Titanium men worth the extra cost?

[spromtet]

I'm looking at buying my first bogu set, and I was wondering if getting a titanium men is worth the extra cost.

Is titanium lighter and stronger? e-bogu has a superlight line of bogu that looks good, but it's not titanium. I don't mind paying extra for the best combination of protection and weight.

I want the best protection possible since I'm prone to seeing stars after a medium hit (not from kendo, but from other activities, like a header from a cornerkick). I haven't put on bogu yet since I'm still new so I'm a bit concerned about making sure I leave the dojo with all the IQ I walked in with.

[Flylkorean]

I'm looking at buying my first bogu set, and I was wondering if getting a titanium men is worth the extra cost.

Is titanium lighter and stronger? e-bogu has a superlight line of bogu that looks good, but it's not titanium. I don't mind paying extra for the best combination of protection and weight.

I want the best protection possible since I'm prone to seeing stars after a medium hit (not from kendo, but from other activities, like a header from a cornerkick). I haven't put on bogu yet since I'm still new so I'm a bit concerned about making sure I leave the dojo with all the IQ I walked in with.

Hi ,

I believe that titanium mengane should be more heavier. Since its still your first bogu set, and you'll be looking for something better in a couple years, I suggest you dont spend that much money. Since you have e-bogu in mind, go visit their warehouse ( assuming you live close to them), and ask them what they reccomend for your first bogu set. ( they will probabbly show you the best expensive stuff, since they're salesmen ). I wouldnt go any farther then a 3mm set. Also , they will give you discounts if you belong to a certain dojo in the area. If you tell me your dojo , I can tell you right now at the top of my head if its on the list

[Akirus]

Atomiclly (sp?) titanium is lighter than steel, stronger too. My guess is it would be lighter and stronger then a normal men.

[Flylkorean]

Atomiclly (sp?) titanium is lighter than steel, stronger too. My guess is it would be lighter and stronger then a normal men.

Steel men?!?!? now that would make you have no neck ! xD . But sorry I should have been more clear. I was comparing it to an aluminum allow mengane. Titanium should be more heavier then aluminum.

[spromtet]

Thank you for the quick response!

I'm planning on driving to LA to visit the store so I can try everything on and make sure the fit is correct. I'm surprised there's not a good bogu shop in norcal!

Knowing as much as possible about the bogu is important, and the forums have been quite helpful. Someone mentioned regretting buying the 2MM set over the 5/2.5 or 3 MM set.

Usually, with any equipment, it's usually better to get the best possible. With things like rollerblades and tennis rackets, the more expensive equipment will improve the overall experience through noticeable performance.

I spoke to another member and our dojo (Mountain View, CA) has a good relationship with e-bogu for discounts.

[Neil Gendzwill]

Atomiclly (sp?) titanium is lighter than steel, stronger too. My guess is it would be lighter and stronger then a normal men.

Your guess would be half-wrong - they're heavier and stronger. Normal men aren't steel, they're an aluminum alloy. The titanium mengane is about 100g heavier. One reason people buy them because they're stronger, but I suspect many buy them just because titanium is cool.

[Akirus]

Here, I did a bit of research:

• Name: titanium
• Symbol: Ti
• Atomic number: 22
• Atomic weight: 47.867 (1)

• Name: iron
• Symbol: Fe
• Atomic number: 26
• Atomic weight: 55.845

+

• Name: carbon
• Symbol: C
• Atomic number: 6
• Atomic weight: 12.0107

So Titanium is 47.8 and Steel (iron and carbon) is about 67.8, Now Steel is no where near a 50-50 mix of iron and carbon so realistically it would be about 57-59 at 1% C

[Akirus]

Your guess would be half-wrong - they're heavier and stronger. Normal men aren't steel, they're an aluminum alloy. The titanium mengane is about 100g heavier. One reason people buy them because they're stronger, but I suspect many buy them just because titanium is cool.

Ahh ok, I was under the impression they were Steel, aluminum would seem flimsy to me in a small bar like that, but I guess if alloyed correctly it would be ok.

So spromtet, Yes titanium is much MUCH stronger than aluminum in anyway it's alloyed...someone could throw a cinder block at your men and it wouldn't bend the mengane.

