they were killing them off, so there is a great deal of Ainu culture preserved in Japan that makes Japan distinct from Korea.

I came across a few interesting anecdotes today while reading the Muye Dobo Tongji. This book of martial arts was written in 18th Century Korea by the King's scholars. It states that Japanese swords are 'miraculous', and that Japanese swordsmen are invincible. I should add that the book includes several Japanese sword kata. You see, even back then, Koreans didn't pretend to have anything over the Japanese in swordsmanship.
Now, archery is a different matter: the Koreans seem to have considered themselves the best in the world at it. Mind you, back in Shilla times, when Korea was in a constant state of war, I'm sure there were many highly skilled swordsmen.
For the Korean warriors versus Japanese samurai, read "Samurai Invasion: Japan's Korean War 1592-1598" by Stephen Turnbull.

[Nazo]

The Japanese came fron Korea, not China. However, they mixed with the native Ainu people, even when they were killing them off, so there is a great deal of Ainu culture preserved in Japan that makes Japan distinct from Korea.

I came across a few interesting anecdotes today while reading the Muye Dobo Tongji. This book of martial arts was written in 18th Century Korea by the King's scholars. It states that Japanese swords are 'miraculous', and that Japanese swordsmen are invincible. I should add that the book includes several Japanese sword kata. You see, even back then, Koreans didn't pretend to have anything over the Japanese in swordsmanship.
Now, archery is a different matter: the Koreans seem to have considered themselves the best in the world at it. Mind you, back in Shilla times, when Korea was in a constant state of war, I'm sure there were many highly skilled swordsmen.
For the Korean warriors versus Japanese samurai, read "Samurai Invasion: Japan's Korean War 1592-1598" by Stephen Turnbull.

Hey Kozushi I hope we dont have to get into a long debate on about your
say on the japanese orginating from Korea.--so Peace! I'm sure and undoubtedly the people of china and japan and korea long before and up until now have some of their country men and women mix and cross-breed/ing with each other.....,and since they are neighboring countries to each other, they have had cultural & technology exchanges and ...etc..etc..and also undeniably both Korea and Japan have strong ties to China, one good example is the chinese characters used by all 3 countries is one major aspect that proves this. There are so "little real or accurate records" on histories of korea, written or translated in english, heck there are even language books for korean to english that are not sooo accurate. So unless you can read and write hangul like me, there's bigger chances you are being misled by some edited twists in history (sadly)like most people (unknowingly, too). Plus, fortunately I've access to some old records of korean history(in korean), I'm also well aware of the old kingdoms of Shilla(as you've mentioned), Baek-je and Koguryo, means your not the only one doing (extensive??!)research. Also have you ever sat in a korean history class in Korea?! If so then you wouldnt have any thoughts on japanese having come from korea, Koreans orginated from Mongolian Descent, japanese are not of mongolian descent. Its funny cause all the korean nationals I know who ofcourse studied their own history acknowledge that they are of Mongolian descent....ask any (knowledgeable in history)Japanese if they are of Mongolian descent or worse Korean descent..see what answer you'll get,
I doubt you'll get your desired answer of the one favoring your side of the story....also that goes for most japanese people including all my japanese senseis in kendo and judo, tell or ask them and they'd tell you off man, honestly!

There's also a study on japanese having come from Sichuan(chongqing) a place in CHINA(NOT KOREA), cause thier local people
there have always had japanese like features, even the sharp nose attribute that the japanese have and thats not common in
other asian races. The most ethnic koreans dont have this feature.

So the japanese did not come from korea (/or vice versa). Maybe you can technically saythat the japanese came from korea.....by meaning that the "japanese people crossed (by travelling) the korean penninsula from china to get to Japan", ---and thats not being sarcastic(but take it as
you want it, c'est comme vous-voulez!).

P.S. I also have and read - Samurai Invasion: Japan's Korean War 1592-1598" by Stephen Turnbull. ^^

[Kingofmyrrh]

There are of course a number of theories about who came from where, but the most widely accepted is that modern japanese people are descendants of korean immigrants. The jomon people (thought to be predecessors to the ainu) were the indigineous race, but people from the continent (yayoi) pushed them to the north. If you look at artifacts from the time that the yayoi were though to have arrived, there are various pieces of evidence that they came from the korean peninsula. One example is that from around 500(ish)AD, pottery in kyushu and western honshu began to be produced with the same techniques and markings that had been used in korea for many generations previously.
There are other theories, such as kebaron (horse rider theory), which I quite like although acknowledge as pretty unlikely, but most historians appear to believe that the yayoi, the most significant ancestors of the modern japanese people, were of korean descent.