[Halcyon]

So Titanium is 47.8 and Steel (iron and carbon) is about 67.8, Now Steel is no where near a 50-50 mix of iron and carbon so realistically it would be about 57-59 at 1% C

Titanium is rarely used in it's pure form, which is actually quite soft. For practical purposes, it's used as an alloy with aluminum. The other aluminum alloy often used for mengane is duralumin, which is an alloy with copper. So even if they say titanium, they're not talking about the pure metal. Titanium alloy is stronger than duralumin, but also a bit heavier. Use the search function for titanium and duralumin. Lots of previous discussion on this topic.

[samurai999]

Titanium (or titanium alloys) should weigh more than the Al alloy they use they use on a regular mengane since titanium is more dense than Al or Al alloys. It is used in many high impact applications due to their strength and durability. (though it tends to be brittle in failure, ie it snaps)

But as for feel, Ti mengane (IBB) should feel lighter. Why? I saw a brochure where it described where the CG of the mengane is. The CG (center of gravity) is almost right over the spine if you wear the men right. What does this do? It gives the feeling of it being light because if the CG is further away from the spine, your muscles have to compensate for the moments and forces produced from the fact that the mengane is not being supported by your spine but by your muscles...

My 0.02$(US),
Tim

EDIT - It is expensive, but i think it is worth getting. make sure it is IBB though.

[Flylkorean]

Titanium should weigh more than the Al alloy they use they use on a regular mengane since titanium is more dense than Al or Al alloys. It is used in many high impact applications due to their strength and durability. (though it tends to be brittle in failure, ie it snaps)

But as for feel, Ti mengane (IBB) should feel lighter. Why? I saw a brochure where it described where the CG of the mengane is. The CG (center of gravity) is almost right over the spine if you wear the men right. What does this do? It gives the feeling of it being light because if the CG is further away from the spine, your muscles have to compensate for the moments and forces produced from the fact that the mengane is not being supported by your spine but by your muscles...

My 0.02$(US),
Tim

According to Hai_hai , His men is " heavy" and his is IBB men .

[samurai999]

According to Hai_hai , His men is " heavy" and his is IBB men .

Re-read my post, it is supposed to be heavier.

Tim

[LarsCW]

I got this from the Chiba Bogu website http://www.chibabogu.com/

There are essentially four types of men-gane, the metal-grill that protects the face: Duraluminum; the Standard All-Titanium; the IBB All-Titanium; and the Hasegawa company’s “Mujun Men.”



As well as the differences in materials and construction, men-gane are also made in various sizes. Children and small adult men-gane are available with 12 or 13 horizontal bars; standard adult men-gane employ 14 horizontal bars; another special long & wide 14 bar variation is also available for larger kenshi; and for those with long measurement (top-back of head to point of chin) of 73 centimeters or longer, a special 15 bar men-gane is available.



At first glance we can see that there are only a limited number of men-gane sizes to fit the broad range of people. The difference in fit, and positioning of the “monomi” the wide slot which one looks through, are determined at the time of construction, and are dependant on the skill and expertise of the craftsperson who constructs the men. For this reason experienced kenshi take advantage of having their men custom-made.



Duraluminum: Made of an Aluminum-alloy, this it the lightest and least expensive of the all-metal options. It is recommended for children and lighter kenshi, or for those who engage only occasional practice. The lighter weight makes it comfortable to wear; however, a heavy schedule of practice exposing the men to lots of collisions, and long exposure to sweat may eventually weaken the attachment points of the horizontal bars. In such cases, titanium men-gane are recommended.



Standard All-Titanium: Titanium is a lightweight metal with strength comparable to steel, making it an ideal material for the men-gane. This men-gane is recommended for adults engaging in regular practice, or any person performing at the national team level.



IBB All-Titanium: An all titanium construction in which the base-ring, center vertical spine, and horizontal bars are all thicker than the Standard All-Titanium men-gane. The greater thicknesses of the materials, and in particular, the greater cross-sectional area at the points where the parts are welded together, make this the strongest men-gane available. 100 gms heavier than the Standard model, we highly recommend this men for average and large adults, and any person performing at the national team level. Being heavier, smaller or thinner persons may find the Standard model more comfortable to wear.

[Tiki-kun]

Not to complicate things folks, but there are steel men out there. My "oldie but goodie" first men was chromed steel - evidenced by its weight, rust, and attraction to magnets! I just got a titanium men, and it is heftier than aluminium, but the balance is a great improvement over my old steel one. Why did I splurge for titanium? Liked the strength to weight ratio, the overall men construction was fantastic, and (ahem) it IS a cool metal....

[Alan Molstad]

Very interesting topic.