[Kozushi]

Hey Kozushi I hope we dont have to get into a long debate on about your
say on the japanese orginating from Korea.--so Peace! I'm sure and undoubtedly the people of china and japan and korea long before and up until now have some of their country men and women mix and cross-breed/ing with each other.....,and since they are neighboring countries to each other, they have had cultural & technology exchanges and ...etc..etc..and also undeniably both Korea and Japan have strong ties to China, one good example is the chinese characters used by all 3 countries is one major aspect that proves this. There are so "little real or accurate records" on histories of korea, written or translated in english, heck there are even language books for korean to english that are not sooo accurate. So unless you can read and write hangul like me, there's bigger chances you are being misled by some edited twists in history (sadly)like most people (unknowingly, too). Plus, fortunately I've access to some old records of korean history(in korean), I'm also well aware of the old kingdoms of Shilla(as you've mentioned), Baek-je and Koguryo, means your not the only one doing (extensive??!)research. Also have you ever sat in a korean history class in Korea?! If so then you wouldnt have any thoughts on japanese having come from korea, Koreans orginated from Mongolian Descent, japanese are not of mongolian descent. Its funny cause all the korean nationals I know who ofcourse studied their own history acknowledge that they are of Mongolian descent....ask any (knowledgeable in history)Japanese if they are of Mongolian descent or worse Korean descent..see what answer you'll get,
I doubt you'll get your desired answer of the one favoring your side of the story....also that goes for most japanese people including all my japanese senseis in kendo and judo, tell or ask them and they'd tell you off man, honestly!

There's also a study on japanese having come from Sichuan(chongqing) a place in CHINA(NOT KOREA), cause thier local people
there have always had japanese like features, even the sharp nose attribute that the japanese have and thats not common in
other asian races. The most ethnic koreans dont have this feature.

So the japanese did not come from korea (/or vice versa). Maybe you can technically saythat the japanese came from korea.....by meaning that the "japanese people crossed (by travelling) the korean penninsula from china to get to Japan", ---and thats not being sarcastic(but take it as
you want it, c'est comme vous-voulez!).

P.S. I also have and read - Samurai Invasion: Japan's Korean War 1592-1598" by Stephen Turnbull. ^^

I read and speak Korean too.
The Japanese did indeed come from Korea.

[kendokamax]

I was told that japanese emperor familly came from korea -

freak teacher at IBU used to talk about it all the time, blablabla

[Kozushi]

Japanese and Korean languages are both very closely related to Mongolian, and also related to Finnish and Turkish. They are part of the Ural-Altaic family of languages.
It is a very well establish fact that the Japanese came from Korea.

[Kirin]

Kozushi,
Maybe you should complain CKF and have them change history of kendo section on their website.
Including your governing organization, 97.72% of IKF members acknowledge that kendo was originated from Japan. (IKF has 44 affiliated countries)


This topic is sooo old......

[Nazo]

hey hold on now Kirin,
Kozushi actually does acknowledge that kendo originated from japan,
you should read his topic carefully at the start of this thread. (just he
has the wrong choice of subject title for his thread, quite misleading yes..)

unfortunately having stayed in korea for some time has earned him a biased point of view (siding on koreans) of the origination of japanese coming from korea.But I guess in this point of view people could very well say that kendo was invented by koreans since japanese are of korean descent as Kozushi here states in his posts???!!!

as for Kozushi, ural-altaic etc.etc(yes it exists but a category invented by who?).....you think too much in western(maybe a bit of korean but surely biased) sense while trying to understand or study ASIAN histories.
I suggest you dig up resources from chinese books/materials also (afterall they are a lot older than korean resources).

So once again japanese are of chinese descent.

[Nanbanjin]

hey hold on now Kirin,
Kozushi actually does acknowledge that kendo originated from japan,
you should read his topic carefully at the start of this thread. (just he
has the wrong choice of subject title for his thread, quite misleading yes..)

unfortunately having stayed in korea for some time has earned him a biased point of view (siding on koreans) of the origination of japanese coming from korea.But I guess in this point of view people could very well say that kendo was invented by koreans since japanese are of korean descent as Kozushi here states in his posts???!!!

as for Kozushi, ural-altaic etc.etc(yes it exists but a category invented by who?).....you think too much in western(maybe a bit of korean but surely biased) sense while trying to understand or study ASIAN histories.
I suggest you dig up resources from chinese books/materials also (afterall they are a lot older than korean resources).

So once again japanese are of chinese descent.

Somebody please wake me up when this is over...

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